Watchtower SlangJamaican Patois: Gods son came fe mash up the world😂

by Diogenesister 29 Replies latest social humour

• 

  Anony Mous

  @slimboyfat:

  Jamaican Creole (which has many versions, every parish in Jamaica has different words) is a spoken, phonetic dialect, it has no official written rules, although someone created a written system for it, the same word written can mean different things based on region and sound inflection. The official language of Jamaica is standard English.

  The translation of the New Testament was done by a Lutheran ministry. The flag on the Bible was placed as a sign of Jamaican independence and national pride and by the publishers, the whole project is a movement in the political sphere to make Jamaican Patois the official language of Jamaica. Very few things are written in Jamaican Patois, most of the literary work in this language thus far is by activists.

  That is why this is so ‘weird’, they’re putting themselves in the political fight that is the relatively recent movement (comparable to BLM/Antifa in US) to have Jamaica shed association with its global (African, European and Caribbean) roots and replace “oppressive” standard English with a variation of its “liberated” or to some “slave” language. Note that not all Jamaicans agree that this is “proper” or the future or that you should even standardize an unwritten Creole language.
• 

  slimboyfat

  Ah so the flag is on the cover of an outside Bible translation. That makes sense. I guess all decisions about language are “political”, you can’t get away from that. But for people who appreciate having Watchtower literature in their everyday language it is a good move to provide it. Others who don’t appreciate it don’t need to use it and can continue using English. If some people feel diminished or politically wrong footed because other people now have the freedom to make a different language choice than they would make (to use creole WT literature) then that’s a pretty self-centred attitude and I wouldn’t worry about such people.
• 

  Anony Mous

  @slimboyfat: I look forward to seeing more translations of WTBTS literature in other politically charged written conlangs:

  Ebonics; Scots; Irish; Esperanto; Toki Pona; Klingon; Flemish; Walloon; High Valerian
• 

  Duran

  I'm thinking of that scene in the movie Airplane,

  scene one

  First Jive Dude: Shiiiiit, maaaaan. That honky muf' be messin' mah old lady... got to be runnin' cold upside down his head, you know?
  
  Second Jive Dude: Hey home', I can dig it. Know ain't gonna lay no mo' big rap up on you, man!
  
  First Jive Dude: I say hey, sky... subba say I wan' see...
  
  Second Jive Dude: Uh-huh.
  
  First Jive Dude: ...pray to J I did the same-ol', same-ol'!
  
  Second Jive Dude: Hey... knock a self a pro, Slick! That gray matter backlot perform us DOWN, I take TCB-in', man!
  
  First Jive Dude: Hey, you know what they say: see a broad to get dat booty yak 'em...
  
  First Jive Dude, Second Jive Dude: ...leg 'er down a smack 'em yak 'em!
  
  First Jive Dude: COL' got to be! Y'know? Shiiiiit.

  __________

  scene two

  Randy: Can I get you something?
  
  Second Jive Dude: 'S'mofo butter layin' me to da' BONE! Jackin' me up... tight me!
  
  Randy: I'm sorry, I don't understand.
  
  First Jive Dude: Cutty say 'e can't HANG!
  
  Jive Lady: Oh, stewardess! I speak jive.
  
  Randy: Oh, good.
  
  Jive Lady: He said that he's in great pain and he wants to know if you can help him.
  
  Randy: All right. Would you tell him to just relax and I'll be back as soon as I can with some medicine?
  
  Jive Lady: [to the Second Jive Dude] Jus' hang loose, blood. She gonna catch ya up on da rebound on da med side.
  
  Second Jive Dude: What it is, big mama? My mama no raise no dummies. I dug her rap!
  
  Jive Lady: Cut me some slack, Jack! Chump don' want no help, chump don't GET da help!
  
  First Jive Dude: Say 'e can't hang, say seven up!
  
  Jive Lady: Jive-ass dude don't got no brains anyhow! Shiiiiit.
• 

  silentbuddha

  My wife is Jamaican, and the vast majority of her family still live there. When she saw this, she asked me after a quick glance why I wanted her to try to read something in Spanish. I’ve been told her to look closely at it and it took her close to 30 seconds to realize what it was.

  She said this makes no sense because everyone in Jamaica learns to read in normal English. This would be the equivalent of learning another language. She then sent it to most of her family members who died laughing because most of them had no idea what they were looking at, and when they realized what it was, they were offended.
• 

  NotFormer

  silentbuddha, that the WT would, in trying to look good, would feed into a stereotype and come off looking condescending? Perish the thought! 🧐
• 

  slimboyfat

  @slimboyfat: I look forward to seeing more translations of WTBTS literature in other politically charged written conlangs:
  Ebonics; Scots; Irish; Esperanto; Toki Pona; Klingon; Flemish; Walloon; High Valerian

  You are telling on yourself. You think the language of Scots, Irish, Flemish, Walloons, and African Americans is to be mocked by comparing it with Klingon and High Valyrian? Isn’t that somewhat ignorant, not to mention less progressive than WT. Is that where you want to be? And for your information, WT literature is already translated into Irish and has been for over a hundred years. “A language is just a dialect with an army”, as they say. To empower the everyday languages disparaged and degraded by more powerful neighbours as “dialects” is a smart move as well as an ethical one and I applaud it.
• 

  Anony Mous

  @slimboyfat: I speak at least 2 and understand at least 4 of those languages (and no, it's not Klingon). The idea that they are supposed to be 'written' is the disconnect here.

  They're unwritten dialects, the idea that they should be written can be considered condescending, rude, politically motivated but an outside entity from the USA suddenly 'speaking' a language that they don't know, have no proper translators for and don't understand the history of just to convert people.

  It's mostly extremists that are looking to promote this idea that a language is "better" or "proper" when it is written, whether it is colonists and missionaries or modern "highly educated" activists (notoriously, all those groups historically belong to the same political side), they all have the same motivation - let the educated tell you how to speak, read and write - if you speak a language where you can't do that, then you're not 'smart'.

  As the above said, you can't show this to a 'real' Jamaican, because they don't know what it is, the written language of Jamaican Creole was created by an elite class for their own feel-good educated class politics. The orthography was literally invented by demand of the government and a few highly educated rich people in Jamaica a few decades ago and it hasn't caught on for a reason. Just like there is no written language of Flemish, Ebonics etc, and trying to solidify those languages into a strict written language with grammar and rules is sorely misunderstanding the historical and cultural reasons for its existence.
  
• 

  slimboyfat

  Then it’s a bit bizarre that you cite Irish as an example where it would be as ridiculous as Klingon for WT to publish in that language when they have done so for most of their history.

  The idea that languages have grammar and dialects don’t is what is sorely misunderstanding how language works. All languages/dialects can be written down and used if people find it useful to do so. I only know Scots of the languages you cite, but it is certainly written down, has its own grammar, history and literature. If Watchtower chose to publish in Scots there’d be nothing wrong with that. People who find it useful could use it and people who don’t find it useful could choose not to use it. But to complain about other people choosing to use a written language that you personally choose not to use is a political power play. It’s “get back in your box, you’ve got no right to pretend to be a real language like your bigger neighbour”, type behaviour that belongs better in the 19th century than in the 21st. To claim to speak for all Jamaicans is also something of a stretch. Even if many Jamaicans feel the way you claim (where is the evidence?) that still leaves those who will welcome seeing their everyday language in print and find it inclusive and helpful. Why should they be deprived of it just because others don’t find it useful or because others think it looks/sounds funny?
• 

  Anony Mous

  I think you’re confusing Standard Scottish English with Scots like Doric and Lallan which to my knowledge have a limited written language.

  I see this attempts more as a misguided attempt at “civilizing” the population with a completely different way of thinking about their language and of course a religion.

  WTBTS will have to invent new words in a language that isn’t yours to explain an idea that is culturally foreign - or - more likely, introduce loanwords instead of having the population decide for themselves what the word should be.

  I’m not saying languages can’t evolve a writing system, but forcing it on them (as is the case with Jamaican Creole) is what I have objection with. If you want to preserve the language, we have phonetic writing systems and audio recordings. I’ve already stated that it is currently impossible to distinguish the meaning of words without understanding of the inflection, which you could impose with diacritics but currently not embedded in the proposed written language - purely because the people that made up that written language didn’t understand that fact. Basically the written language of Jamaican Creole is different than the language of spoken Jamaican Patois, its a conlang as much as Klingon and High Valerian is, it has no bearing on the present use of the language or its people.