EVIL LOUTION? Why do you still resist? Science doesn't work?

by Terry 95 Replies latest jw friends

  • candidlynuts
    candidlynuts

    who knows that god didnt use evolution to create mankind? is there anywhere in the bible that says nothing evolves?

    the story of adam and eve could be the printed history of the first man and woman the jewish people wanted to remember.

    cain could have gotten his wife from other tribes of humans that were on the earth.

    i just assume i dont know, dont gotta know, live life till i die cuz thats all that people before my generation have done and theres no reason to think the generations after me will do anything different.

  • TMS
    TMS

    In the tiny portion of the universe I can observe, I see:

    design
    neglect
    order
    desertion
    beauty

    animals coexist peacefully and kill each other savagely
    humans coexist peacefully and kill each other savagely

    would-be explainers-of-the-universe come in a myriad of
    manifestations in coffee houses, campuses and pulpits

    there are "true believers" everywhere

    I know so little for certain

    tms

  • SYN
    SYN

    Hi Carmel,

    Yes, some of the book was slightly "creative" (hehe), but I found that his overall concept, of evolution occurring across very large numbers of intersecting "gradients", a very refreshing take on the theory. A lot (or in fact most) people in the world, even educated ones, think that evolution is something that "just happens" and that it happens suddenly and dramatically. What Dawkins emphasizes is that this is NOT so, and that there is no "goal" for evolution - there is only the "goal" of information trying it's best to survive.

    I personally think that evolutionary gradients will become a very promising field of research in the near future - they make a lot of sense!

    Another poster said:

    1) You suggest that "the ancestors of humans had the same ability to communicate as modern apes" and that this ability has gradually developed into the thousands of human languages we have today. Would you then say that this gradual improvement also works over shorter perdiods of times - that is the "historical" periods of time that we know something about for sure (as opposed to the prehistorical ones, no written records, etc.)? For instance would you say that languages spoken four thousand years ago should be more complex or less complex than languages spoken today according to your theory?

    This is an interesting question. We of course have no way of knowing how complex very ancient human languages were, purely because there was nobody around to record them, but logically, early human languages couldn't have been as complex as modern-day languages.

    Even within all humans living today there is a massive disparity in vocabulary and complexity of language. What I mean is that a Nepalese Sherpa won't be able to write a doctoral thesis on particle physics.

    However, I still don't see what all of this has to do with evolution. Evolution is not equal to language. Language is an entirely different thing, because it's shaped by conscious thought. People INVENT words.

    2) There are thousands of languages all around the world. According to the evolutionary view most of them must have evolved for many thousands of years independently of one another - just like human races (take Australia and North Canada for instance). Would you then assume that some of them should be less developed or less complex than others because they have been shaped by different environmental factors?

    Different vocabularies exist, yes. However, there has been a lot of work done by people like Chomsky in establishing a "universal grammer" in the human brain. Babies are adaptable at birth to any number of languages - in fact, parts of the hearing mechanism are simply unused. Babies are born as one-size-fits-all when it comes to language, but they soon adapt to the language around them. For example, Japanese babies lost the ability to distinguish L and R sounds at a very early age, and French babies can easily distinguish the three distinct R's of French, which babies from other language groups might find impossible. So there's a whole lot more going on there that we don't know about yet...

    3) Please name some features that you think all human languages have in common and which make them different from "animal communication". In this way we will know what we are arguing about.

    It's impossible to draw a definite line here. Coco the gorilla is capable of fairly complex sign language - she can tell her trainers she's sick, or that her leg hurts, and so forth. Probably the single most important part of human speech is the idea of "self", or "Me". However, it's been proven that dolphins can recognize themselves in mirrors, through experiments. So hard and fast rules are very difficult to make here. Once again, this is supported by the gradient theory, with animals being lower on the linguistic gradient than humans.

  • XQsThaiPoes
    XQsThaiPoes

    Who created every thing God?

    Who created every thing Evolution?

    If you awnser yes to both does that mean Evolution is God?

    Humans historically have worshiped natural processes such as the summer and winter solstice. Not because it was extremely mysterious. In fact many things humans worshiped were very predictable. So today can we get back to normal and worship evolution? It is common sense. THat way we can stop fighting over this stupid arguement. I mean I am sure if the pagans discovered evolution they would worship it too.

  • Insomniac
    Insomniac

    I was raised to believe in creationism and to laugh at the idea of evolution. The more evidence piled up, however, the more evolution seemed factual. I still believe in a Creator, with all my heart, but this is not at odds with a belief in evolution. I believe we have evolved, because God wanted us to- or maybe, as Sirona suggested, God is also evolving.

  • hooberus
    hooberus
    Science has a method. The method is to try and prove themselves WRONG.

    That is the role of experiment. It is called Falsifiability.

    capable of being tested (verified or falsified) by experiment or observation


    What experiment or observation would falsify evolution?

  • AlanF
    AlanF

    hooberus said:

    : What experiment or observation would falsify evolution?

    Any number of things. Like finding human and dinosaur skeletons mixed in the same fossil bed. Like finding the fossils of any modern creatures in extremely old sedimentary rock. Like a Creator appearing and demonstrating how he/she/it can create some new form of life.

    Now you answer a similar question:

    What experiment or observation would falsify creation?

    AlanF

  • hooberus
    hooberus
    Any number of things. Like finding human and dinosaur skeletons mixed in the same fossil bed.

    Such as scenario would not necessarily falsify evolution. This could be explained by: 1. the human fossils are stratigraphic leaks 2. the dinosaur skeletons are reworked specimens 3. dinosaurs survived into more recent times 4. redraw evolutionary trees with mammal evolution occurring earlier than now believed

    Like finding the fossils of any modern creatures in extremely old sedimentary rock.

    1. the "modern" fossils are stratigraphic leaks 2. the specific sedimentary rock outcrop is really not as old as was believed 3. redraw evolutionary trees with creature evolving earlier than now believed

  • gumby
    gumby
    Now you answer a similar question:

    What experiment or observation would falsify creation?

    "Attention.......attention! Calling hooberus.....calling hooberus"

    *puts away megaphone*

    Gumby

  • heathen
    heathen

    There are still some species alive today that date to the dinosaur age such as crocks and sharks wich have relatively stayed the same genetically . To me it's a matter of faith either way you look at it . Science cannot prove that life started from amino acids that fell from outerspace into the ocean and formed some sort of amino life generator .

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