abortion vs holocaust (page 8)

problemaddict

Ok so while my own opinions are evolving on this subject, let me help out Ravens a bit. While I am not a fan of the holocaust analogy because it just doesn't beg a normal conversation or intelligent discussion, I think there are a few things to consider at the life begins at conception marker.

Essentially, Ravens believes this, because the vast majority of the time, the initial fertilization if untampered with will proceed to a full term baby that is born healthy. So the eventuality is a life. The "process" has been put in motion. I think there is something to that thought.

While I despise late term abortion, I do very much understand the victim of a rape or incest not wanting to give birth to that child, and having it aborted BEFORE it can feel it. My wife is pregnant about 4 months. She can feel that child, and if he was to be killed, he would in fact feel that. Not a glob of cells any longer. Abortion is legal up to 24 weeks. That is astonishingly long, and is related to when the baby is thought to be able to breathe on his or her own and have the neccesary lung coating to not have the tissue stick together.

Maybe Ravens it would help to think of Gods own natural process in this way. If the body is under extreme stress or dealing with uncertainty to an extreme degree, many women simply miscarry. So the bosy through those stress indicators will basically "abort" the fertilized egg. Now of course this happens very early on, but to borrow a line from the WT, would God implant things within his creation that he himself disapproved of?

Comatose

Thats exactly my point but I don't think unstop gets it... Until there is a little human there or organs etc its just not the same thing. If you take this extreme view of life then it should apply in all areas of your life, for all "life".

Comatose

problemaddict I think you and I feel pretty closely on this subject. I'm taking a hard stand against unstop due to his extreme opinion.

To protect the life of the mother, I think abortion should be allowed until birth. It makes me sad and it stinks god in his love couldn't prevent this, but its fair to protect the mothers life.

For rape victims and babies with extreme deformities, I don't know exactly where I would feel good about drawing that line, so I default to it being the WOMANS body and her choice.

If abortion happens prior to fetal development then I can't see the logic in saying it is murder and the same as the holocaust.

What would have been worse? To gas and torture 4 million living people to death, or to destroy 4 million embryos? Unstop you cannot actually believe this. it defies logic and common sense.

jgnat

Unstop, you haven't said so, but from the context can I assume that you consider human life to be sacred from conception, but not so for all other life?

dazed but not confused

Holocaust baby...

Ravens- You crack me up. Do you really expect people to take you serious when you start a thread like this?

(facepalm)

LisaRose

It's just another example of extreme black or white thinking.

The holocaust differs from abortion in so many ways it is not at all the same, really it is not even worth a discussion.

A small group of cells is just that, a small group of cells. It is not self aware, it cannot breath or survive outside of the womb. It is just a potential life, just as a woman's eggs or a man's sperm is. About 25% of known pregnancies end in spontaneous abortion, but many more pregnancies end because the embryo does not successfully implant, so the hormones to keep a woman from bleeding are not released and the menstrual cycle starts and the embryo is lost, with the woman never knowing she is pregnant. It is estimated that 50% to 90% of pregnancies end this way. So God causes more abortions than any abortion clinic ever has.

I personally think people should be responsible and use birth control if they are not prepared to be parents, but unfortunately some people don't and birth control sometimes fails, and sadly, some women are raped. I cannot see forcing a woman to have a child she doesn't want, there just seems no reason to do so when they can get a safe, legal abortion. Abortion is still illegal in many countries, in fact a woman dies from illegal abortions every seven minutes. I think that is the crime. I support a woman's right to have reproductive control over her body, I hope eventually abortions will be legal and safe in every country.

I am sick of the religious right pushing their beliefs onto the rest of us. No one is forcing you to get an abortion, so don't tell the rest of us what to do with our bodies, it's really none of your business.

unstopableravens

lisa wow is all i can say, forcing on you guys? i bet your glad you were not aborted, who on this thread is sad that they were not leagally or illegally aborted? you may see it as forcing a view on a women, i see it as forcing a decision on baby, cofty: i did not half to look up the dictionary, i simply did that because you would excpet that overr anything i say.

What exactly do you mean when you assert that LIFE BEGINS at conception?

This is central to your position and yet you seem toally at a loss to explain yourself.

abortion vs holocaust

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