Freedom to Choose God (page 5)

UnDisfellowshipped

Ellderwho AND Deputy Dog:

I have some questions for you, on your beliefs:

1: Does God control humans' every choice?

2: If a human decides to go to the bathroom, is that choice controlled by God? If a human decides to stay up late, was that choice controlled by God? If a human decides to sleep in late was that controlled by God?

3: When a human chooses to sin (let's say, lie or murder or steal), was that choice controlled by God?

4: Does God control every single decision people make, OR does He only control certain decisions they make?

5: If God only controls certain decisions they make, then which decisions does He control and which does He NOT control?

6: Does God love ALL people, or does God only love CERTAIN people that He foreordained for salvation?

7: Does God desire that ALL people be saved, or does God only desire CERTAIN people that He foreordained to be saved?

8: Did Jesus Christ die for ALL people, or did He die only for CERTAIN people that He foreordained for salvation?

9: Did God create sin?

10: Did God originate lying?

11: Did God create Lucifer with the freedom to choose whether or not to sin, OR did God create Lucifer so that Lucifer had NO CHOICE except to sin?

12: Did God create Adam and Eve with the freedom to choose whether or not to sin, OR did God create Adam and Eve so that they had NO CHOICE except to sin?

13: Does God tempt people with evil?

14: Is everything that happens God's will? Is everything that people do God's will?

15: Even when the Bible says that something is NOT God's will, is that still God's will?

16: Is it God's will that not everyone does God's will?

UnDisfellowshipped

Deputy Dog said:

So you deserve eternal life because you are more humble?

No. Let me make myself very clear -- NO ONE deserves eternal life. NO ONE earns eternal life.

Every single human who has ever existed DESERVES to burn in Hell for eternity.

But, the Bible shows that it is the ones who humble themselves that accept Christ into their hearts and accept His FREE GIFT by GRACE.

hungerartist

Life is a hell we cannot escape...if we continue to trade our freedom for 'absolution'.

Also, coercion and freedom of choice are mutually exclusive concepts.

Deputy Dog

UnDis

Did God create sin and death?

You tell me.

Gen 2:16

And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:

Gen 2:17

"But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat" (is the law not a teacher that reveals sin) of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. (die, death mean the same thing don't they) Did Adam and Eve create the sin of eating the fruit of the tree or did God? It looks like God revealed the sin before they ever thought of it. Did God create death (the penalty for sin) or did Adam and Eve? My bottom line. Did God reveal sin to Satan or did Satan reveal sin to God? D Dog

Deputy Dog

Flash

God who creates can (and did) provide the ability for humans to maintain perfect law.

How do you know that?

D Dog

Deputy Dog

UnDisfellowshipped

Before I take your "test", I'm still trying to understand what you're saying.

First you say:

God desires ALL HUMANS to be saved

Then you said

Jesus Himself explained that God does NOT choose to enlighten all people
I never said that everyone is given a choice. I said that God chooses whom He wants to enlighten, and then He gives that person a choice of choosing to repent or to reject Jesus.
From the Bible, it appears that God never did enlighten Pharoah

All these things can't be true, can they? D Dog

LittleToe

Ah, the joys of taking Predestination down the route of "double-predestination" wherein some are predestined to perdition...
I personally find that idea unconscienable, however logical an ultimate conclusion it may be.

LT "dichotomy" class

Deputy Dog

LT

What do you mean by "double-predestination"? that term gets kicked around a lot and How do you square up:

John 3:18

He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

D Dog

LittleToe

DD:
I added a note, to try and make it clear.

Predstination states that some are predestined to life.
Double-predestination takes that a stage further, and states that some are predestined to perdition.

It's the second part that I have trouble finding any support for in "scripture".
There will always be a philosophical dichotomy between "God's Sovereignty" and "Man's Responsibility".
Neither the Calvinists, the Arminians, nor anything in between, are likely to solve that one.

Regarding judgement (from a biblical framework), it is according to how we respond to "light".
If we hide from it, then we have judged ourselves.

The judgement of "Revelation" seems to be more about carrying out the sentence for that which has already been self-inflicted.

Deputy Dog

LT

Are you saying that you think man is born neutral in regard to God or do you think he is condemned already?

D Dog

Freedom to Choose God

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