by Yerusalyim 135 Replies latest social current
Yeru,
We have disagreeing viewpoints on many issues but not this time.
Bin Laden has conquered Spain. The Spanish electorate has just handed the terrorists their biggest electoral victory. The Spanish response to the terrorist onslaught--- "retreat, and hope the bully picks on someone else"
Yeru, Excellent synopsis on the Spanish knee jerk reaction to "their" terrorist attack. AND because the terrorists were able to control the political outcome in the Spanish elections don't think for one moment that terrorism won't continue as long as entire nations cave to the violence. I would call this Blood-Blackmail.
The Israelis fight everyday to stop terrorism. Terrorists will never drink enough blood of their own young people. Like the ancient sacrifices to Baal. Ever wonder why old people aren't foolish enough to strap bombs onto their backs?
As President Bush has said time and time again that no matter who joins our fight we will continue with or without those invited. What does this Spanish reaction reinforce about the UN? That as a peacekeeper they have failed. The UN collective needs to remove their leftist politically correct boot from their asses and use some common sense. PEOPLE ARE BEING MURDERED... not soldiers but civilians. Don't any of you Michael Moore wannabees get that? It might be you next time.
'The price of lies'
The reaction of the European press to Spanish voters' rejection of José María Aznar, in the wake of the Madrid bombings, at http://www.guardian.co.uk/spain/article/0,2763,1169810,00.html
Whatever their political allegiances, Spain's newspapers are unanimous today on one thing: that in the wake of the last week's deadly assault on the country's political system, the unusually large turnout in Sunday's general election was a sign that far from being damaged, Spanish democracy has been strengthened and reinforced.
Among the 77% of the eligible population who cast their votes, the liberal-leaning El País notes that young voters and those of the centre-left who stayed at home in the 2000 election that saw José María Aznar returned to power came out in force to deliver what the paper describes as a "serious fiasco" for the outgoing prime minister's Popular party (PP).
In an editorial entitled Of Lies (in Spanish, registration required), the paper delivers Aznar and his government a bitter rebuke, putting its defeat down largely to "inevitable sense of manipulation and deception the electorate felt" over its reaction to the Madrid bombings.
"But as if that was not serious enough, the worst mistake which accompanies Aznar's farewell is his dogged insistence in converting his particular obsessions and questionable ideas about Spain, the Spanish, and the way in which they are governed into dogma," the paper says, before concluding that it was "the manipulation, the lies, the offensive use of the argument of the war against terror to justify just about any policy, the blatant opportunism and puerile arrogance that caused those in power to lose it yesterday.
Under the banner headline 'Spain castigates the PP and puts its trust in Zapatero' (Spanish), the centre-right El Mundo said that voters had "fiercely chastised the PP for its management of the crisis and had presented [the government] with the overdue bill for the war in Iraq."
"Aznar signed the invoice [at pre-war summit with Bush and Blair] in the Azores, and [his successor] Rajoy is paying it now," the paper noted in an analysis similar if less fiercely critical than that of El País.
David Mathieson http://www.guardian.co.uk/spain/article/0,2763,1169666,00.html
Monday March 15, 2004
"Ganamos sin mentiras!" chanted the crowd outside the socialist party (PSOE) headquarters in the centre of Madrid last night: "We have won without lies." Spin was indeed at the centre of PSOE's extraordinary, unexpected triumph, and that should serve as a warning to Tony Blair.
There is no word in Spanish for "spin", but there has been no absence of the practice in Madrid over the last year - and especially in the past few days. The spectacular gains made by PSOE last night were in large part a result of the government's clumsy attempts at media manipulation following the Madrid bombs on Thursday.
As soon as the news of the attacks broke, Popular Party (PP) spokesmen and government ministers denied that the bombings could be the work of al-Qaida. With a general election 72 hours away the stakes could not have been higher. Fearing that voters would be quick to make a link between the carnage at Atocha railway station and Jose Maria Aznar's support for the war in Iraq, the PP began the operation to spin its way out of trouble. The party had just three days to avoid the charge that it had attracted the bombers by supporting a war that was opposed by 90% of Spaniards. A bucketload of seats would be lost - a consequence that had to be avoided at all cost.
There would have been a double bonus for the PP if they could have successfully deflected the blame onto the Basque terrorist group, Eta. A central plank of the government's election platform had been that PSOE are "soft" on Basque terrorism.
The charge arises from the fact that the socialists govern the Catalonia region in a coalition that includes a tiny Catalan independence party. Foolishly, the leader of that party held secret talks with Eta leaders in France just after Christmas. Despite being sacked immediately from the Catalan administration by the socialist president, the charge stuck - the socialists were prepared to do deals with parties that talk to terrorists.
When the bombers struck on Thursday morning, everyone knew that on top of the human misery there would be electoral consequences. The identity of the bombers was crucial. If they were Basque, voters would punish PSOE; but if they were al-Qaida, the PP would lose seats. Supported by a compliant state media machine which Vladimir Putin would be proud of, the government started spinning.
Following the golden rule that the first impression is what counts, the government set about getting their version into the public domain. So the prime minister quickly phoned round the editors of the four national daily newspapers, who dutifully responded by printing special editions reporting what they had been told: it was Eta.
This was followed by a series of press conferences from the interior minister who, without offering any hard evidence, insisted that Eta was responsible and poured scorn on those who had said otherwise. They were, he said, "pathetic", and their alternative theories "poisonous". As a leftwing radio station started to produce a series of reports casting doubt on the official version, the government refused to acknowledge the Copernican revolution that was taking place around them. The spinning went on.
On the night before the election, a crowd of around 5000 surrounded the PP headquarters in Madrid chanting "who was it?". On top of the agony of the bomb, people were furious at government attempts to hide the truth. Yesterday, voters took their revenge.
Yeru' read Michael Moores book,
Now there's a real "expert" for you. Michael Moore can't write/say one sentence without lying misleading stretching the truth. What a dunce. He like's to come off as the common man, when in truth he's been carrying around a silver spoon in his mouth ever since he could open it.
What makes Michael Moore an expert at anything? What are his qualifications?
It is amusing to me that people think they can shut you up by referring to some book. If a total fool wrote a book does this then become an authoratative view?
As President Bush has said time and time again that no matter who joins our fight we will continue with or without those invited.
President Bush has not been fighting terrorist. At least not worth a damn. He was a miserable failure leading up to 9/11, and then dropped the ball in Afghanistan so he could go fight a long ago pre-planned war in Iraq. A war which has strengthened terrorist collective hand in every way, bred more hatred of America, given a staging ground for terrorist (and Iraqi "patriots") to take American lives virtually at will, and weakened America's most important asset in any war on terror: it's place in the world community, ie. good will and close friendships.
Americas retarded right: weak-minded, weak-willed, and frightened bullies who have had their day.
I wish Gore had been running things - we would have been so much better off.
Whatever anyone thinks of Michael Moore, he didn't write about the effects of a train bombing on Spanish elections... which is the topic of this thread...
Some research indicates that AQ did not issue a statement even mentioning the Bali bombings until a month later... so either AQ varied from their MO due to the proximity to the election, or ETA did it and set things up to look like AQ did it and played the Popular Party for a fool.
The Popular Party was a bit on the bubble... a year ago they were forecast to lose this election, due to Spain's massive popular antiwar position. Additionally, the Popular Party had proposed a punishment of up to six years for protesting against any international military effort (they couldn't call it a war because Spain's parliament has not declared war either). The Popular Party had been out of power for decades before Aznar because they had high-level members tightly linked to Franco...
What would it take for 77% of eligible American voters to show up on Election Day? And what party would win, I wonder?
I wish Gore had been running things - we would have been so much better off.
Actually, yeah, we would. It's hard to imagine anyone (even Bore) being worse than Bush in times of crisis. He's a disaster from start to finish. There is not a single good thing to say about his presidency. He's an economic failure, a foreign policy disaster, a despot warrior king with no care for the men and women in uniform, and a delusional spiritualist. The leadership of the free world is simply no place for a person of such mediocre intelligence and low character.
