"Silentlambs" was the "Messenger...

by Gilgamesh 46 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse

  • Gilgamesh
    Gilgamesh

    Bill Bowen may be more important than some of us think he is.

    There was a post back in July this year that began:

    Wycliffe, Tyndale,..........Bowen

    http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.aspx?id=33120&site=3

    The poster downplayed the significance, but many JWs would recognize that 2 out of 3 were already on the JW's most recent list of "Messengers throughout the Ages." (The official list contains Wycliffe, Tyndale, etc., and Russell as the 7th and last.)

    The modern-day JW religion evolved initially from Russell one who ultimately saw himself as the wise and discerning "7th Messenger" of Revelation. Russell apparently did his best to act the part. But the personality of Rutherford soon permeated those JW beginnings, and they still can't get the stench out. In my opinion, Knorr provided well for the survival of the organization by trusting JWs to stand up on their own (to a point), with the ability to put JW formulas into their own words -- without relying on phonographs and sound car recordings. Of course, Knorr used these people as marketers for the JW product (printed books and a promise).

    According to these familiar JW organizational templates, it shouldn't surprise us that lofty goals can be frustrated, after which leaders may sink to the low road. Survival of an organization with such problems will depend on education and the trust to allow followers to stand more strongly on their own two feet to get back on track. Bill Bowen, in my opinion, has tended to stay too long in the tyrannical "Rutherford era." He's called down evil upon his enemies, has seen enemies where they don't exist and has shown himself too anxious to treat people merely as followers, incapable of walking on their own.

    On May 8, 2001, Bill Bowen reposted his January 5, 2001 post from H2O ( http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.aspx?id=27214&site=3) where he threatens to take down the Watchtower. He even called himself "the messenger" like Jehu, "just one man who was right and as a result killed about everyone in charge of god's organization at that time." Bill said:

    I am the most dangerous threat to the wt organization . . . and whatever you do to me will just make things worse for wt. . . . try to df me and silence the messenger. ... The silentlambs will speak, wt will be silenced and humiliated. [formatting mine]

    Does this messenger as a modern day Jehu, have a call to action? Bill makes it clear in his post: ( http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.aspx?id=38041&site=3 )

    When Jehu looked up at the window and asked, "Who is with me?" those men in "high places" had to make a choice. They had to either do what they knew in their hearts was right or they could have waited on Jehovah. Sometimes you have to grab evil and throw it out the window. While I claim no special dispensation, I stand before you now and say,"Who is with me?"

    On July 12, a poster named "messenger" questioned the ethics of one Ray Franz and gives a reason for not reading his books. Inexplicably, he signs that post "silentlambs" as if silentlambs = messenger.

    I know I covered some of this material before, in my very first thread here, when "messenger" went so far as to associate Ray Franz with Charles Manson. But, being new here, I missed a very important clue when I wrote that email. I'll explain it in the next post.

    Gilgamesh

    Edited by - Gilgamesh on 23 December 2002 12:11:55

    Edited by - Gilgamesh on 23 December 2002 12:12:46

  • Gilgamesh
    Gilgamesh

    The reason I posted what I did above is that I just read an interesting thread that Simon started yesterday at:

    http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.aspx?id=42929&site=3

    Simon explains that those cryptic characters to the left of most posts helps identify posters who post under two names. He said:

    Basically, it's a way of making it visible if people are posting from the same IP address without displaying the actual addresses themselves.

    There is another thread that speaks of the dangers about making very broad assumptions about how much can be read into these numbers. It says much time was wasted on H20 by people making false assumptions about these characters.

    http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.aspx?id=22089&site=3

    I just got through reading over three thousand of these IP hash numbers and had noticed only a few posters on this forum who ostensibly use two different names on the same machine (or proxy IP address).

    1. Me. (I would have known anyway. I first came on the forum thinking of a name that just seemed too pretentious, considering the topic, so I picked another one. I later used the pretentious one for more general chatter.)

    2. Another is Mulan and bigred.

    ZJOzzE2CKkehfUp2Li4wdg mulan

    ujlMRHilAAnYhmmel3LB1Q mulan

    x8XzBMUCaaAHyr0e8SwJUQ mulan

    3svQH4+FfSdXIBS7R/q9KQ Mulan

    3svQH4+FfSdXIBS7R/q9KQ bigred

    lgIGJwD5Ajd2aqTTjmCUqA mulan

    lgIGJwD5Ajd2aqTTjmCUqA bigred

    Fq/HvuIr3nCQpdxfhsIefQ mulan

    Fq/HvuIr3nCQpdxfhsIefQ bigred

    3. Prisca and Prisca2 8AqVn+oJs6ESFjKN0cYtKQ

    4. Another was silentlambs ( iC4d1G74lCYTe2nO5iycug) and messenger (iC4d1G74lCYTe2nO5iycug).

    I actually found a few more after that but by then I was greatly helped by then from a thread I ran across while looking:

    http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.aspx?id=42619&site=3&page=3

    Simon, if I had seen that explanation of the characters when I first started posting, I wouldn't have had to go to as much "linguistic" trouble to identify silentlambs as messenger. And do you know what are the odds that two unrelated posters who are not part of a mega-proxy account will have the same hashed IP? What would be the odds if I found additional "duplicate/crossed" IP addresses?

    And, to think, Simon must have known it all along!

    Gilgamesh

    Edited by - Gilgamesh on 23 December 2002 12:7:28

  • Simon
    Simon

    Before you go leaping to the wrong conclusions about some duplicate accounts ...

    ... remember that people visit others and post from their machines so it's important not to take a single post as evidence. However, if peple are visiting or at the same location then it usually means there is some link between them, even if they are not the same person (ie. they could be partners or friends).

    However, some accounts *are* duplicates.

    Edited by - Simon on 23 December 2002 12:30:31

  • Gilgamesh
    Gilgamesh

    Thanks Simon,

    I saw a lot of posts about duplicate accounts, the meaning of the characters under the profile, and the possibility that when you upgrade next weekend (?) some posts might be lost. Since I had previously put several hours into trying to figure out if there was a relationship, I still had an interest in knowing if these characters were useful evidence for what I had been looking for.

    The more meaningful "silentlambs" as "messenger" post is the one that may help understand the organizational mindset of silentlambs as he revealed it under his own name. If there was a connection between him and the poster who went by the name messenger, then I didn't want all evidence to be gone before I had one last chance to discuss the meaning of the evidence.

    I realize that if it's true, there are some curious ideas that were expressed by messenger in several posts which might be hard for some to synchronize with their expectations about Bill. Also, even if it's true, no one should waste their time connecting someone's "silly" persona with their "official" persona. They probably had expectations of privacy which it would be wrong to try to disclose.

    But, then again, I also thought it wasn't a bad time to try to diagnose what is going wrong here. Better a diagnosis than an autopsy.

    Gilgamesh

    Edited by - Gilgamesh on 23 December 2002 12:46:19

  • Simon
    Simon

    The 'loosing posts' during the changeover was only if I changed over to the new software and for some reason it all went horribly wrong, I would have to change back and *could* loose the posts made since being on the new format. It would only be a few hours worth (a day at most) that would go if it did happen and none of the existing posts will be lost.

    I will be looking at automating the display of duplicate accounts using other methods than just IP addresses. The intention is that it will list potential duplicates within the profile.

  • Gilgamesh
    Gilgamesh

    Simon,

    I'm glad to hear it won't be any old posts, this place is still an excellent reference about recent JW and ex-JW history. I missed H2O and I have barely scratched the surface here.

    I wonder how everyone will accept a policy/profile that identifies the duplicates. I ran across quite a few examples where I thought the duplicate name was obvious and perhaps just there to get past a posting limit.

    But there were some names where apparently, a person wished to keep a specific focus and reputation attached to a certain name, and it might have caused problems if he had been forced to use that same name to make posts on unrelated issues. Certain names may have already built up a certain useful reputation. If that type of name now was being used to ask serious questions, engage in certain controversies, or to express doubts about God and the Bible it might have unnecessarily offended some of the people who had come to respect what the first name.

    I don't know if this problem is serious to anyone, but I suspected it might be a problem for at least one person. Also for myself, it's quite OK with me to combine and show both names. But one needed more anonymity because I try to help both JWs and exJWs without letting those goals interfere with each other. Also, I speak of my children and offer many more items of information that would identify me with one name vs. the other.

    Some might be offered the choice privately if they want to discontinue one of their id's rather than have them both displayed.

    Gilgamesh

    Edited by - Gilgamesh on 23 December 2002 13:17:42

  • Simon
    Simon

    I've come to the conclusion that duplicate accounts very often equals trouble.

    If people have duplicate accounts and are not trying to hide it then they are not normally causing trouble (just trying to beat the posting limits to argue or post fluff ) but there is a definite correlation between people having duplicate accounts and people who go on to cause trouble.

    Maybe it's that they are trying to decieve and either trick people or get information about them with one account to then attack them with another ... I don't know. Personally, I can't see the point but the people concerned always tend to show the same personality traits.

    I did used to have a separate account myself (Caliban) that has been covered in the past when I thought it would be nice to be able to join in as 'not the forum owner' but in practice is was too much trouble.

  • SLOAN
    SLOAN

    Gil,

    We DO NOT Need another person coming to this board just to BASH BILL BOWEN. If you haven't noticed, there are already many way ahead of you in this attack on him and his character. I know that I am NOT alone in being SICK to death of all you hateful BASHERS!!!!!!!!!!! Don't you have anything better to do than to attack a man you DO NOT EVEN KNOW???????????????

    GET A LIFE!!!!!!!!!

  • hillary_step
    hillary_step

    Sloan,

    We DO NOT Need another person coming to this board just to BASH BILL BOWEN. If you haven't noticed, there are already many way ahead of you in this attack on him and his character. I know that I am NOT alone in being SICK to death of all you hateful BASHERS!!!!!!!!!!!

    Steady on now - no person is, or should be beyond criticism, neither BB, myself or your good self. On these discussion Boards people can only judge the character of a person on what they read.

    Might I ask you if you have 'bashed' the GB before? If so have you met them personally? Most pronounce on the character of these men quite gleefully without ever having met them. For the record, I know a number of them and find them individually to be of good character, however wearing their GB hat they are collectively as ruthless and uncaring a collection of men as you may be likely to meet.

    Character assassinations based on gossip and rumor are disgusting. Character assessments based on a persons own words and noted actions are another matter altogether. The sooner this is recognized the better.

    HS

  • wednesday
    wednesday
    I just got through reading over three thousand of these IP hash numbers and had noticed only a few posters on this forum who ostensibly use two different names on the same machine (or proxy IP address

    I totally agree with Sloan, i would try and find something else to do with my time. Its the holiday season , remember?

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