RtoN, no the militia is not the military but a citizen army made up of farmers, and trades men who had weapons in the home ready to if need be. Much like in Switzerland. The militia in the SA is not part of the military but every able bodied man who was a citizen of the state he lived in. To change the SA you have to do some very heavy lifting. Good luck with that.
Cause of Mass Shootings Mental Health?
by blondie 150 Replies latest jw friends
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rickroll
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rickroll
If you want to know what the founders thought about firearms here it is in black and white. Rat fink get someone to explain it to you.
"A free people ought not only to be armed, but disciplined..."
- George Washington, First Annual Address, to both House of Congress, January 8, 1790"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms."
- Thomas Jefferson, Virginia Constitution, Draft 1, 1776"I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery."
- Thomas Jefferson, letter to James Madison, January 30, 1787"What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance. Let them take arms."
- Thomas Jefferson, letter to James Madison, December 20, 1787"The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man."
- Thomas Jefferson, Commonplace Book (quoting 18th century criminologist Cesare Beccaria), 1774-1776"A strong body makes the mind strong. As to the species of exercises, I advise the gun. While this gives moderate exercise to the body, it gives boldness, enterprise and independence to the mind. Games played with the ball, and others of that nature, are too violent for the body and stamp no character on the mind. Let your gun therefore be your constant companion of your walks." - Thomas Jefferson, letter to Peter Carr, August 19, 1785
"The Constitution of most of our states (and of the United States) assert that all power is inherent in the people; that they may exercise it by themselves; that it is their right and duty to be at all times armed."
- Thomas Jefferson, letter to to John Cartwright, 5 June 1824"On every occasion [of Constitutional interpretation] let us carry ourselves back to the time when the Constitution was adopted, recollect the spirit manifested in the debates, and instead of trying [to force] what meaning may be squeezed out of the text, or invented against it, [instead let us] conform to the probable one in which it was passed."
- Thomas Jefferson, letter to William Johnson, 12 June 1823"I enclose you a list of the killed, wounded, and captives of the enemy from the commencement of hostilities at Lexington in April, 1775, until November, 1777, since which there has been no event of any consequence ... I think that upon the whole it has been about one half the number lost by them, in some instances more, but in others less. This difference is ascribed to our superiority in taking aim when we fire; every soldier in our army having been intimate with his gun from his infancy."
- Thomas Jefferson, letter to Giovanni Fabbroni, June 8, 1778“They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
- Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759"To disarm the people...[i]s the most effectual way to enslave them."
- George Mason, referencing advice given to the British Parliament by Pennsylvania governor Sir William Keith, The Debates in the Several State Conventions on the Adooption of the Federal Constitution, June 14, 1788"I ask who are the militia? They consist now of the whole people, except a few public officers."
- George Mason, Address to the Virginia Ratifying Convention, June 4, 1788"Before a standing army can rule, the people must be disarmed, as they are in almost every country in Europe. The supreme power in America cannot enforce unjust laws by the sword; because the whole body of the people are armed, and constitute a force superior to any band of regular troops."
- Noah Webster, An Examination of the Leading Principles of the Federal Constitution, October 10, 1787"Besides the advantage of being armed, which the Americans possess over the people of almost every other nation, the existence of subordinate governments, to which the people are attached, and by which the militia officers are appointed, forms a barrier against the enterprises of ambition, more insurmountable than any which a simple government of any form can admit of."
- James Madison, Federalist No. 46, January 29, 1788"The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. A well regulated militia, composed of the body of the people, trained to arms, is the best and most natural defense of a free country."
- James Madison, I Annals of Congress 434, June 8, 1789"...the ultimate authority, wherever the derivative may be found, resides in the people alone..."
- James Madison, Federalist No. 46, January 29, 1788"Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves."
- William Pitt (the Younger), Speech in the House of Commons, November 18, 1783“A militia when properly formed are in fact the people themselves…and include, according to the past and general usuage of the states, all men capable of bearing arms… "To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them."
- Richard Henry Lee, Federal Farmer No. 18, January 25, 1788"Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are ruined.... The great object is that every man be armed. Everyone who is able might have a gun."
- Patrick Henry, Speech to the Virginia Ratifying Convention, June 5, 1778"This may be considered as the true palladium of liberty.... The right of self defense is the first law of nature: in most governments it has been the study of rulers to confine this right within the narrowest limits possible. Wherever standing armies are kept up, and the right of the people to keep and bear arms is, under any color or pretext whatsoever, prohibited, liberty, if not already annihilated, is on the brink of destruction."
- St. George Tucker, Blackstone's Commentaries on the Laws of England, 1803"The supposed quietude of a good man allures the ruffian; while on the other hand, arms, like law, discourage and keep the invader and the plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as well as property. The balance ofpower is the scale of peace. The same balance would be preserved were all the world destitute of arms, for all would be alike; but since some will not, others dare not lay them aside. And while a single nation refuses to lay them down, it is proper that all should keep them up. Horrid mischief would ensue were one-half the world deprived of the use of them; for while avarice and ambition have a place in the heart of man, the weak will become a prey to the strong. The history of every age and nation establishes these truths, and facts need but little arguments when they prove themselves."
- Thomas Paine, "Thoughts on Defensive War" in Pennsylvania Magazine, July 1775"The Constitution shall never be construed to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms."
- Samuel Adams, Massachusetts Ratifying Convention, 1788"The right of the citizens to keep and bear arms has justly been considered, as the palladium of the liberties of a republic; since it offers a strong moral check against the usurpation and arbitrary power of rulers; and will generally, even if these are successful in the first instance, enable the people to resist and triumph over them."
- Joseph Story, Commentaries on the Constitution of the United States, 1833"What, Sir, is the use of a militia? It is to prevent the establishment of a standing army, the bane of liberty .... Whenever Governments mean to invade the rights and liberties of the people, they always attempt to destroy the militia, in order to raise an army upon their ruins."
- Rep. Elbridge Gerry of Massachusetts, I Annals of Congress 750, August 17, 1789"For it is a truth, which the experience of ages has attested, that the people are always most in danger when the means of injuring their rights are in the possession of those of whom they entertain the least suspicion."
- Alexander Hamilton, Federalist No. 25, December 21, 1787"If the representatives of the people betray their constituents, there is then no resource left but in the exertion of that original right of self-defense which is paramount to all positive forms of government, and which against the usurpations of the national rulers, may be exerted with infinitely better prospect of success than against those of the rulers of an individual state. In a single state, if the persons intrusted with supreme power become usurpers, the different parcels, subdivisions, or districts of which it consists, having no distinct government in each, can take no regular measures for defense. The citizens must rush tumultuously to arms, without concert, without system, without resource; except in their courage and despair."
- Alexander Hamilton, Federalist No. 28"[I]f circumstances should at any time oblige the government to form an army of any magnitude that army can never be formidable to the liberties of the people while there is a large body of citizens, little, if at all, inferior to them in discipline and the use of arms, who stand ready to defend their own rights and those of their fellow-citizens. This appears to me the only substitute that can be devised for a standing army, and the best possible security against it, if it should exist."
- Alexander Hamilton, Federalist No. 28, January 10, 1788"As civil rulers, not having their duty to the people before them, may attempt to tyrannize, and as the military forces which must be occasionally raised to defend our country, might pervert their power to the injury of their fellow citizens, the people are confirmed by the article in their right to keep and bear their private arms."
- Tench Coxe, Philadelphia Federal Gazette, June 18, 1789 -
Simon
I think we can do without the endless childish insults. Oh dear, did the nasty man delete the post where you called people names?
"No, you're stupid ..."
Canada has guns, the liberal government here also does that the US democrats do - restrict ownership by law abiding citizens who's guns are not used in crimes and turn a blind eye to criminals importing and using illegal weapons.
The only thing the authoritarian left want is control. They don't care about your safety. In fact, they are happy to sell your safety in exchange for votes.
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sparky1
I am not a gun lover or collector but understand the rights of those who choose to collect and use guns responsibly. Personally I find assault type weapons offensive but my opinion should not trample on the rights of others. That being said, the people who 'misuse' anything (guns, knives, home made bombs, automobiles, vicious trained animals, etc.) to harm other human beings should feel the full force of the law and be subject to severe punishment in the swiftest manner possible. The DEATH PENALTY for mass murderers should be carried out swiftly and to completion. That should begin to slow down anyone thinking of perpetrating such heinous crimes.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/barr-and-doj-drafted-legislation-to-speed-up-death-
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rickroll
My apologies for calling fink stupid, he is ignorant of the facts on guns. It gets me going when someone thinks they know something but knows only the propaganda
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LongHairGal
SIMON:
Yes, I have said this myself: the political Left only want votes and could NOT care less if law abiding citizens are murdered because of social unrest brought about by liberal policies!
And all this TV coverage of these shootings by the liberal media is only because their END game is to ultimately bring about taking guns away from anybody and everybody. They can talk all they want about banning certain types of weapons but I see where it’s going.
Never mind that this constant coverage of shootings will only give ideas to the next unbalanced individual. And I’m still of the opinion that the unhealthy environment in the country is at least partly because of liberal policies!
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frozen2018
There is a point of view that the reason the USA has events like mass shootings is the USA has too much freedom. It does stand to reason that if almost anybody can purchase a firearm, the odds are that occasionally someone with their own agenda will get one, or several, and start shooting people. That "too much freedom" business doesn't apply only to firearms. It also applies to speech, religion, assembly, travel, etc. I do not agree with this point of view.
I do have a point of view regarding firearms (I own several). I"m okay with some firearms being banned as long as that ban applies to everyone, public and private. If I can only have single shot shotguns, bolt action rifles, and revolvers, then those weapons are good enough for government employees at all levels - local, county, state, and federal - including the military. The military could have access to the banned weapons when it is deployed to foreign countries. I know, people will say, "But, but, the government won't be able to protect us unless the government is armed to the teeth" to which I say, "Tough shit!" If people think the government actually protects anyone, you are delusional.
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LV101
The Midland/Odessa criminal didn't even qualify for a gun permit -- or so the ticker tape indicated. Another thug using illegal weapon(s). Figures.
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Finkelstein
My apologies for calling fink stupid, he is ignorant of the facts on guns.
Hardly, your the one that has been caught doing most of lying and being intellectually dishonest.
People can see that as they read your posts.
Nevertheless the point is the sale of assault type guns, aided by selling large capacity clips has shown to enhance the causative forethought by certain individuals toward carrying out a devastating massacre on a group of unsuspecting innocent people..
The facts and statistics show that.
Mind you its not always the case and the facts prove that as well.
The US is just going to continue to suffer through devastating massacres until it removes some of the guns in circulation and perhaps stop selling certain guns and accessories all together.
Other countries have done so with success, so too can the US.
Its a matter of public safety and social responsibility.
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rickroll
Nope fink you have no idea what you are talking about again. Guns would be banned in parts of the country already but we here have a constitution one that sets us apart from the rest of the world. It embodies freedoms not granted by governments but that are integral to being alive. Nations have seen governments do horrible things to its people and first on the list was to disarm them. The truth about Australia and its gun bans are not at CNN or PMSNBC but the facts are elsewhere, https://thefederalist.com/2015/06/25/the-australia-gun-control-fallacy/.
No state can act to ban guns as we have seen in Heller, no congress can out and out ban guns as the SCOTUS will knock that down. They can regulate but there is a line and as long as we have the SC locked up its a no go zone. Hopefully we can get Trump back in for a second term and if Ginsberg will just die already it will be a generation or two before they can unlock it. Not one of the original 10 Amendments has ever been attempted to be repealed and in fact the only one that has ever been done was a horrible one that is the 18th. Its not going to happen. So you libtards can whine about it all you want but its not going to happen, and if they some how do start a civil war by thing to buy back no one but the idiots will turn them in.