Protecting pedophiles while protecting children (page 13)

lost

The abuser was female, big difference between a male abuser and a female abuser, maybe you should have been clear on that in you initial post.

stillin

Lost: you have recommended the death penalty, end of problem, for all sex offenders (or was it just pedophiles?) would that include women? Is it that big of a difference?

to be clear, my comments have sometimes been tinged with sarcasm and hyperbole in an effort to make one point or another. I can see that it has not worked we'll with some in this thread and I will be more clear about my actual thoughts in the future. It is my way of attempting to point out the end result of certain rationalizings.

lost

still in, I made it perfectly clear, paedophiles, who are responsible for heinous crimes against children, should be put to death.

everyone (adult) knows, unequivocably that is is reprehensible to commit these acts against children, who are unable to defend themselves.

More so in the case of so-called pretend chrsitians, who have a direct commandment from God.

stillin

Lost, you seem like you are mad about something.

So, what is so different about women who abuse from men?

jhine

stillin I agree , Lost you do seem to have personal issues with this , other than the women protecting children natural reaction which I do fully understand .

lost

no I don't have any personal issues with this.

so give up on the amauter psuchology.

my opinion is as stated, simple. the words mean what they mean.

People who profess to be 'Christians' like jws, Catholics etc have been responsible for much suffering inflicted on people. Not just children.

Is it not 'people' we are supposed to care about ?

Perhaps you choose to ignore the effects it has on peoples lives, the actual victim. I'm not for white-washing, covering up, or protecting.

Is there something wrong with that stance ? If more people had courage, instead of cowardice, and didn't cover things up, there would be less suffering.

Are we going to list every form of abuse by every gender and age group and every scenario and cherry pick which we personally deem to be less than the other and discuss each one independently ?

Making broad sweeping generalisations, doesn't cut it, neither does omitting information under a pretence to draw memebers into a deliberate inflamed conversation.

Women, yes they abuse chlidren, been a few stories of it in the press, happened in a day care nursery. Yes, in my opinion, those kinds of sex offenders to children should also be put to death.

do you have a problem with my opinion ?

do you take the jehovist stance of covering up, hiding, ignoring, forgiving ?

stillin

Being unforgiving of things puts you on a slippery slope, lost. Advocating capital punishment is probably way over the edge, here. "Heinous" crimes disgust me as well as they do you and society should be as safe as possible from any repeat of a heinous crime.

But I disagree that covering up is the wrong thing to do in all cases, once a transgression has been established. You can try to taint forgiveness as "jehovist" but forgiveness is one of mankind's higher capacities. Can't we agree that "informed, cautious optimism" could work in SOME cases?

If we weren't talking about child abuse and the discussion had begun with something slightly less emotional, say, running over your neighbor's dog and not taking responsibility, would you ever see the circumstance when covering up actually would be the thing to do?

Again, I realize that there is still plenty of room for the WTS to improve their own ways, but I'm just wondering if any balance can be found. "Kill 'em all" just doesn't do it for me.

DogGone

Lost,

My initial post was about recidivism rates. I have no idea why I should have been clear about the gender of someone who abused members of my family. It did not come up until later when Jhine and I were having a thoughtful conversation about whether abusers can truly be reformed. I don't really think you believe that it makes a difference if it is a female who sexually abused my siblings. So, I'm going to leave that comment alone.

I'm not sure who you are accusing of making broad generalizations. Stillin and I, among others, have actually been arguing against broad generalizations.

Are you angry at Stillin and I because you feel we are defending the WTS and other religious organizations? I took Stillin's entire thread to be a question about what is the correct balance. What should and should not be done in these aweful situations. Things like the relationship of the victim, the duration, the age of the abuser, the age of the abused all are factors, in my mind, that should be taken into consideration. I also think the discussion should extend beyond sexual abuse to emotional and physical abuse. Is your stance the same for the emotional and physical abuse of a youth?

It's true, I have argued against the (mistaken) view that the law requires the WTS to report in all cases in all jurisdictions (it doesn't). That’s why they call the headquarters for legal advice. I even pointed out the distinction between States which have a confessional exemption (almost all States) and those with a broad Clergy exemption (over half). That distinction is largely lost.

Facts matter.

I don’t agree with your opinion or rhetoric. But, that is entirely OK. We are not in a cult anymore and can actually have wildly different views on things.

lost

Angry ? lol. that is a big assumption.

You assume because my opinion is that heinous paedophiles should be eliminated from society, thus making it safer and protecting children, sparing them from 'loss'', that I am angry with you personally ? that doesn't even make sense.

Why should society protect the perp rather than the victim ?

Comparing a dog getting run over to children being raped and buggered and tortured by men?

You seem to have different levels of accountability.

I am being specific in my opinion, as I have stated, there is no confusion, I will state it again, just to be clear.

My personal opion is that adult paedo's who commit heinous crimes against children, should receive the death penalty.

Forgive ? by what standards are we using the yardstick here on forgiveness ?

Being a so-called Christian ?

Being a jehovist ?

Where does the concept of forgiveness come ?

Jw's disfellowship and shun people for questioning the GB and it's teachings, but if it is child abuse, they cover it up.

Catholics the same.

No surprise there, it happens all the time in society.

Does that make it right or is it wrong.

jgnat

My big question is, does the death penalty eliminate the problem? Say for murderers. If all murderers were executed, would our society be free of murderers?

Not to say that there is no use for penalties such as incarceration.

But it's not the cure.

What is the cure?

Protecting pedophiles while protecting children

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