born again Christians (page 15)

mouthy

O.K. Let "granny"tell you what I believe I was born again on oct 20th 1989 about 9.o.clock.p.m. The first time I was born May 22nd 1927 at 8.00am-My first birth made me an Aylott ( surname) My second biirth made me a Christian ( adopted by Christ) I let my Mum & down many times by not obeying what the said I should do- I have let my Adopted "DADDY" down many times also....I try to obey but my flesh is weak & my spirit is willing. I dont go to church. But we have two or three gathering together many,many times. ( We talk about what we believe ,we encourage each other) not all are born again ,some are Atheist.... Hey we love each other. I believe I will see Jesus face one day... Do I believe in hell? well when the WT kicked me out I felt I was there, cut off from God!!! So I believe it will be a "cutting off" been there done that. But the joy I have from KNOWING I dont have to work, I have a husband, friend, Savior , Judge, Lord , in my life presents Himself TO ME as GOD..... Gives me a peaceful feeling & I have to say I love evereyone- even if I dont particually like em!!! ( Shutting the door behind me cos I know some of you will say "Oh No there goes old Mouthy again -she to old to flame..... Let her rattle on guys....(((( HOPE YOU ALL KNOW HIM TOO ONE DAY )

amen

Hey JT,

Since you on this board at the same time as i am and at work. I meet everyday Jw's in my building on the street everyday. I fade away it is just a matter of time they will find out about my state. How would you deal with former members that you meet on the street. I know once they find out about me it will be a shock since i know so many people in that city everywhere i go i meet one and they always asking the same question how is your congregation.

amen

bebu

A couple of analogies work for me.

Consider that you are in an apartment building that is on fire, and you have heard by loudspeaker that it is imperative to get to the stairways and fire exits. And to let others know this as well. On your way to the exits, you are pounding on the doors and trying to get the attention of the people inside, telling them the info that you were given.

Some won't open the door. Some hear your message (maybe turn off the TV to hear the loudspeaker) but decide it's just a prank. Some grab their kids and go, too. You head down the stairs, out onto the lawn. The firemen are going up on ladders, trying to get attention from others who were unable to be reached by other methods. They will take them down on ladders, if they can persuade the tenants to open the windows. They have a helicopter attempting another rescue.

The point is, the information you've been given, you go with. God is able to reach each person even if they didn't hear "loudspeakers". But each able-bodied person, of their own accord, can refuse to open a window, or refuse to believe the firemen's word that they are in danger. People can refuse to be saved.

CS Lewis wrote, in effect, that God's intention is to save every person, and will do this, unless He is refused.

This is why I feel confident that those who hunger and thirst for righteousness--no matter what part of the world, no matter what time period, no matter if they've heard the name of Christ or not--have the ability to respond and be saved. But, as Lewis puts it,

"We do know that no man can be saved except through Christ; we do not know that only those who know Him can be saved through Him...

"Why is God not landing in force, invading (the world)? Is it that He is not strong enough? Well, Christians think that He is going to land in force; we do not know when. But we can guess why He is delaying. He wants to give us the chance of joining His side freely. I do not suppose you and I would have thought much of a Frenchman who waited until the Allies were marching into Germany and then announced he was on our side. God will invade. But I wonder whether people who ask God to interfere openlyl and directly in our world quite realize what it will be like when He does. When that happens, it is the end of the world. When the author walks on the stage the play is over. God is going to invade, all right: but what is the good of saying you are on His side then, when you see the whole natural universe melting away like a dream and something else--something it never entered your head to conceive--comes crashing in; something so beautiful to some of us and so terrible toothers that none of us will have any choice left? For this time it will eb God without disguise; something so overwhelming that it will strike either irresistable love or irresistable horror into every creature. It will be too late then to choose your side. There will be no use saying you choose to lie down when it has become impossible to stand up. That will not be the time for choosing; it will be the time when we discover which side we really have chosen, whether we realized it before or not. Now, today, this moment, is our chance to choose the right side. God is holding back to give us that chance. It will not last forever. We must take it or leave it." (Mere Christianity, Chap. 5, last couple of paragraphs.)

Lewis beautifully puts this thought into an allegory, in "The Last Battle".

Perhaps this will help clarify for folks who think that being BA is required of every person--it is required if you have been entrusted with the gospel. Being born again is a bit like zen: the more you try to put it down on paper, the more it loses. Anyone can make theologically correct statements--but be cut off from knowing God. Being born again is a condition where, simply repenting and believing in Christ, we experience and know the God who is already (in a technical sense) so close to us.

This is my experience. I don't know if this will help. If you ask a question, I won't be able to post for many hours!

bebu

Nikita

Mouthy, loved your testimony!

Leslie

LittleToe

Bebu:

But, as Lewis puts it, "We do know that no man can be saved except through Christ; we do not know that only those who know Him can be saved through Him..."

Can you give me book and page, for that quote. I must have missed it.
I love it, and would love to pull it out, for use with my detractors in church.

LT of the "preach toleration in all things" class

bluesapphire

Don't feel bad. JT keeps referring to me as "blue eyes" LOL

DJ

LOL...blue eyes.... I wondered who he was talking to....???

bebu.....nice info.

Mouthy, I would flame you if you deserved it!

LT.....check your PM. love, dj

mouthy

Nikita & Dj Thanks for your comments (( hugs....)))XXX

bebu

Hi Little Toe!

Mere Christianity has had several publishers, so page numbers are not all the same. This is found in chapter 5 ("The Practical Conclusion") of Book One: Right and Wrong as a Clue to the Meaning of the Universe. It's at the very end of the chapter (on pages 64-65 of the 2001 paperback edition by Harper Collins/Zondervan), and the actual end of Book One. I suppose these 'books' would be called sections today. (For the curious: Book 2 is "What Christians Believe", Book 3 is "Christian Behavior" and Book 4 is "Beyond Personality: Or First Steps in the Doctrine of the Trinity", so there's some thought-provoking stuff here.)

I highly recommend this book by CS Lewis to folks here reading this board, Christian or not. It is an easy read (the first couple of chapters are the stickiest; if you can't catch his points, skip on up ahead and come back later, when you have finished the book and are dying to read something else he's written). This is because they are transcripts of 10-minute radio addresses from the BBC during?/after WWII, and the BBC wanted to fill a Sunday night radio spot. The chapters take only about 10 minutes each, and they remind me of many of the kinds of comments and insights many people here have shared here. I read it in high school, and it really helped changed my life, and I know that it has been a great help to many other people as well. It's a classic intro to Christianity. I'll bet most people who've read it can vouch that it does not just help the reader understand the Christian faith, but really helps draw one closer to God.

[Lewis was a converted agnostic/atheist, and was greatly influenced by writer George MacDonald and his friends JRR Tolkien and Dorothy Sayers. He was a Fellow and Tutor in English Lit at Oxford, and later Chair of Medieval and Renaissance English at Cambridge. He died in 1963. Perhaps you have heard of the movie "Shadowlands", a biography of his life with wife Joy Davis (v. interesting). Lewis was a wonderful, colorful fellow and a beloved author. Hope you'll love his stuff as much as I do.]

bebu

Abaddon

I read it in high school, and it really helped changed my life, and I know that it has been a great help to many other people as well. It's a classic intro to Christianity. I'll bet most people who've read it can vouch that it does not just help the reader understand the Christian faith, but really helps draw one closer to God.

I'm glad you like the book; I prefered the Voyages of the Dawn Treader, and the Magician's Nephew myself.

Problem you seem to be ignoring is that it only can "help the reader ... draw one closer to God" if a person has a belief in Biblegod or enculturation in a Biblegod culture and a closed set of external references.

For reasons that have been quite clearly outlined here and in other works of literature and science, belief in Biblegod or any god is PRESUPPOSITIONAL, and relies upon (if upon anything other than inclination and force of will) personal revelation for proof, having no unique unarguable external proof.

If you don't believe in Biblegod beforehand (due to a sciencific viewpoint, or prehaps due to believing in Qurangod or Bhaghadvitagods or whatever), or are agnostic on the grounds of lack of proof, there isn't anything in it that would make you go "gosh, there really is a Bible god". It's an apologetic swansong, preaching to the converted, or those who are apt to be converted, or perhaps more truthfully, those who desire to be re-converted to the traditional folk-ways of their culture.

born again Christians

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