Oh my God is that apropos. I thought I'd seen that movie and I don't even remember that scene.
"You knew what the consequences were when YOU decided to leave The Truth. This is YOUR decision and the outcome is YOUR responsibility."
by nicolaou 55 Replies latest social family
-
-
stillin
The disfellowshipping "arrangement" reminds me of a notice I got in the mail fom one of my major credit card banks. It outlines our new "Terms of Agreement" as though I had anything to do with it. Yes, there is a balance on my card but I didn't "agree" to anything changing! Apparently, having a balance makes you vulnerable to whatever whims the credit card company decides to do. Same thing with the Watchtower Society. Now you have family, extended family, friends and even business associates within this crowd. You're hooked. You decide what you're going to do. It's an entirely different setup than when you signed on.
-
sspo
The GB can change their mind on doctrines over and over again with no consequences but a 14 year old that gets baptized but eventually loses faith in the watchtower and does not believe anymore will be punished for the rest of his life.
Very sad indeed !
-
rawe
Hi Nic,
Randy, I'm struggling to pin down my reasons but your post really pissed me off.
Please don't read my post as if I'm suggesting it applies to you or anyone else. It is how I personally processed my decision. In other words, I knew beforehand what the consequences would be and for me I could have easily avoided them. Simply by either remaining in the faith, or after leaving deciding not to openly celebrate Christmas. Is the thrust of the "you knew the consequences" a blame the victim approach? Absolutely! That is what the Witness is trying to do, and it is the Witness that I'm addressing, not you or anyone else who is the victim of shunning.
Once *I* am willing to accept the consequence -- lets just say, even simply for the sake of the argument -- *then* where does the reasoning go? And that is the point I'm trying to make. Our Witnesses friends aren't really making the rest of the journey. As if to say, that we *should* have chosen to avoid the consequences and everything would be okay? No it wouldn't! We would, after knowning what we know, be found living an immoral life, by giving tacit support to an organization we now know is bringing harm to people. That is intolerable and as a consequence, we had to leave. That's my point. I appolgise if it doesn't always come across as well as I would like.
Take care,
-Randy
-
ablebodiedman
If the agreement I 'willingly' entered into as a child is changed by the other party without any debate or consultation with me why should I feel obliged to honour it?
You have a good point!
At least you were probably baptized in the name of the father Aand of the son and holy spirit.
Since then that has all changed without your consent.
Now the baptism is in the name of the father and of the son and God's Spirit Directed Organization!
These men had the audacity and presumption to re-invent Jesus Christs commanded baptism before the conclusion of the system of things had even arrived!
Did they ask you if that would be ok?
Do THEY understand the consequence of departing from Jesus Christs commandment?
Here it is:
Matthew 28:18-20
And Jesus approached and spoke to them, saying: "All authority has been given me in heaven and on the earth. 19 Go therefore and make disciples of people of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all the things I have commanded YOU. And, look! I am with YOUall the days until the conclusion of the system of things."
After making these audacious changes to Jesus Christs commanded baptism do you think that Jesus Christ is still; "with them"?
THEY knew what the consequences were of re-inventing a baptism to bring veneration to themselves at the risk of departing from Jesus Christs commanded baptism!!
If Jesus Christ is no longer "with them" then why would anyone else want to be!
If you take a stand for Jesus Christ you will be disfellowshipped!
I was disfellowshipped for this EXACT reason.
I would rather take a stand with Jesus Christ than face the consequences of what they have done to his baptism!
Yes! That can cause divisions that run right through a once wholesome family unit.
Luke 12:49-53
"I came to start a fire on the earth, and what more is there for me to wish if it has already been lighted? 50 Indeed, I have a baptism with which to be baptized, and how I am being distressed until it is finished! 51 Do YOU imagine I came to give peace on the earth? No, indeed, I tell YOU, but rather division. 52 For from now on there will be five in one house divided, three against two and two against three. 53 They will be divided, father against son and son against father, mother against daughter and daughter against [her] mother, mother-in-law against [her] daughter-in-law and daughter-in-law against [her] mother-in-law."
abe
-
ablebodiedman
When you were baptized, this was the promise they had made in a Watchtower Magazine:
w55 7/1 p. 411 Christian Baptism for the New World Society
15
A Christian, therefore, cannot be baptized in the name of the one actually doing the immersing or in the name of any man, nor in the name of any organization , but in the name of the Father, the Son and the holy spirit. This shows, among other things, that Christianity is not a denominational affair, that sects have nothing to do with it. "Does the Christ exist divided? Paul was not impaled for you, was he? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul? I am thankful I baptized none of you except Crispus and Gaius, so that no one may say that you were baptized in my name."—1 Cor. 1:13-15,
There is a consequence to screwing with Jesus Christ's Baptism!
and
They did it without your consent!
abe
-
tim hooper
I was a born-in, so when my parents told me "You knew the score when you left" I retorted "Yes, but it wasn't my decision to join".
That ended the discussion quite satisfactorily from my point of view.
-
smiddy
I was baptised in 1960 in what was the" truth" at that time according to what was understood by the speaker at that assembly program and the person who immersed me.
53 years on, what was" truth"then is no longer" truth" now. so how can I be accountable for being a so called apostate when they themselves have changed so much of their beleifs .
Who in fact is the apostate ?
smiddy
-
Ucantnome
when i was leaving we had one couple who i considered close friends. i'd known one of them since childhood. some elders had already visited me and it hadn't gone too well. the couple, our friends, we had invited round for a meal. i had explained to them on a previous occasions how i felt and at this point i had no intention of leaving the organization . i sat in our bedroom on the bed waiting for their phone call. the one that i knew they would decline our invitation. i also sat pondering the thought that they would never come to our house again. not because i didn't want them too but i knew they wouldn't and they haven't in 20 years. how did i know? cause i would have done the same.
-
GLTirebiter
How would they react to being treated the same way? It's time for some tough love:
"YOU knew what the consequences were when YOU decided that following the Watchtower was more important than your own flesh and blood. This is YOUR decision and the consequences are YOUR responsibility. If ever YOU are ready to admit YOUR error and want to apologize and make ammends for YOUR behavior, we will be here. But we will not tolerate YOUR bad conduct."