Long Intro From A Long Timer (page 4)

COMF

I am not sure that I fully understand

Which words did you not understand?

COMF

think41self

Step,

Thanks for explaining the name, I was wondering about that.

As for giving you the benefit of the doubt, that is one of the greatest things that has come from my freedom from the org...the ability to think for myself, and not judge people. When I remember the smug, self righteous,judgemental person I used to be, I shudder!

I was wondering how you were able to stay in the org. so long if you knew their teachings were not correct. It seemed to me the cognitive dissonance would have been overwhelming! But I understand making the choice for loved ones, that is the only thing that kept me in for the last 2 years I was there. But 20 years!! Egads, man, you must have the patience of a saint:) And I'll bet you've developed some pretty hefty leg muscles from struggling up Everest, so at least you got some benefit from the experience:)

Take care, think

Tina

hs,
You totally missed what I was saying,,,I thought I was clear,I know about incidents in the world,I was/am in the medical field> Excuse me,but you are not handing me any new revelations here.. You condescend to me as if I were unaware of global issues. Im gonna leave it at this,because I dont interact w/ folks who so magnamously ''talk down to me'. enjoy the board,

hillary_step

COMF & SIXOF NINE

I misread 'serial rape-murder' and interpreted it as 'serial killer' - my apologies. No nothing good in this act or any such acts. I was trying to speak of persons and not activities, obviously I failed and confused the issue. My apologies.

Where do we go from here?

Stepped on

SixofNine

Hillary, :)

Where do we go from here?

Anywhere but back ;) Maybe to an "ex" convention. That seems to be getting pretty popular around here.

I hope you don't take too much more time, now that your wife is out. Just because it hasn't destroyed you, does not mean that it isn't destroying others.

This world can be a better place, as one superstition after another has the legs knocked out from under it.

Gopher

Hi hillary_step,

Don't feel "stepped on". We value honest explanations over pity! Seriously, going on from here I'd like to know what kept you in the organization for decades and why you feel the need to remain a semi-apologist for it at this point?

I just recently 'came out' after being in it my whole life until the age of 39. After seeing the rough judicial treatment of 2 other people I know (other than myself), and seeing that same treatment being handed out by a significant percentage of JW elders worldwide, as documented on this site, and after reading "Crisis of Conscience" by Ray Franz, I couldn't stomach the thought of any longer staying in an organization whose actions don't line up with its words. I do appreciate some of the organizations teachings, but the heavy-handedness violates the John 13:35 principle that Christians would primarily be known for their love. Instead, this organization has become so big that it now overrules love in favor of knowledge, efficiency and organization-survival over the interests of the tender sheep.

I know I am not saying anything new to you. So why have you not reached the decision to free yourself of complicity in the organization's wrongdoing, hoping that this leopard will change its spots?

Gopher

Flowerpetal

HI Hillary! Welcome!

And by your first post, I gather you are a man; not a lady.

I think being a Christian [bis/b] a struggle and that is what Jesus was talking about when he said the narrow gate would be cramped.

COMF

I was trying to speak of persons and not activities, obviously I failed and confused the issue

You apparently also confuse the issue when attempting to justify your support of the WBTS.

When someone dies because the WBTS claims to speak for God in denying lifesaving medical treatment, do you balance the death in your conscience by thinking, "Well, the organization lies about having God's direction in this matter, but they keep tidy gardens, so it's okay?"

When someone leaves the organization and thereby loses all contact with his parents, children and friends because the society says it must be so, do you excuse the destruction of this person's life and the ongoing torture he endures by telling yourself, "Yeah, but they encourage people to be honest?"

It isn't necessary to support a murderous, deceitful, destructive, parasitic "arrangement" (your word) in order to approve of the good in people. If you pretend otherwise, it is only to yourself that you do so.

COMF

hillary_step

FLOWERPETAL GOPHER & THINK

Thank you for your thoughts.

I read 'Crisis' many years ago and remember RF saying something to the effect that he felt that there were as many true Christian's within the WTS as in any other. I have always held to this view. As far as I can see our instruction from Christ was one so simple that little children could set the lead in it and that is to love God, our fellow man and ourselves. Doing this within the WTS has not been easy but it has also not been impossible. Would Mr Franz have stayed within the WTS had he not been removed from the GB, who knows. He may have felt it more important to stay and try to help change what is clearly an unchangeable system. All of us are are unique and have a unique set of circumstances to grapple with. It is very easy for others to condem the choices others make when they have not 'walked in their moccasins'. As previously mentioned some of the most Christian people I have met have been JW. there seems to be some sort of agreement on this board with this sentiment. In many ways it has been a frustrating couple of decades for me but I have learned a lot about myself and my own motives and I can now collect our lives together with my wife. I happen to believe that it is only on the basis of our individual motives that we can be judged by others or even by Christ. My faith in God and Christ is a independant thing that relies on no other person, organisation or indeed Bulletin Board. Some on this board may aggressively vocalise against the path that others walk and may do so from or selfless or selfish motives how can one tell? Only if one can see the love behind it. Any actions that do not spring out of a genuine love for others has to be suspect and actually is of little interest to me. I am not here to instruct others but to learn from others and I hope that we can all be friends in this strange world.

Stepping Out

hillary_step

COMF

O.K. Lets call it a day. These reciprocative exchanges are of very little benefit and take up far too much time. Think what you wish of me and my motives for the time being. Time is a great teacher.

Now, I am of to take the cat to the vet, she seems to need me a lot more than you do!

Have a good weekend -- Step

We are such stuff as dreams are made of and our little lives are rounded with a sleep - A Willy The Shake approximation

Long Intro From A Long Timer

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