Silentlambs, The Letter, The World, and Justice.

by BeautifulGarbage 101 Replies latest jw friends

kenpodragon

PS. Silent Lambs IS an organization of which you have put your trust in. And rightly so.

I read the above to mean something different then.
Sorry
Dragon
Reborn2002

I always get a good chuckle when someone references God as being the law and then defends their viewpoint with Scriptures.
Of course you can use the Bible to defend your spiritual idea. This is false reasoning. That would be akin to the Watchtower magazine making a presumption and then substantiating their claim with another Watchtower magazine.
Duh.
Why not use examples taken from history NOT in the Bible (which can be verified and are not part of a fairy tale book IMHO) or even from our modern day?
NOT using the Bible. Where has your God intervened?
The Holy Inquisitions which slaughtered countless millions in God's name?
The millions of people enslaved and murdered during the era of African-American slavery in the United States?
Oh, I know.. how about the Nazi Holocaust where millions were murdered simply because of their ethnicity?
September 11th, 2001 - Innocent people, including very religious people who can sit and quote Scriptures just like you, were going to and from work and were murdered because fanatical Muslims committed a horrible atrocity in the name of their God.
Your God is nothing but an absentee landlord. He sure has one good cushy position though. Something good happens to people, religious zealots praise Him. Something bad happens, you make an excuse for Him as to why he did not do anything. Or better, yet, you blame ANOTHER invisible being (Satan) as the culprit.
What say you to that? And please, for the sake of not making yourself look foolish, do not quote further Scriptures. Use your own reasoning, not something prepackaged for you in a religious book.
Edited by - Reborn2002 on 7 October 2002 17:8:4
pomegranate

Well, considering his track record with the holocaust and other attrocities, I wouldn't be expecting divine intervention any time soon.
Good things = God's work
Bad things = Satan's work
Holocaust, good or bad? Whose track record?
Good things = God's work
Other atrocities = Satan's work
Other atrocities = good or bad? Whose track record?
IslandWoman

Andee,
Thanks so much for this well written post. I agree with you, and am sorry that this has apparently caused the departure of HS, hopefully temporarily.
We all admire Bill Bowen and the silent lambs he has been working so hard for, but we also must treasure our freedom to disagree. After all, it is that freedom which is most of all denied in the Watchtower Org., and the one that if allowed would have prevented many of the injustices found there.
Thanks for a great post.
IW
morrisamb

Advising anyone to not put all their trust in any one man or organization? I see that as a healthy suggestion.
My siblings and I have talked about this for years...we support victims period. We DO NOT focus on JWS, Catholic victims, etc., etc. One reporter after reading my book asked me, "It probably happened because you were a Witness. That's probably why it was worse as well." I answered, "Bullshit. I've known several Catholic victims of abuse who have been suicidal, in jail, on drugs. You name it."
Anyone who says to my siblings or I...If you don't support us in (this or that), we can't talk to you, or you can't belong, we say, "Bye bye." Been there. Done that.
We're free spirits.
I also look up to few men...Nelson Mendela, Ghandi, Martin Luther King, people like that...but I don't worship them or expect them to be perfect role models either. Anybody can talk the talk, but how many walk the walk?
Reborn2002

Good things = God's work
Bad things = Satan's work
Holocaust, good or bad? Whose track record?
Good things = God's work
Other atrocities = Satan's work
Well I see you've proven my point for me. Thanks.
Jesika

I agree reborn2002. Seems too close to JW mentallity to me.
pomegranate
>>To Pom,
I don't ask you NOT to believe in god, so don't ask me to see this as a directive by god.<<
I'm not asking you to see anything. I asked you how you know whether or not God is backing Bill? You don't. He could be. Your disbelief in God does not disqualify that possibilty.
>>I didn't say I don't trust silentlambs, I said I don't put my faith in ANY organization. There is a difference.<<
Faith is trust. There is no difference. If you trust Bill and SL, you have FAITH in them.
>>I trust what Bill is doing is for the right reason.<<
That IS faith. It even MOVED YOU to DO SOMETHING. March in NYC.
>>I have met him and his family and love them all. I know Bill is doing this for the right reason and that is what I trust. I trust what Bill is doing is for the protection of children.<<
Does Bill still believe in God? Why would he use the Bible through the bull horn at the WTBTS if he didn't feel there was some FORCE behind it? Actually, it really wouldn't matter if Bill still believes or not. God uses unbelievers to get His will done all the time.
>>I don't put my "faith" in any Organization.<<
You are being a hypocrite. Silentlambs.ORG. The org stands for ORGANIZATION.
>>Silentlambs has given me guidence and put me in touch with others I have been able to assist. I would not die for Silentlambs, but I would die for the protection of children if it would change things and give children a voice that would be heard. Silentlambs organization has given me and others a link to others, information, and legal channels if we so choose to use them. The most important thing it has done, for me, is to allow me to understand I am not crazy and that I am not alone in this. Silentlambs is a mouth piece, and I hope it will be around a long time.<<
See the bold above.
faith (fn.
Confident belief in the truth, value, or trustworthiness of a person, idea, or thing. See Synonyms at trust.
Loyalty to a person or thing; allegiance: keeping faith with one's supporters.
Belief that does not rest on logical proof or material evidence.
often Faith Christianity. The theological virtue defined as secure belief in God and a trusting acceptance of God's will.
The body of dogma of a religion: the Muslim faith.
A set of principles or beliefs.
kelsey007

Silent Lambs seems to have more than one agenda. The first, as stated at silentlambs.org, is aiding and supporting abuse vicitms.The second seem to be the forcable change in WT policy.
In analyzing the first agenda it seems that silent lambs caught unexpectedly with such great numbers of alledged abuse victims. The last time I checked any callers to silent lambs were calling Bill Bowen directly. From my experience and the others I have heard about Mr Bowen makes a sole decision as to which victims silent lambs gets involved with. Just as Mr Bowen has argued that the WT has no trained counselers in place to deal with these issues- it seems as though Silent Lambs sits on equal ground. Should'nt trained professional be making the call as to whether a case is credible or not? Or does Mr Bowen posses some training that we are not aware of? Are mass lawsuits and apprearnces in court to sue the WT all that silent lambs has to offer? Where are the therapists? Now that this has come this far how will silent lambs respond to " What are you doing for the vicitms?
What I see: Silent lambs - supports criminal prosecution of alledged prediphiles.
supports civil suits against the WT or local congregations
If it were ever asked what real vicitm aid is being given to abuse victims- well I have not heard anything about professional help for these guys. Does a simpathetic ear aid the victim? It does provide encouragement. But what if the law suits do not bring financial benefit to the abused? Has a case yet been won? I do know that some pediphiles have been convicted and incarcerated due to possible encouragement by silent lambs.
Back on point though- It seems to me that Mr Bowen is still seeing things through JW eyes. This alone could hinder his ability to manage this effectuvely day to day.
The letter- could Mr Bowen believe that he can develop a case against the WT by doccumenting his efforts to get them to follow their own procedures? If so, would any such be effective from silent lambs considering that he has no stand in the WT org any longer? The WT seems to view this in one angle- we report when the law says we have to report. Then if a body of elders or a single elder does otherwise the WT effectively distances themselves from those or that elder. Mr Bowen knows this all to well from his personal experience. Has he got a ace up his sleeve? Maybe. But we are back to the same quesiton- What, in reality is silent lambs doing for abuse victims? Is it all about changing WT policy? Is it a personal vendetta? Are there professional, trained people who are qualified to screen applicants for silent lambs support? And, other than court cases and marches what is silent lambs doing for the victims? If silent lambs does not have trained qualified profesisonals to deal with the abuse victims it mutes their argument that the elders are not trained professionals in dealing with abuse victims- at least in my opinion.
Those are the questions that I have.
pomegranate

Why not use examples taken from history NOT in the Bible (which can be verified and are not part of a fairy tale book IMHO) or even from our modern day? NOT using the Bible. Where has your God intervened?

Everytime a child is born.
The Holy Inquisitions which slaughtered countless millions in God's name?
The millions of people enslaved and murdered during the era of African-American slavery in the United States?
Oh, I know.. how about the Nazi Holocaust where millions were murdered simply because of their ethnicity?

September 11th, 2001 - Innocent people, including very religious people who can sit and quote Scriptures just like you, were going to and from work and were murdered because fanatical Muslims committed a horrible atrocity in the name of their God.
So, your logic is, because He doesn't intervene on YOUR time and schedule, He is the reason for all the bad?
>>Your God is nothing but an absentee landlord.<<
So how does that make Him responsible?
>>He sure has one good cushy position though. Something good happens to people, religious zealots praise Him. Something bad happens, you make an excuse for Him as to why he did not do anything. Or better, yet, you blame ANOTHER invisible being (Satan) as the culprit.<<
Makes it pretty simple. And you? What do you have for answers? NOTHING. I have contentment in my belief. All you have is discontent in your disbelief without any counter explaination FOR ANYTHING at all...you are MISERABLE and UNHAPPY that I (or anyone else) can believe in God.
A first grader can condemn just about anything. It's a wise man that has an answer. ANY ANSWER. You have no answers...only condemnation.
>>What say you to that?<<
See the above.
>>And please, for the sake of not making yourself look foolish, do not quote further Scriptures.<<
I will quote when I feel like it. I'll let another judge decides who's the fool.
>>Use your own reasoning, not something prepackaged for you in a religious book.<<
I'm am free to use whatever I feel to your liking or not.
Edited by - pomegranate on 7 October 2002 17:41:20

Silentlambs, The Letter, The World, and Justice.

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