Article: It's Time to Outlaw Extreme Shunning in Modern Society

by AndersonsInfo 183 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Vidiot
    Vidiot
    Band on the Run - " If you sue and lose, your cause is set back by fifty, one hundred, one hundred and fifty years...If you win, you win whole hog or a tiny bit hog..."

    Band's right.

    Whether or not a case even goes to trial is often overwhelmingly determined by precedents set by previous cases.

    It's setting a new landmark that requires the hard work.

    It's one of the reasons I'm positive the WTS will continue appealing the Conti case all the way up to the Supreme Court; a SCOTUS win for them could effectively immunize them against all further child abuse-related litigation.

    A victory like that would definately be viewed by the WT legal department as worth the risk.

    You'll never be able to successfully litigate the WTS for shunning, though.

    There might be a more effective long-term strategy, however.

    Many of us forget that the WTS has thrived by availing itself of the resources of "The World". Over the past century, they've regularly obtained the support and assistance of external organizations in advancing the WT agenda under the banners of "freedom of speech" and "freedom of religion" (the ACLU, UN NGO status, etc...).

    However, as these organizations become increasingly informed that the WTS does not internally practice the tolerance and freedoms that it advocates publicly (and that, more importantly, are fundamental principles of these organizations), that support and assistance will inevitably be withdrawn, and rightly so. It won't require decisions imposed by the justice system to do it, either; they're own internal policies will determine that decision.

    This cannot help but result in a reduction of the WTS's ability to function in the wider world around them (because by now, progressive internal reform is all but impossible). Like I've said before, they haven't made many friends in high places.

    And the more the WTS's ability to function in the wider world around them is limited, the more crippled it's ability to function internally will be.

    I think they know it, too.

  • mamochan13
    mamochan13

    You are 100% right, Zed, and I completely agree. I've been deeply disturbed by this article ever since I saw this thread, but I've avoided commenting as I don't want to start a forum argument about Eric - he deserves to be left in peace.

    Dick and his group have appropriated someone's name and reputation and used it for their own purposes with no thought to the potential consequences to others.

    When using someone's experience publicly like that it is necessary to obtain permission. With a suicide the onus is to be even more considerate of privacy, as many families are very sensitive to this. With a JW or ex-JW, as you've pointed out, Zed, making this information public is the worst betrayal of all.

    The fact that Dick and his group would take information from this forum and publicize it without permission, using the words selectively to support their agenda whether or not they are true, is something that should deeply concern all of us who post here.

  • Phizzy
    Phizzy

    Thank you so much Barbara, for keeeping us informed. Thanks too to Richard for the article.

    One observation I have , about the situation here in Europe and the U.K is that the WT is skating on very thin ice legally. The Articles of the European Human Rights Act say that every signatory, which is most European governments, recognises as a basic Right:

    "The Right to Family Life". (Article 9 ??)

    To my mind the WT is intruding on this in no small way, I know they will say "It is up to our members to exercise their own conscience on this", but that is patently a lie when they publish stuff that shows that if you, as a JW, ignore their harsh rules, you will be DF'd too ! The JW who has a DF'd relative has no choice in this, except to be DF'd too, a Hobson's Choice indeed !

  • Hummingbird001
    Hummingbird001
    The article by Dick Kelley disturbs me for a number of reasons. The first is that he wrote about Eric as if he personally knew him. I don't know for sure, but I don't think they knew each other in real life. If someone would have information corroborating that they did know each other, I would be more than happy to retract that statement.
    I also am bothered by the fact that Dick culled from Eric's posts here to find a vehicle for AAWA to use when discussing how bad disfellowshipping is, and the associated shunning. I know of another person that this AAWA outed, and then wanted to exploit for this same purpose. At least Eric is no longer with us, and cannot personally be hurt. I just worry about others that can be outed that were associated with Eric in real life, due to some of his past indiscreet posting.
    zed

    I am so glad someone finally addressed this! Thank you, Zed and Mamochan!

    I was also very disturbed to see Eric's quotes in that article and wondered whether permission was given for them to be used. AAWA may argue that they didn't need permission, that they are in the public domain, but certainly ethics, morals and common sense should come into play - law or not.

    My understanding from a close freind of Eric's was that while being shunned was distressing to Eric, as it is to all of us, that was not his only issue. And that's where the article is misleading. Also, I believe neither Richard Kelly nor Steven Unthank, who deceptively refers to Eric as his "freind" in the comments section of the article ever met or conversed with Eric. If they wanted to use Eric's example, they should have used a pseudonym, unless they had permission.

    I had concerns about this same issue when AAWA went public with statements saying that Paris Jackson's suicide attempt was directly related to her being raised a Witness. No proof of this claim was offered and apparently, none required for the foaming-at-the-mouth supporters of AAWA.

    To me this is just another example of AAWA's long-standing tradition of lack of respect for the personal privacy and concerns of the people they claim to serve. We are all nothing to them but warm bodies useful as collateral damage, if it serves their agenda.

  • Old Goat
    Old Goat

    Americans have a constitutional right to form or reject associations. The suggestion that the state curtail this right is abhorrent. I don't want to be compelled to be anyone's "friend." If families shun us, it is their choice, even if the choice is made based on religious belief we may see as stupid. My brother is an idiot. He's made life choices I reject. Even if I were not still nominally a Witness, I'd "shun" him. Do I want a law in place that compels me to talk to a vulgar, womanizing, drug-taking, former Ministerial Servant? Not very likely.

  • LongHairGal
    LongHairGal

    OLD GOAT:

    I tend to agree with much of what you say. However, it should be illegal for JW parents to throw a child under 21 out of the house and render them homeless.

    I heard of at least two instances of teenagers who were given ultimatums of "it's either our way or the highway" when they said they didn't want the JW religion.

  • blondie
    blondie

    I do believe that in the US parents are responsible for their child until he/she is 18 years old. Not that that stops them from kicking their chld out, ignoring the law, and that the congregation ignores it too. After all we're talking about an organization that hides pedophiles and is more concerned about organizational reputation that the welfare of the child.

    *** w81 9/15 p. 28 par. 13 If a Relative Is Disfellowshiped . . . ***

    If a minor child is disfellowshiped, the parents will still care for his physical needs and provide moral training and discipline. They would not conduct a Bible study directly with the child, with him participating. Yet this does not mean that he would not be required to sit in on the family study. And they might direct attention to parts of the Bible or Christian publications that contain counsel he needs. (Prov. 1:8-19; 6:20-22; 29:17; Eph. 6:4) They can have him accompany them to and sit with them at Christian meetings, hoping that he will take to heart Biblical counsel.

    *** w88 11/15 p. 20 par. 24 Helping Others to Worship God ***

    Thereafter, what would parents do in behalf of their erring minor child? They are still responsible for their child, though he is disqualified as an unbaptized publisher or even if he is disfellowshipped because of wrongdoing after baptism. Just as they will continue to provide him with food, clothing, and shelter, they need to instruct and discipline him in line with God’s Word.

  • Phizzy
    Phizzy

    No mention that a child who has suffered the trauma of being DF'd needs love then ? Thought not, just discipline, and sitting like a pariah, silent, during the family study.

    What a cold-hearted cult.

  • blondie
    blondie

    Correct, Phizzy, but the WTS and its followers sit in cruel judgment. But that same organization says that David deserved a free pass when he committed adultery, and had the husband of the woman he shagged put to death to cover it up. A capital offense, 2 of them according the the law code.

  • Old Goat
    Old Goat

    LongHair,

    The age of majority in most states is 18.

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