Is Armageddon part of the Great Tribulation? what was WT writers word?

by prologos 34 Replies latest jw friends

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  Vanderhoven7

  THE OLIVET DISCOURSE- A Collation of Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke 21

  TWO JUDGMENTS: The Destruction of the Temple and the Second Coming

  The Temple’s Fate

  1 And as He went forth out of the temple, one of His disciples says to Him, “Master, behold, what manner of goodly stones and what manner of buildings and offerings!”
  2 And Jesus said to him, Do you see these great buildings? the days will come when there will not be left here one stone upon another, which shall not be thrown down.

  Beginning of Troubles Leading to Jerusalem's Destruction:

  3 And as He sat on the mount of Olives opposite the temple, Peter and James and John and Andrew asked him privately,
  4 “Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign when these things are all about to be accomplished, and of your coming (parousia) and of the end of the age?” And Jesus answered and said to them, “Take heed that no man lead you astray.”
  5 “For many will come in my name, saying, ‘I am the Christ/I am He’, and ‘the time is at hand’, and will lead many astray.”
  6 “And when you shall hear of wars and rumors of wars, be not troubled/terrified, it is necessary for these things to come about first; but the end is not yet/immediately.”
  
  7 Then said He to them, “Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom,”
  8 “And there will be great earthquakes, and in divers places famines and pestilences; and there will be terrors and great signs from heaven. But all these things are the beginning of birth pains.”
  
  9 “But before all these things, they will lay their hands on you, and will persecute you, delivering you up to the synagogues and prisons, bringing you before kings and governors for My name’s sake, for a testimony to them. Then will they deliver you up to tribulation, and will kill you.”
  10 “But you will be delivered up even by parents, and brethren, and kinsfolk, and friends, and some of you will they cause to be put to death. And then will many stumble, and will deliver up one another, and will hate one another. And you will be hated of all men for My Name’s sake”
  11 “And brother will deliver up brother to death, and the father his child, and children will rise up against parents, and cause them to be put to death. And you will be hated of all men for My Name’s sake.”
  12 “And when they lead you to judgment, and deliver you up, do not be anxious beforehand what you will say, but whatever will be given you in that hour, that speak, for it is not you who speak, but the Holy Spirit.”
  13 “Settle it therefore in your hearts, not to meditate beforehand how to answer, for I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which all your adversaries will not be able to withstand or to gainsay.”
  14 “And many false prophets will arise, and will lead many astray, and because iniquity will be multiplied, the love of the many will wax cold.”
  15 “But not a hair of your head will perish. 16 In your patient endurance you will win your souls for he who endures to the end, the same will be saved.”
  17 “And this gospel of the kingly rule will be preached in the whole world for a testimony to all the nations, and then will the end come.”

  .

  The Sign to Flee Jerusalem’s Destruction:

  18 “When therefore you see the abomination of desolation, which was spoken of through Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not in the holy place (let him who reads understand), that is to say, when you see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that her desolation is at hand.”
  19 “Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let him who is on the housetop not go down to take out things that are in his house, and let him who is in the field (countryside) not return back to take his cloak.”
  20 “For these are days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.”
  21 “But woe to those who are with child and to those who are breast feeding in those days!”
  22 And pray that your flight be not in the winter, neither on a Sabbath,”
  23 “For then will be great tribulation, such as has not been from the beginning of the creation which God created, until now, no, nor ever shall be, for there will be great distress on the land, and wrath to this people.”
• 

  Vanderhoven7

  No Second Personal Coming (Parousia) During Jerusalem’s Woes:

  24 Then if any man shall say to you, ‘Lo, here is the Christ’, or, ‘Here’; believe it not. For there will arise false Christs, and false prophets, and will show great signs and wonders, so as to lead astray, if it were possible, even the elect. But take heed. Behold, I have told you beforehand.”
  25 “If therefore they shall say to you, ‘Behold, he is in the wilderness’, go not forth, ‘Behold, he is in the inner chambers’, believe it not.”
  26 “For as the lightning comes forth from the east, and is seen even to the west, so will be the coming of the Son of man.”

  The Onslaught on Jerusalem and its Aftermath (described in figurative language):

  27 “Immediately after the tribulation of those days there will be signs in the sun, moon and stars, the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give her light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and on the earth there will be distress of nations, in perplexity for the roaring of the sea and the billows, men fainting for fear, and for expectation of the things which are coming on the world, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken,”
  28“And then will appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven, and then will all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they will see the Son of man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.”
  29 “And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and will be led captive into all the nations, and Jerusalem will be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled. And except those days had been shortened, no flesh would have been saved, but for the elect’s sake those days will be shortened.”
  30 “Wherever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.”
  31 “And He will send forth his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.”
  32 “But when these things begin to come about, look up, and lift up your heads, because your redemption draws near.

  33 “Now from the fig tree learn her parable. When her branch is now become tender, and puts forth its leaves, you know that the summer is near, even so you also, when you see all these things, know you that He is near ( the Kingly Rule of God is near), even at the doors.”
  34 “Truly I say to you, This generation will not pass away, until all these things are accomplished.”
  35 “Heaven and earth will pass away, but My words will not pass away.”

  "IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE TRIBULATION OF THOSE
  DAYS SHALL THE SUN B E DARKENED, AND THE MOON
  NOT GIVE HER LIGHT, AND THE STARS SHALL FALL
  FROM HEAVEN, AND THE POWERS OF THE HEAVENS
  SHALL BE SHAKEN"

  Most people assume the vivid language must describe the end of
  the world. But notice that this apocalyptic language is preceded
  by the word "IMMEDIATELY". It was immediately after the
  tribulation of those days that the sun would be darkened etc. The
  Jewish nation was about to be darkened; virtually obliterated.
  God, in His righteous wrath was removing the Jewish nation from
  His heavens. As the moon, Judaism would no longer reflect the
  Light of God; its stars, the prophets and Fathers would no longer
  shine for Israel of the flesh.

  QUESTION: Can we be justified in stating that the sun, moon and
  stars are figurative of Judaism and its glories?

  WHEN WE LET SCRIPTURE INTERPRET SCRIPTURE, we
  find the same language in the OT depicting the destruction of
  Babylon , Egypt, Tyre and Idumea.

  Is.13:9, 10 is a prediction of God's judgment on Babylon
  "Behold the day of the Lord cometh, cruel both with wrath and
  and fierce anger to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the
  sinners thereof out of it. For the stars of heaven and the
  constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be
  darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light
  to shine.

  If the Holy Spirit speaking through the prophet Isaiah uses such
  figurative language to describe the downfall of a heathen nation
  like Babylon, how much more would not such language be used to
  describe the downfall of the chosen nation of Israel?

  Is.34:4,5 Regarding the destruction of the insignificant nation of
  Idumea, Isaiah writes:
  And all the host of heaven shall be dissolved, and the heavens
  shall be rolled together as a scroll...
  For my sword shall be bathed in heaven; behold it shall come
  down upon Idumea, and upon the people of my curse, to
  judgment.

  If the Holy Spirit speaking through the prophet Isaiah uses such
  figurative language to describe the downfall of such an
  insignificant nation as Idumea, how much more would not such
  language be used to describe the downfall of the chosen nation of
  Israel?

  Ez.32:2, 7,8 Ezekiel's prediction of God's judgment on Egypt
  incorporates similar vivid language.
  "Son of man, take up a lamentation for Pharaoh king of
  Egypt...
  And when I shall put thee out, I will cover the heaven, and I
  will make the stars thereof dark; I will cover the sun with a
  cloud, and the moon shall not give her light. All the bright
  lights of heaven will I make dark over thee, and set darkness
  upon thy land, saith the Lord God.

  If the Holy Spirit speaking through the prophet Ezekiel uses such
  figurative language to describe the downfall of a heathen nation
  like Egypt, how much more would not such language be used to
  describe the downfall of the chosen nation of Israel?
  Acts 2:16-21 Is.19:1 Ps.97:2,3 Mat.26:64

  OF COURSE THIS LANGUAGE CAN AND DOES APPLY TO
  ISRAEL.

  Dan.8:10-11, speaking of the conquest of Rome over Israel, says:
  And it (one horn) waxed great, even to the host of heaven;
  and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground,
  and stamped on them. Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince
  of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the
  place of the sanctuary cast down. (See also Jer.4:26 Mt.26:64
  Mat.16:28)
• 

  SAHS

  “prologos”: “. . . do not count on the Governing Body, FaDS to be around, they will have withdrawn before the climax is reached.”

  Well, isn’t that just like those old geezers!
• 

  rjharris

  Armageddon is not what the religious system called by men say it is – neither is it what the Motion Picture Industry protrays it as.

  Armageddon is not a war. It is not a battle.

  Armageddon is a PLACE. It is the PLACE in a future earth (after Christs 1000 year kingom ends) where Satan's Throne dwells – his Wild Beast – where resistance to the coming down and establishing on earth Kingdom will be waged. God's Kingdom does not come down until:

  1. Christ's 1000 year definite kingdom has come and gone. ( Rev 20:7 )
     
  2. The Satan ascends out of the abyss and established his Wild Beast (Throne) on the earth. That throne or kingdom (the PLACE) is Armageddon. ( Rev 20:7 )
     
  3. The throne of Satan has misled the entire world of those days. ( Rev 20:8 )
     
  4. The Good News of the Kingdom is preached to all of the inhabitants of the earth in those days by an angel. All inhabitants will be in the Wild Beast.( Rev 14:6 )
     
  5. Because of the declaration of the angelic message of the Good News of the Kingdom, there is a separation of a few from the Wild Beast as they favorably respond to that message.
     
  6. These faithful ones (faithful slaves) will be hunted and persecuted by those remaining loyal to and not responding to the angelic declaration of the Good News. This mistreatment of them by their former Brethren is the Great Tribulation. The attempt by their former Brethren (unfaithful) is to get them to re-establish their support to the Wild Beast (Throne of Satan).
     
  7. God intervenes and first destroys Satan's throne along with it the False Prophet class. Then He destroys those unfaithful ones who persecuted at caused tribulation upon God's faithful servants and who responded to the witness given by the angel when he declared the Good News of the Kingdom. Those destroyed along with Satan will be as the sand of the sea. ( Rev 20:7-10 )
     
  8. THEN God's indefinite kingdom comes down. ( Revelation 21:1-27 )

  See full article: http://www.e-prophetic.com/articles/what-and-when-is-armageddon/

  R. Jerome Harris
  e-Prophetic.com
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  Dis-Member

  Jerome Harris you have some PM's..