So...Assuming God exists, if he were on trial and you were the prosecutor, how would you present your case?

androb31

Feel free to skip the intro down to the actual purpose of the thread lol!!

A little about myself. I'm a born in, 32 years in and almost 6 out. I've been out of the JW's since October of 2008. I came out due to a variety of factors, blood, historical roots, false teachings etc... My Older sister helped me out back in 2008 and I subsequently helped my brother exit and the 3 of us became "born again" Christians.

I've been mostly lurking but occasionally posting on JWN for around 5 years. My sister is a very easy to talk to, understanding person who I can have a human conversation with and doesn't try to answer everything with a scriptural or a Christian platitude.. My brother is now a Pastor and a very fanatical Christian and is hard to talk to on a personal level due to everything being answerable by a scripture or cliche type biblical answer.

I'm struggling with my faith due to a whole slew of reasons but suffice it to say I'm tired of the worn out "pray and wait on god" answer to my doubts. I see many contradictions in the bible, such as......Love is not Jealous, but god is love and God is jealous, thou shall not kill/murder...but god can murder everyone in existance, do not covet...but god covets worship of other "gods" etc....

Basically I get the impression the typical fallback for most Christians if not GOD HIMSELF is MIGHT MAKES RIGHT or GOD WORKS IN MYSTERIOUS WAYS, HOW DARE THE CLAY QUESTION THE POTTER, I DO WHAT I PLEASE and yadda yadda. It strikes me as a tyrant type attitude of either bow down to me or die by my hand, yet any christian I know would absolutely condemn Hitler w/ out a moments hesitation.

I want to have faith and I am in absolutely no position to make judgements against even the most wayword of people (as I have a seriously checkered background) or god if he is real. I have f#(&@) up more than anyone I know yet in spite of that I just don't understand the massive number of contradictions in scripture or any other god belief for that matter.

I want to know what is your best case for or against god and/or if god exists hypothetically speaking what is your case against him/her for or against having any devotion or contempt for him/her.

blondie

So what would I use as a basis of what God would respond, direct responses from him individually...the bible...other religious books...religious leaders' interpretations?

androb31

Let's say from a Christian/biblical standpoint.

blondie

Which Christian standpoint, Catholic, Protestant (myriad of groups), Mormons, Greek or Russian Orthodox?

cofty

Hi androb. Great questions.

I have lots of reasons for rejecting belief in god but if I have to choose one it would be natural evil.

The natural world appears designed to maximise suffering. Most living things live short and stressful lives which are cut short by starvation, exposure, predation, infection or parasites.

Add to that the way the planet is booby trapped to make the violent deaths of millions through earthquakes and tsunamis inevitable.

Excuses like "free-will" and "the fall" do not begin to address these questions.

androb31

To Blondie:

Ok, Lets just say anywhere in the bible that god acted against his own standards or held his creation to standards he didn't stick to himself. I'm not really concerned about a doctrinal breakdown of this church vs. that church, or this Christian creed vs. that one. More like a "worldly" person would point out any hypocricy of a "Christian" who claims high moral ground.

cofty

Lets just say anywhere in the bible that god acted against his own standards or held his creation to standards he didn't stick to himself.

How about infanticide...?

androb31

Cofty:

Thanks for the response. I have actually read the thread where your former pastor tried to win you back and you brought up the Natural evil subject. That was definitely a notch in the "against belief in god" in my for/against faith, belief in god search.

I still seem to revert back to a fear based response that maybe the bible is true and I don't want to end up on the wrong side when it all comes down to it.

I see a lot of contradictions in the bible yet I still see some things that make me wonder. Such as the rebirth of Israel as one for instance.

I will be away from the internet here in a few but will be back on tomorrow just so it doesn't seem like a hit and run.

cofty

Catch up with you again soon androb. Have a good weekend.

androb31

Cofty: How about infanticide...?

That is very applicable and convincing, I apoligize I didn't actually read the entire thread so forgive me if this has been posed on there. I will read it thru tomorrow, but just to play the devil's advocate for a second. If I were to ask a died in the wool Christian or a Theologian about that (many, not all) they would likely respond with the "you don't know how evil the nations were at the time", god didn't want the evil to spread, besides he gave us life and he can take it if he wants to", or the "satan had them so corrupted, was creating nephilim, perversion", it was a mercy killing type response..

Not that I think that explanation makes it ok, I used to swallow that type of explanation hook, line and sinker but I'm starting to think more for myself . I still get a lot of that old programmed stuff coming up acting as thought stoppers. Would like to be able to begin to weigh everything objectively and not based on programmed fears. That is basically the purpose of my post.

I guess I'm looking for different points of view on the biblical contradictions, for or against god.

So...Assuming God exists, if he were on trial and you were the prosecutor, how would you present your case?

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