We all have time... let's see what happens. Reality is great at settling things
The record disappearing Artic, and the Atlantic Ocean in the New York subway pass you by in 2012? The record Australian heatwave?
'Lets see what happens' in 2013.
'1600 years of Ice melting in 25 years is a bad omen'
by designs 165 Replies latest social current
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besty
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steve2
Besty, my view has never changed - although I have always acknowledged the weight of scientific opinion is against me. I have long said that humankind are contributing to global warming (in the ways you rightly itemise) but that solar activity is also a huge factor in "climate change" that is rarely factored into the computer models.
On the subject of disagreeing with "experts": Human history is filled with examples of experts and their supporters denigrating "ignoramuses" for daring to question the then body of "expert" knowledge.
We have seen it most glaringly with religious "experts" with their dedicated detailed knowledge, experience and learning in their respective "scriptures" and who do not brook any disagreement whatsoever from the ignorant masses.
I would venture that "consensus" among humans is often "bolstered" by putdowns of what "non-experts" have the temerity and/or stupidity to believe and promote.
Funding, career-paths, including well paid positions, professional "reputations" and "standing" are as vulnerable to attack by one's peers in scientific communities as they are in religious and political communities.
The primary arguments, as I see them, have not been so much around denying global warming as daring to posit additional and/or alternate factors for the changes. And just as religious leaders are prone to declare, "It is urgent that you get right with [our] god before the end", we have not dissimilar urgency from the scientific community on the need to virtually just shut up and accept their expertise. The reactivity of many in scientific communities illustrates how easily humans can fall prey to impatience and disdain when (aspects of) their interpretations of data are questioned.
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cantleave
One thing is certain, the climate is changing. We are seeing the effects. There are many factors involved in this climate change and there is overwhelming evidence that one of these contrbuting factors is human economic activity.
The Earth will survive this, it has seen worse in it's history. It is the biodiversity of the planet that will be adversely affected. But hey! It's happened before. The surviors (which probably won't include Homo sapiens) will find niches to live, adapt and evolve and in a few million years there will be another dominant species. Let's hope that one isn't as stupid as us.
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besty
@steve2
I hear you, but I think you are wrong :-)
let me say why
You have written 6 paragraphs and only 1 phrase touches on science - "it might be the sun" to suggest that solar activity is rarely factored into models is ridiculous in the extreme. sorry. publish your paper, or at least elaborate on your thoughts.....
Plenty alternative alternative arguments on climate change are out there - the scientific method and the peer review process works.
And as yet nothing credible can stand the process.
Having said that, we are a sideshow - Mother Nature cares not for our theories and calculations - see melting Artic for details - 392ppm? so what....
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besty
There are many factors involved in this climate change and there is overwhelming evidence that one of these contrbuting factors is human economic activity.
There are many factors involved in this climate change and there is overwhelming evidence that one of these contrbuting human economic activity is the primary factor.
Fixed :-)
Man U v Man City beckons...
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cantleave
Not arguing with your fix Besty!
As for Man U v Man City.......
Saints are 11th !!!!!!
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kurtbethel
Those climate scientists believe their conclusions about the data. They are developing geoengineering programs to reverse the effects of human activity.
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StoneWall
Hmmmm anyone else having any problem with the link above that besty gave for the 98% ?
Everytime I click it it gives me this error:
Forbidden
You don't have permission to access /store/10.1029/2009EO030002/asset/eost16685.pdf on this server.
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tootired2care
Having said that, we are a sideshow - Mother Nature cares not for our theories and calculations.
Exactly, mother nature has always been cruel in her randomness. I think the only thing we can do is adapt with the earth -- it's not like homo-sapiens ever had a choice before. Even if we stopped all burning of fossil fuels right now, at some point mankind will have to deal with the earth changing and the melt of the ice -- because it's happend before without man, and it will happen again. I have no doubt that earth will redraw its land borders over time and reclaim coastal cities or bury inland cities, and there is nothing that we can do about that, except adapt. No doubt future technological breakthoughts will make dealing with earths changes easier.
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QC
@designs
You're right, we probably don't have time to fix this "ice melting." IMO, we are past the tipping point.
The world community refused to act. We have nothing but TIME to watch it unfold.
Reality will let us know who saw and understood in advance, the proper calculation of what the melting means.
It’s not JWs.
