Well done, you did awesome !
They can't handle the truth, those things he was pontificating about were his safety zones in his mind for why HE believes its true. They are all flawed and ignorant of evidence, truth and living in the real world. You must have rocked his boat for him to go to those ABC, lesson 101 point on JW's....
1 war : we now know that the FDS sent letters of supoort to hitler, also WT until 2002 (thanks to the internet) owned a military company built with Navy money called Rand Cam. they will have blood money whether on purpose or through accident, either way their coffers are no longer pure as the driven snow. They also signed up as an NGO to the UN which included a request that they support the UN ideology. The UN has an army !!!
The JWs think its so big and clever to send other people's kids to war to defend countries and keep us safe etc and declare themselves the kings of the moral high ground, the bible is full of worthless wars and mass slaughter commanded by the god they worship. It makes no sense and it certainly does not define the true religion. Buddhists refuse to be anything but pacificts! Jesus didn't even say war was wrong or evil, he said love your enemy, he didnt day let him kill your family and children. Jesus said those living by the sword will die by the sword..... Wise words, but its not a command to not defend your family and land. Jesus plans on defending his territory in heaven by going to war with his enemy...... Kind of explains itself if peoole other to think about it.
2 :the bible prophesied the coming of gay marriage.....B.S!
Marriage is a pagan institution and so ....well....it is irrelevant to god anyway! apart from the fact it probably pisses him off because ...its PAGAN!
As you pointed out homosexuality has always existed and its prevalence has altered according to local culture and time. If he is saying the verse about 'unnatural purposes' is referring to being gay (and a prophecy) then that is a hate crime and homophobic ! These fellow humans are not unnatural and to define them as such is to call them less than human! Secondly JW's now teach and are supposed to believe that gay people are gay by nature, but need to not act on it. so the verse cant be referring to them because this makes their acts natural not unnatural to them. How unnatural is it if it is so common? Not to mention that 15% of many species are also gay (same prevelance as humans). They put themselves in a horrendous pile of mud by saying these things. They lobby for religious freedom from thr UN and yet their followers, the products of their doctrines, want to deny the religious freedom of gay (created by god that way) people. This makes no sense and is both hypocritical and immoral.
This annoyed me by the way...To say the world must be coming to an end because two gay people that love each other want a legal/religious contract to say so, is just disgusting and ignorant. Would he rather they pursued their god given natural urges outside of marriage? My friends in medical school are gay and they are awesome, lovely people. Because in 2013 they don't have to hide their natural desires, this means the world is coming to an end? There were many white racists that felt the same when a woman dared to say no to moving in her bus seat..... I say f**k those evil, ignorant, backward douche bags!
3 jesus and the early Christian church = JW's : firstly the name jehovah is sn embarrassing error, the idea that developed in a copying monastary 700 years after jesus, they had the idea of mixng the hebrew sentence 'he causes to become' or YHWH in hebrew with the vowels from the word for lord in hebrew, adonai, this YaHoWaH (latin Jahovah) mish mash was used for a few centuries as the name of god! once it was relaised how the name came about it was removed from bibles and religious hymns etc as it was see and recognised as am illogical, unscriptural idea.... but the JWs grabbed it and ran as far a there ignorance could take them, trying to stand out, and now they have a name they cant change lol..... As for the early church...
history re-written...the JW mindset believes there was Jesus.....then he died.....then there were christian congregations.... then it descended into a mess, then the Roman Catholic Church was developed amongst many splits and deviations in christianity, one of which sought truth.....this led to the JW's 2000 years later. Even on description it is evidently stupid to believe. This is also poor bible knowledge and terrible history knowledge.
Jesus of the bible died. 30 years later (possibly) Luke was written, 70 years later the next earliest gospel was written. About this time Paul existed, he never ever met Jesus and yet wrote most of the New Testament and had very new and different ideas to jesus and the earlier Christians hence he fell out with them. He was Roman and his roman beliefs are evident in his ideas and writings in the bible. At this point in bible history, mistakes were being made everywhere. On writing about Jesus, the writer of the book of Matthew wrote that Mary was a virgin, we now know for sure that at this time the old testsment had been translated into greek and was spreading with chritians, but the Greek translation of Isaiah said that the mother of the messiah would be a virgin mistakingly translating the original Hebrew that means "young woman." The original Hebrew is giving an analogy of time being short, it says in Hebrew a young woman's baby will move onto solids by the time that happens (a prophecy about a war, not even about jesus). Anyway, this Greek mistranslation was the first place this mistake happened and whoever wrote Matthew had oobviously read that mistake and then invented the Virgin Mary story around it! Thats how flawed and mistaken those years after this man known as jesus had died were.
Anyway Paul a roman, who had been tasked with killing Christians now has the role of spreading a new Christian/Romam message and he set up the Roman Catholic Church, the Catholic Church is 100% the result of the work of Paul and his followers. The JW's never discuss this or perhaps know? Forget all the pomp and ceremony, tradition and extra nonsense they add on, the Catholics do totally own the right to that truth. They have the bones of Peter in their vault for goodness sake. If this elder wants to argue that the early church are the modern JW's he needs to pick up some books!
The elder lives by a book...known as THE BIBLE.... that the ROMAN CATHOLIC church collated as the cannon of the holy books. This is no small matter to explain away if you want to dismiss it as anything less than the true religion but are Christian.
The early Christian church was formed nearly 100 years after jesus dies with a very varied and different message to the idea we all have of what they were like. A great book is called "THE LOST CHRISTIANITIES" on this very subject. The Christian sects after jesus were a mess, there was no unified movement at all! There was no one church, one belief system, one chritian sect..... The Catholic Church unified the beliefs and cherry picked from all the different ideas the ones that suited them politically.
By the way I dodnt believe the bible is true, nevermind the pope, I am not pro catholic at all, just pro real history!
(Ps I personally believe Paul was sent by Rome with the goal of sorting out the Christian movement, after realising that killing them wouldn't work, I think he was instrumental in integrating Jewish/Christian doctrines with Roman ideology and beliefs, I think he was working undercover... But that's my personal idea and it means nothing at wll and I ask you to dismiss it happily)
Anyway well done Julia, I am so proud of you! I am so happy your husband has reached this point too, I remember your concerns with him when you first came here, you loved him but were worried he would never see TTATT ...... Once its broken down, it all comes apart so easily.
I intend to live in Australia when I am finished with my degree, I would be honoured to come and say hello to ou both one day maybe, ill even bring the coffee ;) x
Snare x
