My story, please read

by fairchild 108 Replies latest jw friends

  • unique1
    unique1

    First off, don't feel like you have to reply to this, just takes too much time. :-)

    I have a different background from you, so I don't know if this would work for you or not. You seem to have a very open mind. I always did, but was raised a JW. I NEVER felt close to Jehovah. I have been baptized for 14 years and just recently feel like he is listening. The reason. I left the JW's. Once I stopped going to meetings, it allowed me to be free to really open my mind, to read the bible for myself without the pre-conditioning of the witnesses. I felt like I had such a clearer understanding of the bible. I like you think they are the closest to the truth as far as organized religion goes, but they still fall short.

    I know you read the bible with no pre-conceived notions before, but it never hurts to do so again. I know it really helped me to feel an attachment to the person who inspired such writing, and not the people who try to interpret it for me.

  • one
    one

    fairchild,

    Did you read CoC?

    It seem to me that you think there MUST be an organization that is right about religion, has everthing figure out and approved by god. And you feel directed to the jw everytime...

    Time of the end bible prophecy, specially spoken by jesus, does not show that any particular group of people can be clearly seen as directed by god. The "wheat" could not be visibly and apart from weed. Emphasis is on a personal relationship with god.

    Jesus came to do away with organizations and rules. BUT humans feel atracted to groups and the need to be validated..., you seem to do ok by yourself. Approval by jw is extremely conditioned.

    Many jw are good people just because that is what they are and they happen to form a group because of an ideal future presented to them by the org.;,

    Presented to them most likely when they were in need for answers to frustrations. It is a chain reaction as someone who was at the top said: "victim of victims"

    The org does not set example, history shows that they do not care much for people, the org is first ALL the time, just like any corporation.. individuals are disposable.

    AND dont you EVER question WT teachings... or you will quickly find out...

  • fairchild
    fairchild

    Hi Alan,

    Yes, 1993 sounds about right. I didn't speak English fluently at the time, and many parts

  • fairchild
    fairchild

    Hi Alan,

    Oops, I don't know what happened here, but seems like my reply got sent in the middle of writing it. Darn computers. Anyway, as I said, many parts probably escaped me because of the language barrier. It is such a shame that people would do that, claiming they found the ark if really they didn't. They probably thought about money and fame, huh?

    I agree fully, that poetic language is hard to use literal most of the time. However, the problem with poetic language is that often metaphors are used which represent things that only the writer knows. We all know that green is a (overused) metaphor for youth, but Shakespeare used the green eyed monster to indicate jealousy. I could easily write a poem about the green eyed monster, making it a metaphor for youth, in my write it would be a monster because it yet has to be refined in human experiences. You know what I mean? So, often, there is no way of telling -one way or the other- what exactly was meant by a certain metaphor. Don't get me wrong, I'm not implying that the circle in Isaiah is a metaphor, I'm merely stating that poetic language can often be hard to understand.

    Nevertheless, the fact that poetic language was used in some books and not in others in a way inspires me to believe that the bible was inspired by God. Not sure how to explain this.. The bible was written over a period of 1,600 years. If the assumption is true that it is a collection of books written by humans, not inspired by God, then it would not look the way it does. Try to accumulate 66 books that were written over a period of 1,600 years by 40 different authors, all written about the same subject. What would you find? Or what would your criterium be to select the books? There would be no merit in finding 66 books that used the same writing technique, because that would be easy to do. When I write a poem today, I still use the same techniques to hook the reader as poets did 300 years ago. The techniques never change. But try to find 66 books written by 40 different people, handling the same subject.. this is perfectly well possible. Many authors over the years have written about the same subjects.. peace, love, the passage of time, infinity, nature.. you name it. But to find 66 books that are in harmony with one another, I honestly don't think it is possible. We write what we live. Read any book that was written 200 years ago, and you will 'feel' the difference. The writer had an entirely different mindset back then.

    I totally agree that ambiguity reigns once again, but let's not forget that it reigns both ways.

    For now I will have to stick to my original idea, meaning that even if the bible is not inspired by God, it is and always will be a great book to live by. In the meantime, I will not stop researching many things.

  • fairchild
    fairchild

    Hi justhuman,

    Interesting post you have here and I thank you for your time.

    It was not until 2 days ago that I heard for the first time that the date 607 BC was wrong. I actually did some research of my own when I came home from work earlier, but came up with a lot of different dates. I'm still looking into it.

    Being Greek, you must have an advantage to be able to read part of the scriptures in their original language! How interesting.

    You said that back in the 1980's, many JW's found out about that date being wrong. Any websites where I can do reading up on that? Thanks.

  • fairchild
    fairchild

    Hi jwbot,

    Thank you for the warm welcome. Who knows, perhaps we will get to know each other in the future.

    Hi Unique1,

    Thank you for your words. As a matter of fact, I just finished reading the bible, and am planning on starting over again in January. Every time I read the bible, I learn some more.

    Hi one,

    What or who is CoC?

    You have some interesting thoughts there. I wrote a few things down from your post. Actually, from yours and others. Things to pay attention to when I read the bible again. Thanks.

  • Double Edge
    Double Edge

    First of all ... WELCOME !!

    I read the bible several times, and then observed different religions that use the bible, to see which one lived closest to the requirements of the bible. Unless there are religions out there I have never heard of, I do believe that JW's live closest to bible principles.

    I've never been a JW, just have a friend who's one, so I'll let others on this board speak from their JW background. I speak from a background of attending many Christian churches, and I must say there are MANY churches that I would list BEFORE the JWs who live closest to "Christian" principles. The bible is only a book that points the way to the Messiah. Jesus the Christ (Messiah), and the example He set on how to treat other people is the REAL standard for anyone who would call themself a follower of Christ. Look for those who have Charity (Love) towards their fellowman/woman and you will find what you're looking for.... in my experience, this board of EX-JWs comes closer to that standard than what I've read of the JW man-made religion. my 2 cents..

    Again.... glad to have you here.

    p.s. If English is your second language, you must be a genius.

    Double Edge.... (btw, you don't have to respond...a person can only type so much)

  • lazyslob
  • NewLight2
    NewLight2

    These are the best books you could read on the 607bce date. You can order it from FreeMinds.Org

    http://www.freeminds.org/sales/books.htm


    Gentile Times Reconsidered! - $16
    Third Edition, revised and expanded, by
    Carl Olof Jonnson
    The idea that the "Gentile Times"
    referred to at Luke 21:24 form a period
    of 2,520 years has led to speculation and
    disappointment among many who
    expected Christ's return during the past
    two centuries. How did this belief
    originate and develop? This book presents
    the historical evidence, along with a
    remarkably extensive study of ancient
    Assyrian and Babylonian records which
    date the destruction of Jerusalem by
    Babylonian conqueror Nebuchadnezzar,
    as well as an enlightening study of the
    Biblical prophecies regarding the "70
    years" of Babylonian domination of
    Judah. 368 pages, paperback. GT-22

    Sign of the Last Days - $15
    by Carl Olof Jonsson
    Is Christ's return identified by
    unprecendented war, famine, pestilence,
    earthquakes, crime and other calamities?
    Evidence that this claim is based on a
    misunderstanding of Christ's own words;
    accompanied by historical facts
    demonstrating how surprisingly little the
    20th century has differed in these areas
    from past centuries. 288 pages,
    paperback. CJS-16

  • outoftheorg
    outoftheorg

    Hi Fairchild. Hey I got it right!!

    You ask why did I leave the org. after such a long time in it?

    Well It was not due to one thing or occurance. Since I was raised in this cult, actually born into it, it is somewhat like your mind/brain is hard wired to function as a defender of this faith. One defends it not only to outsiders or non believers but also to ones self and between the believers.

    Having a pragmatic personality, being taught to believe and having life experience that does not agree with the teachings, results in lots of cognitive dissonance.

    This left me with two disturbing emotions, constantly feeling that I was not intelligent enough to master all these teachings from the bible and a slow simmering anger with no definite direction.

    For example, I was told that I ought to be an elder. I replied that I did not feel qualified. Their reply was, there are two sins. Those of comission and those of omission and I would be commiting the sin of omission if I did not accept their requirements.

    The wbts publications claim that the elders are spirit directed and I now an elder, new damned well that I was not spirit directed. At the elder meetings and at other times I would look around me and see that none of the other elders were spirit directed. They for the most were ignorant and some were very arrogant and hostile in their dealings with each other .

    Then after about 4 yr's. the one who said I must, tells me I am not service minded enough and he won't sign a letter of recognition for my move out of state to another congregation. The CO tells the little tyrant that he has to sign it.

    I moved to the new congregation and they knew I was coming. On the day of our arrival 1 of the 4 elders came to my house. He was anxious to meet me and told me there was a problem in the body of elders. It became obvious that I was being reqruited to make this a 3 to 2 situation and he would win

    The problem that had so terrified and corrupted this group of elders was that they had been given quite a number of old theater seats to use in their little kingdom hall. Then two of the elders had judged that many of the chairs left over were useless and took them to the county trash dump.

    WITHOUT THE PERMISSION OF THE OTHER TWO. This was when I decided I no longer would be an elder. Sin of omission or not. This so enraged this elder that he sold his house and left town.

    Right before of all this, I had lived through the 1975 debacle and fast losing faith in the wbts.

    So now, I was trying to slowly fade away. My wife and children and siblings and inlaws and cousins etc. were all in the cult. So this has to be done on the side and keep quiet.

    Things changed in this area we lived in and jobs got scarce. So I did what I always wanted to do and bought a franchise and opened my own business. Another subtle NO NO in the jw world.

    I really loved being my own boss and having this business. Then wife becomes suicidal, son has a motor cycle crash and I find out my now adult daughter had been molested at 14 by an elder, her uncle had fondeled her genitals.

    I found this out because a non jw cousin of hers had claimed that he had molested her also and this caused my daughter to tell me. Statue of limitations is expired. Police were interested and made notes but could not act.

    Word got around and several other sisters made complaints also. It was taken to the elders. They of course showed complete disdain for the cousin, since she is not a jw she must be a liar.

    Well even with all those sisters involved, the elders were told by the legal desk to drop the charges and leave this rapist in good standing.

    I told the elders that my daughter was devastated at this decision and they told me that it was up to me to make her accept it. At that point I told the elders "very graphicly" that they need the s**t beaten out of them and a few more suggestions.

    Well relations between me and the local elders seemed to go down hill. I still wonder why. After all aren't they spirit directed, kind, loving, forgiving leaders of the flock??

    Things remained the same for this elder for about another 5 yrs, and then there must of been some more complaints, because my daughter was asked to talk to the elders again about him and then he was removed as an elder. STILL A JW IN GOOD STANDING.

    Now a little more than a year ago this elder is charged again and FINALLY he is df'd. Even though he showed up at his daughters house with a pistol and raving about suicide, aprehended by the police swat team, then spent a few days in the psych ward, I am sure the kind and loving elders will soon reinstate him for the congregations benefit.

    Back to the suicide/crash.

    My now X wife, like so many women in the wbts had been molested by her brother. Her mother set her up to be molested by the mothers boyfriends. I took her to a counselor and psychiatrist. Another No No for jw's.

    She was told that her depression was due to severe anger being stuffed and not addressed. It was suggested that she challenge her brother and her mother who set her up to be molested with her anger and not to continue to stuff the anger.

    She did. Things did not work well. Now her siblings were up in arms that she would even bring this up. Her mother was doing the oh poor me thing and claiming this would be too much for her son to deal with. No one seemed to care if the victim of these people was in pain.

    It seems that jw's follow the guidance of the wbts and would rather conceal,deny and overlook anything of this nature. Surely one should not challenge the source of ones suicidal thoughts, if it might make the family or the org. look bad.

    Yet another quandary= cognitive dissonance for the wife. Then she suddenly can't stand the sight of me. For 22 yrs. I am the best thing since sliced bread. Then all of a sudden she hates my guts. I mean true hatred. It was so bad that divorce court sentenced her to a year and $1000.00, they Then set it aside IF she obeyed the court for those 12 months.

    The psych tells me that he thought this may happen. He called it missdirected anger. Anger due to the relatives now no longer stuffed, but to keep the loving family she never really had, she removed her anger from them and directed it to the one closest to her. Me. He said this often happens.

    During all of this time, rather than trying to be of some help, the elders encouraged her acts and her conduct. My son told the elders that If I deserved to be df'd so did his mother. He was told to mind his own business.

    Once again I took my lance and charged the elders. Now they had a legitimate charge against me.

    I was df'd on charges of "fits of rage". For once they got it right. I wonder why I was in a rage.

    Any one care to offer a guess? Now don't talk miss directed anger to me, I'll slap ya.

    There is more, but I am tired of typing.

    Wonder of wonders, the anger I mentioned earlier subsided not long after all contact with the wbts the ex wife and the elders were severed.

    Outoftheorg

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