Where did evil come from?

by laurelin 30 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • laurelin
    laurelin

    Hi

    I'm new here, I only just found this site the other day so I don't know if I'm repeating something that has already been covered. I'm sorry if I am.

    Can anyone help me on the scripture in Genesis 2v9.

    It says that God created two trees, the tree of life and the tree of knowledge of good and bad. These were put into the garden before Adam and obviously before Adam and Eve sinned.

    If this is the case, does that mean God created bad? In which case I get myself right confused over that issue. Especially if God is Love.

    I have the WTCDROM but I can't find anything on there that even gets close to the question. Something I've found a lot on other things as well.

    Thanks in advance to anyone who can help me on this.

    Laurelin.

  • Golf
    Golf

    Hi Laurelin, greetings and welcome. As to answering your question, stay tuned, answers will be coming your way. Enjoy the company.

    Guest 77

  • Holey_Cheeses*King_of_the juice.
    Holey_Cheeses*King_of_the juice.

    Easy question with a simple answer.

    Evil has been with mankind since the beginning of his existence, but it did not really present itself in its true wickedness until it was conceived in the wombs that bore messrs Russell, Rutherford, Knorr and Franz.

    cheeses - just add some other well-known dubs as you would wish.

  • LittleToe
    LittleToe

    Well, let's just take the story as literal, for a moment...

    Before they ate, they already had it good, and apparently had the sense and reasoning ability to know what to do in this situation.
    They also could have continued eating from the tree of life, which was maybe already part of their diet, since it appears that animals have always died (and humans too).

    Partaking of the fruit of that tree would then seem to indicate that they would also "know evil", in that something bad was going to happen to them that very day.
    Ergo...

    "And lo and behold, God was mightily p*ssed with them, and kicked them out of the garden." (LT Paraphrase of the Holy Scriptures)

    They lost their birthright, and the life they once had.

  • Abaddon
    Abaddon

    As in the same account we are told that the Universe was finished off in six days and that there was light before you could see the stars, it might be a little hasty to assume the account is anything other than a ancient text, similar to many, that is only looked to by people today in the way it is due to the historical accident of Chritianity becomeing a world religion.

    In other words, it's a story, don't sweat it. There are so many things you can take issue with in just the first few pages of the Bible (scietific accuracy, chronological veracity et. al.) the good evil one is minor, well after 'real or made up'. And to answer the 'did god create evil one' mostly involves listening to people's opinions about what a bronze-age goatherd meant, so it would be quicker to flip a coin, and just as enlightning...

  • Brummie
    Brummie

    Evil comes from the hearts of men. I should know, I'm a man.

    Brummie

  • hornetsnest
    hornetsnest

    Hi, laurelin.

    I feel that you will never get an answer to that unless you approach it from another angle. First we need to consider what sin (or evil) is and how it comes about, and then we can go on to that.

    You probably remember James 1:14, 15: "But each one is tried by being drawn out and enticed by his own desire. Then the desire, when it has become fertile, gives birth to sin; in turn, sin, when it has been accomplished, brings forth death." You will note that simply having a desire is not in itself sin. It is only unbridled desire that is acted upon that creates sin.

    Viewed in this way, then, it would be fair to say that it is within the power of anyone or anything possessing free moral agency, to create sin and/or evil. Just as we are not born doctors or philanthropists, so we are not born liars, rapists, or killers. We have to make decisions to become those things.

    Some will say that I am begging the question here, but I'm not. Yes, Jehovah created us with the capacity to create evil, which according to them, makes him culpable for the evil that we create. However, consider a few things:

    If you robbed a bank and when on trial, you used the defense that it is all your parents fault, because if it wasn't for them you wouldn't be there to commit the crime, do you think the jury would buy it?

    Or, say that you make tools or exquisite vases. They have the capacity to kill other people should their owners decide to use them in a wrong manner. Would the owner's malfeasance make you blood guilty?

    Yes, some say, but Jehovah should have created us without that capacity. In other words, what good is free moral agency? It's caused all these problems, so shouldn't it be done away with? Well, put yourself in Jehovah's place. If you wanted a companion, would you want a robot, or someone like yourself, capable of thinking and reasoning --- and disagreeing at times?

    Or, if you wanted a life's companion, would you rather have a vibrator (or blow-up doll), or would you rather have a real live human in spite of the fact that they might have headaches (or fail to shave often enough)? I don't know about you, but I find that choice extremely easy to make. Is it harder? Sure. But the rewards are a million times greater.

    This subject is closely related to the way that many roundly condemn Jehovah for condemning millions of people to death. What they don't consider is again, how? Is he going to hire a batch of mercenaries to go in and merrily blow everyone away? Or could it be that he is merely honoring their demand as free agents to take his old rule book and shove it? One glance at the world today and it is glaringly apparent that we humans don't have the foggiest idea of how to run our own lives, and are running everything straight into the ground with horrendous consequences. But at the same time, we sure as hell aren't about to listen to him! (And don't get him and his desires mixed up with the teachings and desires of the religious leaders --- of any kind. Jehovah himself roundly condemns them as phonies.)

    In my book, those who condemn Jehovah on this basis are barking up a wrong tree, and merely demonstrate one more facit of modern society's penchant for declaring themselves victims --- and then milking it for all it's worth.

    I have no respect for that.

    LoneWolf

  • Narkissos
    Narkissos

    Welcome Laurelin,

    Just two remarks on your interesting question:

    1) The idea that "God" created "evil" was an essential part of the first conception of monotheism (over against Persian dualism):

    I form light and create darkness,
    I make weal and create woe;
    I Yhwh do all these things.
    Isaiah 45:7

    However, monotheism did not maintain itself at this level of "purity" (and sterility) and soon the character of "Satan" was opposed to God, to separate the source of moral "evil" from "God".

    On Satan cf. http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/66758/1.ashx

    2) In Genesis 2--3, IMO, moral "evil" is not involved at all. The story is totally amoral if you think of it. The expression is "knowledge of good and bad", and the key word is knowledge (vs. "life"). In Hebrew the opposition of contraries is a very common way of expressing totality (e.g. "from the small to the great"). The "good" and "bad" may be understood in a very practical way (such as in "good and bad mushrooms"). The story is constructed after the universal puzzle of homo sapiens (= "knowing" man): man has knowledge like the gods, yet he is mortal like the beasts -- and he knows it.

    Cf. http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/12/66748/1.ashx

  • Yerusalyim
    Yerusalyim

    Lauralin,

    God did NOT create evil, but evil was always possible because God gave both angels and humans free will.

    The tree of the knowledge of good and evil, and eating it's fruit, means that when Adam and Eve ate from it, they would decide for themselves what was good and evil, and not rely on God. In other words, they were relying on themselves as moral guides rather than God.

    Don't be mistaken, unlike what JW theology teaches, God DID know Adam and Eve would sin...and there was already a plan of salvation in place.

  • Golf
    Golf

    You have my vote Lonewolf.

    Guest 77

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit