Signs - Jesus - Has the Scripture Been Misread ?

by *lost* 55 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • Vanderhoven7
    Vanderhoven7

    Just to elaborate a little...and I'm not to sure of the sources of some of the marterial below...but some I derived from Marcellus Kik's book "Matthew 24" which was the eye-opener for me on this subject.

    30. AND THEN SHALL APPEAR THE SIGN OF THE SON OF
    MAN IN HEAVEN: AND THEN SHALL ALL THE TRIBES
    OF THE EARTH MOURN, AND THEY SHALL SEE THE SON
    OF MAN COMING IN THE CLOUDS OF HEAVEN WITH
    POWER AND GREAT GLORY. (See Jer.21:5 Is.19:1)

    Note that it is "the sign of the Son of Man in heaven", not the Son
    of man visiting the earth. At the destruction of Jerusalem, the sign
    or precursor to His coming to destroy was found in the fulfillment
    of these predicted calamities and finally the surrounding of
    Jerusalem by the Roman armies. Of course as these calamities and
    ultimate destruction, befell them, the tribes would mourn. The
    Jews were eventually left without temple, city, sacrifice or
    priesthood as was prophesied by Daniel.

    Mat 24:30 -

    Then shall appear the sign of the Son of man - The plain meaning of this is, that the destruction of Jerusalem will be such a remarkable instance of Divine vengeance, such a signal manifestation of Christ’s power and glory, that all the Jewish tribes shall mourn, and many will, in consequence of this manifestation of God, be led to acknowledge Christ and his religion. By της γης , of the land, in the text, is evidently meant here, as in several other places, the land of Judea and its tribes, either its then inhabitants, or the Jewish people wherever found.

    AND THEY SHALL SEE THE SON OF MAN COMING IN
    THE CLOUDS OF HEAVEN WITH POWER AND GREAT
    GLORY.

    Does the phrase "coming ( ε?´ρχομαι erchomai) in the clouds"
    necessarily refer to a personal coming to earth? We should not
    read that thought into the text. Is. 19:1 states "See the Lord rides
    on a swift cloud and is coming to Egypt: and the idols of Egypt
    shall be moved at His presence, and the heart of Egypt shall melt in
    the midst of it" Although this verse speaks of the Lord riding on a
    cloud and of His presence, we know that the Egyptians did not see
    the Lord in a personal and visible way. The expression is rather
    used to indicate a coming in judgment against Egypt. Jesus
    coming in the clouds against Israel thus refers to a similar kind of
    judgment.

    The clouds of heaven obscure or shut heaven from man's view.
    They were to see the Lord Jesus coming to judgment with power.
    This power was manifest in the destruction. The word glory refers
    to the visible display of his honor, power and majesty.

    That Jesus destroyed the city in 70 AD is accurate. As Daniel 9:27
    reveals; because of the over spreading of abominations, he, the
    Lord and Messiah himself would make it desolate (Titus
    merely being his instrument.) Confirmation is found in Jesus' exclusion parables.

    Mt.21: 40 When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh

    ( ε?´ρχομαι erchomai) , what will he do unto those husbandmen?

    41 They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked

    men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which

    shall render him the fruits in their seasons. See also Lu.20:15,16

    The timing on this is relevant this coming in vengeance, would climax the
    tribulation and occur in the lifespan of Christ's own generation.

    Mat 16:28 Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which

    shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming

    ( ε?´ρχομαι erchomai) in his kingdom. (Mt.10:23 Lu.9:27)

    Finally, in the often-overlooked trial scene in 26:64, Jesus says to the high priest that “ from now on you will see the son of man seated at the right hand of Power and coming on the clouds of heaven.”

    The key phrase in that last passage is “from now on”, which is about as close as Matthew comes to the outright investment of glory which John gives to the cross when he attests Jesus as saying things like “Now the son of man is glorified”, “Now is the judgment of this world; now will the ruler of this world be cast out”, and “When I am lifted up from the earth, I will draw all people to myself” (John 12:31, 32; 13:31). The conviction which both Matthew and John unambiguously express is that the exaltation of the son of man would be seen not merely at the end of history but also in the matrix of events unfolding from his messianic work in the middle of history.
  • mP
    mP

    Mat 24:30 -

    Then shall appear the sign of the Son of man - The plain meaning of this is, that the destruction of Jerusalem will be such a remarkable instance of Divine vengeance, such a signal manifestation of Christ’s power and glory, that all the Jewish tribes shall mourn, and many will, in consequence of this manifestation of God, be led to acknowledge Christ and his religion. By της γης , of the land, in the text, is evidently meant here, as in several other places, the land of Judea and its tribes, either its then inhabitants, or the Jewish people wherever found.

    AND THEY SHALL SEE THE SON OF MAN COMING IN
    THE CLOUDS OF HEAVEN WITH POWER AND GREAT
    GLORY.

    mP:

    How is this notTitus son of the god vespasian ?

  • *lost*
    *lost*

    V 7

    It's great to have the info out there for discussion, your a great help.

    BOH hi to NE much love

    Mt 24;3

    And then, at last, the sign that he Son of Man is coming will appear in the heavens

    and there will be deep mourning among all the peoples of the earth.

    and they WILL see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory

    Mt 16;7

    For the son of Man is going to come in his Father's glory, with his angels, and THEN he will reward each person according to what they have done.

    Mt 24;3

    as Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately.

    '' Tell us'', they said. '' When will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age? ( end of the world )

    Rev 1;7 .... look, he is coming with the clouds ... every eye will see him .... all peoples will mourn.

    All the people on the earthe will cry in agony when they see.

    The sign - THE EVIDENCE

    Rev; The cause of their wailing at the day of judgement .... they rejected the Saviour .... they deserve the condemnation that is coming....

    The Clouds of Heaven - not the clouds in Heaven. BUT- the clouds that appear to shut heaven, or the sky from our view.

    With Power.

    Power manifest by consuming the material world

    by raising the dead

    by changing those who may be alive when he shall come - that is - making their bodies like those who have died, and who have been raised up,

    by bringing the affairs of the world to a close,

    receiving the righteous to heaven,

    and sending the wicked, however numerous, however strong, down to hell.

    What, in fact, is the day of judgement to the whole world, .... but the day of death to everyone ?

    NO BODY DEFINITELY KNOWS.

    But it happens after the Tribulation.

  • Newly Enlightened
    Newly Enlightened

    Just a side thought.

    Josephus wrote that at the time of Jerusalem's destruction there were what looked like Soldier's riding in chariots & horses coming from the clouds. And the sun & moon were darkened and could not be seen because of the rising smoke from the destroyed city.

  • Vanderhoven7
    Vanderhoven7

    N.E. Just a side thought. Josephus wrote that at the time of Jerusalem's destruction there were what looked like Soldier's riding in chariots & horses coming from the clouds. And the sun & moon were darkened and could not be seen because of the rising smoke from the destroyed city.

    Interesting N.E.; I'd like to get the reference for this. :^)

  • mP
    mP

    And Josephus said that Titus or was it Vespasian was the Messiah the jews were waiting for. Its there on wiki with further links.

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