scholar and 1914

by Marvin Shilmer 63 Replies latest jw friends

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  outnfree

  From Walter Martin's The Kingdom of the Cults, Expanded Anniversary Edition, October 1997, Bethany House Publishers, Minneapolis:

  JW Teachings are in black bold. JW Quoted Statements are in red bold. JW Source References are in black.

  "Beginning of the End" in 1799 (later changed to 1914).

  "1799 definitely markes the beginning of 'the time of the end.' . . . 'The time of the end' embraces a period from A.D. 1799, as above indicated, to the time of the complete overthrow of Satan's empire. . . . We have been in 'the time of the end' since 1799." -- The Harp of God, (1928 ed.); 235-236, 239

  Christ's "Invisible Presence" begins in 1874 (later changed to 1914).

  "The time of the Lord's second presence dates from 1874. . . . From 1974 forward is the latter part of the period of 'the time of the end.' From 1874 is the time of the Lord's second presence." -- The Harp of God, 236, 239-240.

  The Battle of Armageddon ends in 1914 (later changed to "still future").

  "The 'battle of the great day of God Almighty' (Rev. 16:14), which will end in A.D. 1914 with the complete overthrow of earth's present rulership, is already commenced." -- Charles Taze Russell, The Time Is at Hand, 101.

  The Battle of Armageddon will end shortly after 1914.

  "In the year 1918, when God destroys the churches wholesale and the church members by millions, it shall be that any that escape shall come to the works of Pastor Russell to learn the meaning of the downfall of 'Christianity.'" -- Charles Taze Russell, The Finished Mystery (1917 ed. published post-humously), 485.

  (What follows is more convoluted WT teaching not precisely germaine to MarvinShilmer's request for pre-1914 Russellite "prophecy" but for which I beg his indulgence as I feel it may be instructional to other JWD lurkers and members who have not yet considered WT revisionist history in all its posturing deviousness.)

  The Battle of Armageddon will come around 1925.

  "The date 1925 is even more distinctly indicated by the Scriptures because it is fixed by the law God gave to Israel. Viewing the present situation in Europe, one wonders how it will be possible to hold back the explosion much longer; and that even before 1925 the great crisis will be reached and probably passed." -- The Watch Tower (July 15, 1924): 211.

  1914 is the starting date for the last generation before the Battle of Armageddon.

  "The thirty-six intervening years since 1914, instead of postponing Armageddon, have only made it nearer than most people think. Do not forget: 'This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled'" (Matt. 24:34). -- The Watchtower (November 15, 1950): 419.

  People who were present and understood the events of 1914 will live to see the Battle of Armageddon.

  "Jesus said, 'This generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur.' Which generation is this, and how long is it? . . . The 'generation' logically would not apply to babies born during World War I. It applied to Christ's followers and others who were able to observe that war and the other things that have occurred in fulfillment of Jesus' composit 'sign.' Some of such persons 'will by no means pass away until' all of what Christ prophesied occurs, including the end of the present wicked system." -- The Watchtower (October 1, 1978): 31.

  Anyone born by 1914 will ive to see Armageddon.

  "If Jesus used 'generation' in that sense and we apply it to 1914, then the babies of that generation are now seventy years old or older. And others alive in 1914 are in their eighties or nineties, a few even having reached one hundred. There are still many millions of that generation alive. Some of them 'will by no means pass away until all things occur'" (Luke 21:32). -- The Watchtower (May 15, 1984): 5

  Anyone who sees the events signaling the End, regardless of any relationship to 1914, will see the Battle of Armageddon.

  "Eager to see the end of this evil system, Jehovah's People have at times speculated about the time when the 'great tribulation' would break out, even tying this to calculations of what is the lifetime of a generation since 1914. However we 'bring a heart of wisdom in' not by speculating about how many years or days make up a generation. . . . 'This generation' apparently refers to the peoples of earth who see the sign of Christ's presence but fail to mend their ways." -- The Watchtower (November 1, 1995): 17-20

  outnfree
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  scholar

  Mary

  You are a cutie. Jesus warned about traditions and the Apostle Paul admonished Timothy to keep holding to the pattern of healthful words - 1Timothy 1:13.

  scholar
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  rem

  Hmmmm... I think advice from Jesus trumps advice from Paul. :)
  
  rem
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  dustyb

  scholar makes me want to go get a baseball bat and go................play baseball......

  "hold true to your words (as long as they are true)". you needa read the christian bible more, because paul also said to "hold fast to what is true". so if the WTS isn't teaching truth, then f**k'em
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  Urbanparadise

  AlanF said:

  Here's the gist of the conversation so far:

  Mervin Shill: What did Russell teach was going to happen in 1914 that proved accurate?

  Anti-scholar: NVKPEADYREAYDUH.

  Mervin Shill: You didn't answer my question. Let's try a little different tack: Name something specific that Russell said was going to happen with NVKPEADYREAYDUH in 1914. Was he accurate?

  Anti-scholar: Are you stupid? I answered your question. NVKPEADYREAYDUH in 1914 was eagerly awaited by many expositors in the nineteenth century and even some of the clergy of Christendom in England agreed that NVKPEADYREAYDUH occurred.

  Mervin Shill: My question asked you to name something specific and accurate that Russell taught about NVKPEADYREAYDUH prior to 1914. You replied, "NVKPEADYREAYDUH." Let's try a third time: Prior to 1914, what did Russell teach about "NVKPEADYREAYDUH" that was accurate? What?

  We await further enlightenment from our resident Anti-scholar.

  A parallel conversation:

  Cruisin for Bruisin: You consider the opinions of a few expositors to be accurate and definitive proof of NVKPEADYREAYDUH in 1914?

  Anti-scholar: Hey come on! I simply responded to a question from Mervin Shill and, as is my modus operandi, I did not present my reply as definitive proof. It is simply fact that in the nineteenth century many sincere Bible have long recognized the significance of NVKPEADYREAYDUH and some applied chronology to determine its significance and it was determined by some that it would expire in 1914 which saw the Great War. Now it is up to all individuals themselves to accept or reject but I cannot change the developments of Church history. Russell and his associates took up the challenge and correctly discerned the significance of NVKPEADYREAYDUH. If you are a a non believer or an athiest then such matters are of no consequence and frankly whether you choose to believe or disbelieve is immaterial to me.and I cannot be bothered in trying to convince you otherwise.

  Since Anti-scholar is quite unable to explain exactly what NVKPEADYREAYDUH is, or to say anything significant about it, or tell us anything specific and accurate that Russell taught about NVKPEADYREAYDUH, it's obvious that his responses are pure Gobble-de-Goop. You can't get gold out of Gobble-de-Goop. And you can't get truth out of the Watchtower organization about its history of spewing Gobble-de-Goop.

  which was class!
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  Urbanparadise

  Farkel said:

  scholar,

  : You sweet little thing. You state that the Gentile Times began in 70 CE and not 607 BCE, if this is the case what then is the duration of these times and when did it end?

  May 3, 70 CE, 10:25 AM to 9.30 PM same day. Some other scholars think it ended at 9:35 PM or even the wildly-speculative theory that it ended at 9:45 PM. Jehovah told me this. The whole damn thing happened in less than a day. All the rest is bullshit.

  PROVE ME WRONG.

  which also was a classic!
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  Urbanparadise

  And Mary said:

  Well Scholar you know what Jesus said to the Pharisees: "...By your tradition you make the word of God invalid..." Thanks for showing that the Society is absolutely no different than the Pharisees (who also thought they had "the Truth").

  you're on the ball, girl!!
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  Urbanparadise

  I'm yet to paste something worth posting from Scholar!
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  Mary

  Jesus warned about traditions and the Apostle Paul admonished Timothy to keep holding to the pattern of healthful words - 1Timothy 1:13.

  "to keep holding to the pattern of healthful words" does not mean that Paul told Timothy to keep promoting a doctrine if they knew it was false. The Society knows full well that the whole 1914 doctrine is built on sand. They don't care that they're promoting a lie, their main concern is promoting themselves and they apparently feel that they can't do that if they get rid of 1914. It's really stupid paranoia when you think about it. All other religions have a group of ministers or priests or clergy that rule over them without holding a specific date over everyone's head.

  LMAO at Urbanparadise!! I think Scholar is bored and simply likes to see how riled he can get people. There's no way this guy is a faithful Dub, posting here, supposedly going to university (to study religion of all things).
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  Farkel

  "scholar"

  This is comment of yours is so funny:

  : Mary

  : You are a cutie. Jesus warned about traditions and the Apostle Paul admonished Timothy to keep holding to the pattern of healthful words - 1Timothy 1:13.

  : scholar

  You forgot all your silly titles. Are you getting a little bit more humble now? NAH! This is a classic example of a red herring. In the heat of having your arguments trashed, change the subject and hope that the lackeys won't notice that you did it. This lackey noticed that you did it, and this lackey won't let you get away with it. Stick with the topic and argue it, or look the fool, you fool. Farkel