Christianity is the worst disaster in human history! (page 5)

Satanus

Extrabiblical guys never saw jesus did they? Their info is second hand. Why are we going in circles?

SS

We could go on and on about this. If you are genuinely intrested in learning truth from this subject, then you will re-search it well and you will draw your own conclusion. Your conclusion might be different than mine has become. Many have looked at both sides yet each chooses which makes the most sense to them.

To be honest....I wish you were correct and that I could believe in a God who would relieve man of his pain by sending his son to take care of it. Even if you could prove Jesus existed.......it would never help me understand how his pappy could commit the attrocities he commited in the O.T.

Unless some one digs up more evidence than exists now........the debate on this will continue.

I appreciate your convictions and hope you will choose facts and figures over emotions and desires......and I hope I do the same

Gumby

Abaddon

Hi hooberus, I haven't seen this thread pop-up (in fact, haven't seen any threads by you of late) in the shuffle of posts and thus haven't responded thus far.

I'll be happy to go into some of the points you raise, provided you answer the traditional question. I am all in favour of tradition, but don't want it to be so traditional you don't answer it.

I don't think you can pretend it's not the topic either, as you have gone off topic from whether "Christianity is the worst disaster in human history!" or not and are discussing the reality of a historical Jesus and as such my question is completely reasonable and on topic.

Here it is again;

I must ask you why there is no corroberation from contemporary accounts of the dead rising when Jesus was ressurected and going around preaching. People might have noticed this. Even if they weren't dancing to 'Thriller' at the time, people would have probably made some note of large numbers of dead people wandering around.

gumby

Abaddon,

Thats an easy one,

It really did happen. The satanic critics of truth went around to the homes of the people and simply told them.......don't worry folks......were just making a new movie soon to be released called "night of the living dead"....now go back inside....there's nothing to see here.

Gumby

Realist

if one compares what jesus allegedly said in his sermon on the mount and what the outcome was in 1500 years of christianity one can certainly say that this was the greates failure of all times.

hooberus

SS said: Extrabiblical guys never saw jesus did they? Their info is second hand. Why are we going in circles?

Extrabiblical historians like Josephus and Tacitus probably never saw many of the people that they wrote about, yet their testimony of these people is still considered evidence of them being actual historical persons, due to the fact that they lived close to the time and may have had access to records. Also, If you are going to throw out the evidence from Josephus and Tacitus because they never claimed to be an eyewitness of Jesus, then you should also throw out their testimony of any other person that they wrote about whom they never directly calim to have seen for the same reason.

I will be busy for the next few days, but I will return with some more points as well as answer questions as best as I can.

hooberus

gumby even your "infidels site" concludes:

Conclusion
I think there is ample evidence to conclude there was a historical Jesus. To my mind, the New Testament alone provides sufficient evidence for the historicity of Jesus, but the writings of Josephus also provide two independent, authentic references to Jesus.
As for McDowell's other sources for the historicity of Jesus, I think they are inconclusive. There is no evidence that the written works of the church fathers were based on independent sources. Tertullian's reference to Tiberius is inconclusive, as is Africanus' references to Thallus. Africanus' reference to Phlegon is probably an interpolation. The Talmud is too late to be of any value in establishing the historicity of Jesus. Pliny the Younger, Tacitus, and Lucian are not independent witnesses to the historicity of Jesus. Suetonius did not refer to Jesus. And Mara Bar-Serapion's letter is worthless as a witness to the historicity of Jesus.[150]

gumby

gumby even your "infidels site" concludes:

It's not my site. Just one I use

I really don't care what the book concludes. I think the bible is bullshit. Sorry

Azalo

Religion is the worst disaster in human history!

Abaddon

hooberus; when you return (three days?) I would love to see you answer my question.

Christianity is the worst disaster in human history!

Conclusion

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