Fear! (page 9)

LittleToe

Jesus doesn't visit Mormons?
He met this sinner, while he was still comfortably a pharaseical JW Elder...

Many associate the Bible with the fears of their past - how would you counter that?

LT, of the "trying to keep a thread on track" class

Deputy Dog

LT

I had such an experience myself, and there are many times it has sustained me when "faith in a book" has not. As a Christian the book isn't the focus of our faith as the one whom is "the Word", surely?

You are not having a relationship with Shelby's "mish mashed potatoes" are you?

I have a relationship with Jesus (the God of the Book) the Word.

Have you ever heard of Sola scriptura?

D Dog

Deputy Dog

LT

Many associate the Bible with the fears of their past - how would you counter that?

That's what cults do, they pervert the scripture. You know the Jesus of the bible is not the Jesus of the Watchtower.

D Dog

LittleToe

DDog:

Have you ever heard of Sola scriptura.

You well know that I have, from previous conversations.
That doesn't rule out other scriptures, though, even if they are viewed as subordinate.

That's what cults do, they pervert the scripture. You know the Jesus of the bible is not the Jesus of the Watchtower.

I agree with that on both counts. However, I'm sorry, that's not going to convince many here...
Have another go...

Deputy Dog

LT

Jesus doesn't visit Mormons?

The Jesus of the Mormon Church can't save, can he?

D Dog

LittleToe

The Jesus of the Mormon Church can't save, can he?

They've got their own one?
Au contrare, mon ami.
They may (IMHO) describe him inaccurately, as do the JW's, but that doesn't mean that they can't come to know him.

Now stop taking the thread off-thread, and relate that back to fear...

Narkissos

relate that back to fear...

As in, what kind of fear underlies (D)Dog-matism?

Deputy Dog

LT

They've got their own one?

Yes, they do, and if you would like I could quote there president/prophet stating that the Jesus of the reformers is not the same Jesus that they worship. also see 2Cor 11:3-4 But I fear...

Now stop taking the thread off-thread, and relate that back to fear...

OK lets talk about Luthers fear, the fear that God was shooting thunder bolts at him. Again did you see the movie? Do you know much about him through his writings? Was his fear of God rational or irrational? Nark

As in, what kind of fear underlies (D)Dog-matism?

LOL that's a good one! You got me. Its the same fear that Paul had in 2Cor 11:3-4 D Dog

LittleToe

DDog:
I know that you're a Calvinist (of a rather "hyper" variety, as I recall), so I suspect you'll agree that unless an individual is "drawn" by the Holy Spirit, they are not going to truly "come to Christ". Conversely, if an individual is eternally "of the Elect" then Grace will irresistably draw them. This will be the case whether they are exposed to "the Bible" (or a corrupt copy) or not. This would align with my own experience and scripture (Rom.1:20; 2:14). Further, did the Philippian jailer (Acts.16:30-33) read the Bible of hear about Jesus by word of mouth?

So, by your quotation of 2Cor. are you suggesting that Paul wasn't a Calvinist?

One of the few things that I have occasion to fear is self-acclaimed "God's followers".
Lord spare me from them!!!

OK lets talk about Luthers fear, the fear that God was shooting thunder bolts at him. Again did you see the movie? Do you know much about him through his writings? Was his fear of God rational or irrational?

I haven't seen that movie, is it recent? If so, it may not have come out in thie country yet.

I would suggest that his fear had elements of rationale and irrational fear of the weather. One could argue that it got him where he needed to go, but would that have been any less the case had he "observed his fear"? It seems that he found the root cause of it, which is what we're discussing here.

Deputy Dog

LT

This would align with my own experience and scripture (Rom.1:20; 2:14).

Forgive me, but are not these verses, speaking about those who say we did not hear (see or recieve)?

Further, did the Philippian jailer (Acts.16:30-33) read the Bible of hear about Jesus by word of mouth?

The mode is not important, but the who is. I think it's safe to say that Paul and Silas would tell him about the Jesus of the bible, not the Jesus of the Watchtower, mormons, or my spanish friend up the street. Remember, he asked Paul and Silas "what must I do that I may be saved?", not a couple of JWs at the local kingdom hall or a couple of morman missionaries.

So, by your quotation of 2Cor. are you suggesting that Paul wasn't a Calvinist?

Not at all, He is simply stressing that we need to share the same Jesus, the real Jesus that revealed himself to Paul.

2Co 11:6

But even if I am unskilled in speech, yet not in knowledge. But in every way I have been clearly revealed to you in all things.

I haven't seen that movie, is it recent? If so, it may not have come out in thie country yet.

As for the movie, here is the official site, including a trailer. www.lutherthemovie.com

I would suggest that his fear had elements of rationale and irrational fear of the weather. One could argue that it got him where he needed to go, but would that have been any less the case had he "observed his fear"? It seems that he found the root cause of it, which is what we're discussing here.

Some may suggest that his anger was the cause. Any thoughts?

D Dog

Fear!

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