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by Delta20 145 Replies latest jw friends

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  Delta20

  fairchild: "The initial knowledge (the one that floats on the surface), drew me to the JW organization, but then a deeper knowledge pulled me away"

  Reminds me of St August. Initially he was a christian, but when he dug deeper he thought that Christianity was flawed. Then he joined an occult sect, and after years of observing them he decided to leave them. Then he came in touch with Neo-Platonism, and started to believe in that, and after a while he found out that the bible is very similar to the neo-platonic teachings, and when he read the bible again, he saw that the first time he read it, he didn't "understand the meaning", so at the end he joined the church again. Just a famous example of someone who got out of an organization and got back in. My question is, whereto did this deeper knowledge pull you?

  Newlight02: People are stupid, and you can find stupid people everywhere. Including in the JW organization. They allow all kinds of people to join, and I have honestly no idea why they dont disfellowship those people at the first sign of trouble. But that doesn't take away any of the potency of the religion itself, besides that some of them are flawed. Remember: "One man has ruled over the other" and thats never good. Same goes for the WTS. But again, that concerns the people and not the religion itself.

  Nosferatu, Truth is not only what is in yourself. You cannot even be 100% sure of yourself, of your own feelings! I am more talking about truth in the lines of "This mountain is this or this high". Thats a statement which can be either true or false. And such truth can only be gained by knowledge. You may know yourself, but if thats all you know then thats a far way from being a good person, a loving person, etcetera. About disfellowshiip, see what I said above. Some people I would find very good to disfellowship ;)

  Sunspot, I find it very difficult to answer to that. I know JW's dont disfellowship someone very fast. I also know that almost all religions claim "only" truth, so in your opinion we should stay away from all of them. And about the scriptures, I agree that only you can separate yourself from God's love. But how does one do that? Does simply believe in God mean that you have Gods love. Does it mean that if you murder and rape....but believe in God, that you have Gods love? No, most certainly not. Those people might believe in God, but they don't obey his commandments. So theres something else to Gods love, not only you have to believe in it, and stand open to it, but you also have to obey it. So I wonder, did you obey to his commandments? Or could you have done a better job at that?

  BTW, thanks for all your replies. You guys care and thats a good thing! ;)
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  frankiespeakin

  Delta,

  I have honestly no idea why they dont disfellowship those people at the first sign of trouble.

  Well I see you are into judgeing your niegbor.

  But that doesn't take away any of the potency of the religion itself, besides that some of them are flawed. Remember: "One man has ruled over the other" and thats never good. Same goes for the WTS. But again, that concerns the people and not the religion itself.

  The WT uses Disfellowshipping to control information flow. They disfellowship anyone that disagrees with their bible interpretation. If you ever get baptized you will not be allow to disagree with the WT or esle be disfellowshipped from all your freinds and family in the WT.
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  Lostreality

  What MMORPG's do you work for?
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  clementine

  welcome to you and to outlawed too!!

  you said you wanted to see both sides of the coin, that's what my best friend used to say before she was baptised. so please, really do it, and don't focus on their lovebombing...
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  holly

  if you want to believe in God and the bible ... Get out of here !!!!!

  maybe friend, you could try taking your own advice, you know, practice what you preach!! so friend, why are YOU here??

  WELCOME TO YOU

  You will get lots of advice, mine is just to look at things from all perspectives. if you were getting into any religion, it would be wise to look at the background, the pros and cons etc. you need to ask questions to avoid being brainwashed. at least when you are fully informed you can make a choice that suits you.

  I hope you enjoy this board as much as i do

  holly
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  OldSoul

  afin: Jaron ... if you want to believe in God and the bible ... Get out of here !!!!!

  Said the winking "a friend in need," Senior Member on an "apostate" Web site. She posted 10 times in 1 day ... not what you would call a lurker.

  a friend in need
  
  
  Post 257 of 267
  since 31-Mar-04
  
  Senior Member

  What that translates to is: Jaron ... if you want to believe in [watchtower.org] and the [elders] ... Get out of here !!!!!

  Here's proof: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/9/84617/1.ashx
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  Balsam

  Delta 20,

  Your mother is adamantly against your interest in Jehovah's Witnesses. I am sure she has explained why to you otherwise she is blowing hot air threatening to kick you out if you do become one. Could it be this driving interest has been sparked by her opposition all your life? I know young folks love to do anything their parents hate. The more the parent hates it the more determined the young people are to do it just to show their parents they will not decide for them. So my question is has Jehovah's Witness become a driving desire due to the opposition you've recieved from your Mom about them?

  Do not go in blindly, do more than just study the witness publications. Your doing some studies in college and that is good. Never close the door to high learning because a religion of any kind discourages it. It is one thing to love the people you think you see on the surface of Jehovah's Witnesses, but they like everyone else has problems. Bad things do happen among JW just like they do among other religions. Though JW hide it so people won't know and think they are no different than other religions. When I became a JW and prior to getting baptized I thought they were the most wonderful group of people I have ever met, so warm and welcoming. Well after I got baptized, then I became privy to the gossip that was circulating around the congregation about all kinds of bad deed going on. Some cloaked in secrecy, some were many knew about it. They won't tell you anything until your baptized because they don't want you to walk away from them. The congregation we joined 2 years into it I found out that the Elder whom I thought so much of was a pedophile. I became friends with his daughters and learned he had been abusing them for years. An no the Elders did nothing about it, no one believed that this wonderful spiritual mountain of a man could so something so vile. Well all his children left the witness, no one stayed it out of 5 children. Eventually 25 years later he was disfellowshipped for having an affair with a sister in the congregation that was only 16 years old. Still the Elders didn't believe his daughters about his molesting them all their lives.

  So you see everyone looks wonderful on the surface they are all putting forth their very best while your around. They don't want to stumble you and cause you to run the other way. You are a feather in the cap of the person studying with you. Your congregation may not have much of anything bad going on right now. But if you ever move you could hear of all kinds of things. My ex-husband was an Elder for many years. But he had a thing for the sisters. He even had an affair with one, and was not disfellowhipped for it. They did remove him from being an Elder, but it was much later that he was disfellowhipped for smoking. Still because of the JW teachings I was admonished to continue married to him, and I did. Over the 30 years I was married to him he had 4 affairs with women inside and outside the congregation. Yes he always confessed, and was publically reproved. He was reinstated 2 1/2 years after he was disfellowshipped for smoking, and still today continues. I finally wised up and left him, but had it not been for being a JW's I would have never stayed with my cheating husband. Did the congregation know about his affairs, yes. It was whisphered about plenty.

  So just remember your only seeing things from the surface, and you need to beware you don't get entanged in some goings on. If you Dad is open to speaking about his life with JW's he would be a good one to ask.

  Balsam
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  Nosferatu

  Nosferatu, Truth is not only what is in yourself. You cannot even be 100% sure of yourself, of your own feelings!

  The person who has never taken time to get to know himself won't be able to understand himself. I know how I react to certain situations, certain people and certain things. I know whether the reaction will be negative or be positive. Because of my knowledge of myself, I'm able to control myself to a very high degree.

  When you submit your life to the Watchtower Society, you let THEM control you. They are the ones who set your limits, your emotional reactions, and how much you know about yourself. You actually begin to LOSE knowledge of yourself by letting others control your actions and reactions. You'll become frustrated because you have the urge to masturbate, enjoy seeing naked women, and like watching violent movies. If you truly understand yourself, you'll know why you have these urges.

  I am more talking about truth in the lines of "This mountain is this or this high". Thats a statement which can be either true or false. And such truth can only be gained by knowledge.

  It's not just knowledge that comes into play with situations like this, evaluation and personal experience also comes into play. 13 people say that the mountain is THIS high, but 7 people say the mountain is THAT high. Who should you believe? If you don't care, the height of the mountain is irrelevant. If you don't want to take other people's word for it, you'll have to go and measure the mountain yourself.

  You may know yourself, but if thats all you know then thats a far way from being a good person, a loving person, etcetera.

  Knowledge has nothing to do with love. Emotions are different from knowledge. Emotions require self-control and allowing yourself to become vulnerable. You can't learn about love, you have to experience it. You can learn about the effects of love, but you can't learn how love makes you feel.
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  Delta20

  frankiespeakin,

  I don't judge my neighbour, a judge also gives out the verdict, I don't do that, only God can do that at the end. But I do know the difference between right and wrong, good and evil, and when someone is evil, or taken by evil or open for evil (whatever you want to call it) then this person should be helped, but if he /she doesnt want that then he/she shouldn't be a part of an organization which proclaims good, not evil.

  Lostreality,

  I worked for GameSpy and the Stratics Network, also a bit for PE. I am currently ComRep at an MMORPG called Dark and Light, its still in beta but will get to gold soon.

  Balsam,

  I can only try to imagine what you must have gone through, and even then it won't be even near what you really went through. But as I stated before, these things say something about how the individual people are, or maybe even how the organization is faulty, but it doesn't say anything about the religion itself being at fault. What I find strange is that you didn't left him when you found out he was cheating. To my knowledge thats a reason to get a divorce. I can truly understand that they tried to talk you out of it, and i can understand that they succeeded, but couldnt you leave him after you found out he cheated again? Again, I can't imagine what it must have been like (as you understand by now probably) but, seeing as i think i know how the religion itself works, i can't say I don't wonder about that.

  Want to hear my story? My father was a good JW. He was a pioneer, and he was on his way to become an elder. Then something happened, his wife (also a JW, and daughter also JW) started getting a drinking problem. Of course the sisters tried to help her, and after a while my dad got mad at her and told her she had to stop drinking. So she did, at least that was what my dad thought. But then one day he opened a closet and the empty bottles of alcoholic beverages jumped out of it. That was the last drop for my dad, and he got a divorce. He then got disfellowshipped for leaving her for that reason. After dad my dad met my mom, but thats a whole different story. Point is that at the moment I know my dad isnt as happy as he would be if hed still be a JW, and I once went in search of his first wife, and I found her. When my dad left her she got over her drinkingproblem, and she never got remarried. Worst thing is that she must have been one of the nicest women ive ever met. This must make you wonder about wether it was a good thinf you were born, at that time I wished my dad stayed happily with her. But I can't change that. Seeing vfrom the outcome, I mean, his first wife is an amazing women, then i kind of must agree with the decision of the elders to disfellowship my father, he disobeyed the rules, he should have stayed with her, even I feel that.

  Just telling that to you to show you that I have had a littlebit of experience with these things, although they never happened to me personally. And if you want my honest opinion, if I were an elder and had the power I would have disfellowshipped who you mentioned above at the first sign of trouble (as I also said earlier). But thats just me ;)
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  Lostreality

  Have you considered that to be a good JW you will not be allowed to work on MMorpgs?