Reality check: World less happy about America

by Pathofthorns 91 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  waiting

  lol..........good one, dra.

  People are always divided on their opinions. Politicians more so. Ever hear of that ol' saying "England swings as the pendulum swings." Well, so does everyone else - not meaning to single out Ol' England. Politicians throw their weight left to right faster than any pendulum, imho. It's their nature to change.

  Actually some good points on both sides - some 'mercuns ain't too happy with the usa govenment either. Of course, nothin' new there. Thanks Hawk. I truly doubt the Canadians have just "a tent" in Saudi. Path's never liked 'mercuns much - but he tolerates me.

  Did anyone read the Time or Newsweek article about a month ago on Saddam & his two sons who rule with him, or behind his back.....and are next in line for rulership? You think Daddy is bad.............his sons are cold blooded killers - and have proven it for over a decade now. Powerful sociopaths, the whole family.

  waiting
• 

  gumby

  The hell with all of this.

  I'm moving to Mexico and going to let the oppsing parties blast the shit out of each other while I'm buying Corona's for $8 a case and watching the smoke rise. They seem to be doing fine over there,....what the Hell is our problem?
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  freeman

  Unfortunately this is probably a fair assessment.

  American foreign policy is without a doubt a large contributor of much of the anti-American feelings. Having held a security clearance higher then that of most military personnel, and having several friends in the intelligence community, I can tell you first hand that the United States has VERY dirty hands that would shock the average citizen should such become common knowledge, but it wont however. We are not always the good guys most Americans think we are, but from everything Ive read and heard, we are the better of the bunch and the intent is genuinely good, but as for the results, well ... its not always so good. That little tidbit aside, what the average American knows even about there own OVERT foreign policy is abysmal let alone the secret COVERT operations.

  American ignorance about the rest of the planet is astonishing to say the least. When visitors from other countries come to the states, they invariably do their best to observe local customs and even try their best to speak the local language. On the other hand, Americans visiting foreign lands assume the populace should adapt to the superior American ways, and funny as it may sound, they think that if they say the words s-l-o-w-l-y anyone can understand their brand of English.

  Other things to consider are that there is indeed some amount of jealously because we are who we are; the lone so-called superpower, God I hate that term. Our very existence IS A THREAT to some who wish to keep their people living in the 16th century. The current ruling class would loose much if not all of its power should their citizens become Americanized, which is why we are a threat to some. Yes some people hate us for what we are. Some hate us for what we do. Some hate us for what we dont do, as in not doing enough.

  IMHO, overall the world IS a better place because America exists and has great power and influence, however there is MUCH room for improvement not only in the way our government operates, but also how our citizens look at the rest of the planet and how they act when we visit other nations.

  Freeman (Being serious for a change and not inciting a flame-war as I like to do now an then).
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  JT

  One of the most interesting things about the USA - regardless of all the bad politics, presidents like Shoot em up Bush or drop my pants and suck this Clinton, silly fools in congress, Rap music, Playboy Mags in every store -

  is it not amazing that the usa still remains one of the top countries that folks are dying to get into- folks come over on rafts, ship containers, walk across the mexico rivers

  when you consider how many countries there are in the world --what percentage do you think exp a problem with folks trying to BREAK IN ILLEGALLY- 50% 70% HOW ABOUT 80% OF all nations have a problem with folks trying to break into their country

  YEA RIGHT

  if anything most folks are trying to get the HE!! out-

  in fact most countries that make up what is known as the west usually have that problem and it is due in part to this little thing called Freedom, while some would say we got big brother looking over our shoulder and to a degree i would agree, but when you talk to folks who grew up under DICTATOR TYPE COUNTRIES you almost want to cry at many of the simple things we take for granted here in the west-

  when i think about how Lady "C" and i can travel anywhere in the usa and not be stopped and ck - just for the hell of it like in many countries where they have ck points every 2 miles as it were

  and then on top of that if i am stopped and i dont'; like the way i am treated and can SUE and end up with millions of dollars RETIRE TO BOCA RETON . FL and tool around in my 65 ft cigrette boat- only in amerca can one do that, yet in other countries you have no rights what soever

  so while we have many areas to improve on, at this point i am at least thankful for the fact that i don't have to live under the gov. that so many persons around the earth do-

  as a black man i see the racial issues in this country first hand, yet i also see the beauty as well

  be thankful for the progress made and help to improve the progress for the future is how all of us should live and strive for- being a jw i was never allowed to praise anything good about this country the USA all i could ever do was look for what was wrong and yes there is much wrong, but there is also much that is good- at least be willing to call a spade a spade--

  many folks around the world can't get enough of america style life be it McDees, Burger King, Men in Black or good old Walmart-

  the countries who dislike the USA the most------ interestingly have very litttle to offer the mordern world in terms of mordern day conviences, - looking back centuries ago many of these nations were the birth place of mordern science and medicine - yet today you would have no idea of their greatness back in 1255 CE-

  take cars for examples i have yet to see one car come out of a Muslium nation or even China,

  you consider they have over a billion folks and in the year 2003 almost

  they have nuclear weapons yet they still have large percentages of their population farming with cows and bulls

  in america no farmer would be caught dead without his John Deere tractor- smile

  so while i fully agree america has some goofy foriegn policy on the books folks just loves coming here or benifiting from the things amercia offers the world
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  hawkaw

  Path ... are you blind????

  Here let me quote:

  I believe this was a global survey carried out by a Washington based institution (emphisis added)

  A Washington based institution has got the Democratic party written all over it. Look who they interview for the story - friggen "Halfbright". This story is nothing more than the Democrats trying to "sell" to the American people a different view on this issue.

  With regards to people believing that the American government wants to take over the Iraqis oil patch, a lot of people seem to miss the American policy with this entire area. Yes it is ALL about oil BUT the American government sure as hell does NOT want to control the OIL. The oil companies like Royal Dutch Shell, Exxon etc.... now they want to control the Iraqis oil but not the American government.

  What the American government wants is REGIONAL STABLIZATION. Thus, oil stays cheap, people don't get it in their heads to start attacking American interests and thus, a majority of American voters are happy people who will vote for the Administration come next election.

  That is what this is all about. Now whether we should go to war over it all ??? I'm NOT convinced but that is where we will be come the "window of opportunity" in "January/February 2003" and I have to face that reality.

  As for the "tent" comment, I just don't know sometimes with some people in this Country. Our forces do a lot of serious stuff that few hear about in this country. I blame the Canadian government for not showing the Armed forces off more and of course I blame the press for all the jokes they crack about the forces. What we did in the Baltic as supposed peace keepers was breath taking while the Americans sat at home. What our "special forces" troops did in Halfganistan was just as amazing. Seems everyone forgets we are out at sea enforcing stopping and boarding ships around Iraq and Afganistan. And on and on I could go - never mind the 120,000 lost in WW 2, Korean War, Cyprus etc. And yes, we have a serious base in the Saudia Arabia/Barain area that is fully staffed and ready to got with "state of the art" equipment just like we had the base in Lars Germany for years too. Yeah we can laugh at the sub fiasco, the helicopter issue or the military uniform issue and the Somolia inicdent but what the Canadian military has done for its country and this big old world over the years and personel who have died for this country is huge. And it does carry a lot of of "state of the art" equipment that we can and have used in serious battles over the years. Of course few in the Toronto area of this country even recognize the number of people saved by the armed forces search and rescue squad based out of Trenton - they would rather look at the miltary as a big joke and a big waste of money than a group who saves lives.

  Of course no government in the world spends money per capita like the American government on its military and Canada does not spend as much per capita on its military compared to a lot of countries. But Canada, for a country of 30 million, is holding its own - even when we had a serious budget problem in the late 1980s and early 1990s.

  Lately in this country with the buildings downed in NYC and budget in surplus, "hawks" have seized on an opportunity to force the Canadian government to spend more on its military. The "hawks" used the jokes of the sub issue or the helicopter issue as way to "poke the government" to spend more. The press took it hook line and sinker and ran with the stories. And the government has responded by significantly increasing the DoD budget over the next few years. So the military will be looked after for years to come. Of course we know who really wins in all of this .... why its the friggen defence contracting industry (and psst .... that is who the "hawks" represent).

  hawk

  Edited by - hawkaw on 5 December 2002 10:38:32
• 

  Realist

  hawk,

  for what??? why do you want the canadian government to spend more money on the military???

  freeman,

  very good post...however, i don't think the idea behind intervening in foreign countries is genuinly good...its not most of the time...its aimed at protecting US industry interests and NOT to help the poeple in the respective country or the average american!

  do you really think the US freed kuwait to help the kuwaities? or bombed vietnam to help the vietnamese? or put sanctions against japan before 1942 to help the chinese and koreans? in all these cases it was not the main intention to help people but to protect the US industry and US influence in the world.
• 

  borgfree

  I would just like to say, I think there are some good posts on this thread. I especially like the reasoning of Freeman, Amazing, JT, and Hawkaw, not necessarily in that order.

  I believe, that sometimes, there are misunderstandings when we discuss topics like this one, with people from many different countries. I will speak for myself, but I do know many people who think the same way.

  I do not think most Americans look at the UK, Canada, Australia and some others countries as rivals, someone we must compete with for world power or anything else. I have always considered those countries as partners (maybe family) in keeping the world relatively safe and free.

  Americans have a different sense of humor (humour) sometimes, and that humor is not always understood by everyone. We will joke about England, or Canada, etc., but I do not think any American would like to be without the above mentioned countries as friends.

  As someone always says, just my 2c.

  Borgfree
• 

  Incense_and_Peppermints

  U.S. popularity has plunged across much of the world amid mounting perceptions that the United States is running roughshod over other nations

  they love to hate us, don't they? America is the greatest country on the planet.

  

  

  
• 

  hawkaw

  realist,

  for what??? why do you want the canadian government to spend more money on the military???

  You misread my post and the information I provided. I said the "hawks" want the Canadian government to spend significantly more money and not me.

  hawk.
• 

  freeman

  Realist,

  You said:

  freeman,

  very good post...however, i don't think the idea behind intervening in foreign countries is genuinly good...its not most of the time...its aimed at protecting US industry interests and NOT to help the poeple in the respective country or the average american!

  do you really think the US freed kuwait to help the kuwaities? or bombed vietnam to help the vietnamese? or put sanctions against japan before 1942 to help the chinese and koreans? in all these cases it was not the main intention to help people but to protect the US industry and US influence in the world.

  Realist,

  By your statement I perceive that you believe the following:

  1. Intervening in the affairs of foreign countries is not good.

  2. Protecting American industry interests, the interest of the Vietnamese, Kuwaitis, Chinese and Koreans are mutually exclusive.

  All I can say is that IMO the American government believes they have some responsibility (some of it for generally noble reasons and some it self-imposed for political ends) to interfere in world affairs and sometimes they run roughshod of world sentiment when they flex their muscles. What some fail to see is the truly simplistic mindset of our American government. The mindset is so simplistic that its almost unfathomable to some. In a nutshell it is this what is good for America is also good for the rest of the world.

  When they bombed the crap out of North Vietnam and North Korea, they thought they were protecting the world (and themselves) from the advancement of communism. When they bombed the crap out of Iraq and forced the Iraqis out of Kuwait, they believed they were protecting the worlds oil supply from the dictates of a madman. We are going to do it all over again.

  Think of it as a cowboy type attitude, because that is more or less what it is. Im not defending it, nor am I condemning it, but that is what it is. Of course I may be completely off base because these are only my thoughts.

  Freeman