Seeking support ... Where can a Christian go (page 4)

KateWild

DJS,

No she is not. She said she respects why some atheists don't believe in a god. She has shown understanding for their perspectives.

Kate xx

tornapart

Welcome Sevan. The Beorean Pickets website and the Jwstruggle forum are both good for exJws who still want to stay christian. I have found both very helpful.

Sanchy

DJS

Seriously man, check yourself. I'll point out some of the nonsense you wrote:

Why do you find it necessary to talk about Jah and Jesus? Wouldn't you think all of us have had our fill of them? Why would you think it acceptable?

Because it's a forum specifically made for people to talk about such things including "Jah and Jesus". I pointed this out to you but you prove incapable of reasoning on this simple logic.

They are the kindest most decent people I've ever met. Most of them are secular; some of them are very religious.But none of them ever talk about religion. Ever.

There are many kind decent christians too. So what? If this were a forum dedicated to discussing the merits of some sect within the Hindu faith, the n it would be entirely appropriate for Hindu subjects to be discussed.

They are accepting of what anyone wants to believe

Perhaps you should take some lessons from them.

I suggest a new strategy, R2. Keep your x-tian beliefs to yourself. That should solve the problem. Or gather a bunch of emails of like minded x-tians and knock yourselves out.

So, believers should be silenced, in a forum designed to discuss beliefs. Very smart point there DJS

I try to avoid y'all since it causes me to projectile vomit, but y'all can't seem to believe in Jah and Jesus without condemning atheists (me)

I've seen you post your rants in almost all "believer's" threads.

..be open minded and accepting and tolerant of all faiths and beliefs.

Repeat this to yourself, over and over and over again.

If you were in Mother Russia, we would rat you out to Vlad and his Impalers. Or at least I would. That would quiet you.

..so much for your tolerance.

Sorry to have to point you out like this DJS, but you make us non-believers look bad. Grow up.

Sevan

Thank you tornapart for the direction and for others.

DJS, your anger is severe. Your posts are hostile, intolerant and insulting. They actually prove my point. Everyone else that has responded so far, including all other Atheists, have been respectful, except you. I am simply asking not to be personally insulted for having different beliefs than you and I don't think that is too much to ask. I understand and respect why you believe the way you do.

I am absolutely not here to get in theological debates. If someone would like to talk to me about the Bible and Christianity, I would welcome that. If not, I don't see the benefit in debating or proselytizing.

Frankly, I don't accept that you have the right to tell me what I can and cannot talk about. That kind of control is more fitting of the religion I just left.

For me, my faith is highly personal. It is something that personally benefits me emotionally and morally. In no way am I looking down on others that believe differently than me or thinking that I am somehow superior to them. Regardless of their beliefs or lack thereof. I have known very immoral and very moral people of all walks of life and different beliefs.

Sevan

LisaRose, I'm sorry that happened to you at your family gathering. I know it goes both ways.

Believe me when I say that I understand and respect why you don't believe in God. I will do what I can personally to foster a respectful environment in my posts.

I guess that is kind of my point. I hope for less vitriol on both sides.

FayeDunaway

Sevan, I think DJS is using this opportunity to vent against all offending christians ever on this site, not you personally, so don't take it personally.

I know he can be rude but I like DJS, he's smart and witty and really really blunt and doesn't hold back. Probably decades of being stuck in witness world has that effect on a lot of us here, who won't restrain their voices any longer, for anything or anyone.

cofty

DJS - Not cool

Kate - If you can't tell the difference between a personal attack and criticism of ideas then how can I explain it to you? I have never attacked you or any other believer. Why would I? I have evidence on my side.

Sevan - Of course it is entirely reasonable for somebody to say that at this time they are not ready to risk losing their faith. I totally understand that. It took me 9 years after leaving the cult to face up to the fact that I was giving my basic belief in god special protection. My advice to anybody leaving the Watchtower is to forget about the big questions and get on with the more important and practical matters of life. There is plenty of time for all of that much later.

I think the reason I responded to your OP was that you want to "have your cake and eat it". A lot of believers do that. They assert that their belief is based on evidence but they refuse to discuss that evidence. It is more honest to say that your belief is based on a personal emotional need and that it is important to you at this time regardless of the evidence.

We were all captives of a cult because we were restricted from access to a lot of important information. Many of us are determined to never make that mistake again. I will always hold any idea up to rigorous scrutiny. I will never insult people for believing things but I won't give their ideas a free pass either. I was a born-again christian for 9 years after I left the JWs so I really understand both positions.

Christians frequently become hostile and insulting in response to rational challenges. I understand why they do that. Attacking the foundation of somebody's faith feels like an existential threat.

Keep reading, listening and challenging yourself to the extent you feel ready. Ignore hostility on both sides. Best wishes to you and your family.

startingover

Sevan, you made this comment: "I was a believer long before encountering the Jehovah's Witnesses and I will be a believer for the rest of my life,"

Maybe it doesn't matter to you, but that comment really defines you as a close minded person. It's not unlike the comments made by JW's that they will always be a JW.

When I first left, I read and read on forums without making a comment. IMO, the real value for believer-non believer debates is not for someone like you who already has their mind made up, you will just get offended. Challenge to your beliefs will be taken personal. But for those lurking who are new to the world of being able to think for themselves, it can really be enlightening. For me, as I contemplated these debates, discarding belief in invisible beings I was raised with was my only choice. But it is not a choice that cannot be changed with new evidence.

Sevan

Cofty, thank you for your posts.

It is not that I am opposed to the discussion of the evidence for my faith, it is just that I don't see the benefit at this point in my life. I have reasons for my faith, but at this point would rather not get in theological debates. I don't call that wanting to "have my cake and eat it too." I call that respecting my own emotional boundaries at this point in time.

As for evidence, 100% proof of God's existence, that will never happen. There is no way to prove the existence of God, especially the existence of a particular God. If there was, there would be no need for faith.

I fully accept that I do not have all the answers nor will I ever. Each one of us and still all of us together only know an infinitesimal amount of what there is to know in the universe.

Sevan

Thank you for your thoughts FayeDunaway. I will keep them in mind as I study the Bible for the first time without the influence of organized religion. I was raised in the Assemblies of God church before the Jehovah's Witnesses found me in the door to door ministry, so I have always been influenced by organized religion. It should be interesting to just read the Bible on my own now.

Seeking support ... Where can a Christian go

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