Does God speak directly to GB today?

by Bambie 53 Replies latest watchtower bible

OldSoul

greendawn,
In their publications they use the terms spirit-direction and spirit-inspired interchangably.
it-2 p. 691 ProphecyThe Source of all true prophecy is Jehovah God. He transmits it by means of his holy spirit or, occasionally, by spirit-directed angelic messengers. (2Pe 1:20, 21; Heb 2:1, 2) The Hebrew prophecies frequently begin, "Hear the word of Jehovah" (Isa 1:10; Jer 2:4), and by the expression "the word" is often meant an inspired message, or prophecy.--Isa 44:26; Jer 21:1; Eze 33:30-33; compare Isa 24:3.
w03
5/15 p. 15 Listen to What the Spirit Says!JEHOVAH'S servants must pay attention to the spirit-directed words of Jesus Christ to the seven congregations named in the Bible book of Revelation. Indeed, each of these messages contains this counsel: "Let the one who has an ear hear what the spirit says to the congregations."--Revelation 2:7, 11, 17, 29; 3:6, 13, 22.
w98
10/15 p. 14 Jerusalem--Is It 'Above Your Chief Cause for Rejoicing'? 4 Without a doubt, Ezra, Nehemiah, and many Jews cooperating with them proved that Jehovah's worship, centered in Jerusalem, was more important than anything else--that it was 'above their chief cause for rejoicing,' that is, above any other thing over which they might rejoice. What an encouragement such individuals are for all today who view Jehovah, his worship, and his spirit-directed organization in the same way! Is that true of you? Do you show by your endurance in godly works that your greatest cause for rejoicing is the privilege of worshiping Jehovah with his dedicated people? (2 Peter 3:11) As a further encouragement to that end, let us consider the fine results of Ezra's journey to Jerusalem.
w97
1/15 p. 22 What Does God Require of Us?
Serving Along With Jehovah's Organized People 21 We are not alone in making the changes needed to bring our lives into harmony with God's standards. Jehovah has a people on this earth, and he expects us to serve him along with them. This brings us to the fourth requirement. We must serve Jehovah with his spirit-directed organization.
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9/1 p. 28 Serving the Trustworthy God
Determined to Trust in JehovahDuring all these years, I have seen Jehovah's spirit operating upon his people. His spirit-directed organization has helped me to see that we cannot put our trust in the efforts of humans. Their promises for a better future are worthless, amounting to nothing more than a big lie.--Psalm 146:3, 4.
w94
8/1 p. 26 Serving With the Most Progressive OrganizationIt is clear to me that Jehovah's spirit-directed organization on earth receives guidance on what is to be done and how. His whole universal organization, visible and invisible, works together.
w93
4/1 p. 23 Growing up with Jehovah's organization in South AfricaI thank Jehovah that I have, for the past 40 years, had such a supportive wife at my side. "My cup is well filled." (Psalm 23:5) Martie and I are grateful to be part of Jehovah's spirit-directed organization and are determined to continue serving Jehovah in his house, in Bethel, and to keep up with his forward-moving organization.
w93
6/1 p. 21 What Does It Take to Make You Happy?Today, God does not speak to his servants directly as he did to Job. Instead, he reproves them by means of his Word and his spirit-directed organization. Christians who pursue materialistic interests, however, often have neither the time, the strength, nor the inclination to study the Bible regularly and attend all the meetings Jehovah's organization provides.
w89
1/15 p. 13 What Prevents You From Getting Baptized? 18 The Scriptures repeatedly mention the baptism of believers. (Acts 4:4; 5:14; 8:13; 16:27-34; 18:8; 19:1-7) To become one of Jehovah's Witnesses, then, a person must be a believer--one who exercises faith and gets baptized. Even before baptism, such faith manifests itself in godly conduct, trust in Jehovah, participation in the Kingdom-preaching work, and acceptance of Jesus' ransom sacrifice. Faith in the ransom is emphasized for baptismal candidates, for the first of two questions the speaker asks them is: "On the basis of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ, have you repented of your sins and dedicated yourself to Jehovah to do his will?" Only if the individual answers in the affirmative and also understands that his dedication and baptism identify him as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with God's spirit-directed organization can he acceptably undergo water immersion.
w88
3/1 p. 17 My Life in Jehovah's Spirit-Directed OrganizationJehovah is simultaneously feeding all his people spiritually through The Watchtower and other Biblical publications. All of this is evidence that Christ Jesus has been our ruling King since 1914 and that he will successfully lead us through the "great tribulation" just ahead. Finally, all you who are young in years, wisely build careers of full-time sacred service now! You too will have thrilling privileges waiting for you. (Micah 7:7) I rejoice in Jehovah's providential care over the past decades. His blessings have truly made me rich. (Proverbs 10:22) I am grateful to Jehovah every day for the privileges I have in serving him in his spirit-directed organization.--Revelation 7:14.
w86
3/15 p. 18 Allow No Place for the Devil! 11 Let us take another example. Occasionally you may hear someone question whether the Scriptural prohibition against eating blood really applies to transfusions. But what is behind that reasoning? Is it fear--fear of possibly losing one's present life or the life of a loved one? Is hope in the resurrection fading? Faithful Christians do not compromise on God's law or look for ways to water it down. Abstaining from blood to nourish the body is just as necessary as abstaining from fornication and idolatry, all condemned in the same spirit-directed decree of the apostles and older men at Jerusalem.--Acts 15:19, 20, 28, 29.
w84
7/15 pp. 14-15 Organized to Serve Jehovah 19 Fulfilling the commission to preach and make disciples also requires cooperation within one unified organization. (Matthew 28:19, 20; Acts 1:6-8) If each professing Christian had only a 'personal relationship with God' and was associated with just any religious group at all, how could the witnessing commission be carried out? Why, some would, in effect, be saying "Shibboleth" and others "Sibboleth"! (Judges 12:4-6) How would hearers of such diverse messages know what to believe? Anointed Christians must 'earnestly endeavor to observe the oneness of the spirit in the uniting bond of peace,' and among them there is to be "one Lord, one faith, one baptism; one God and Father of all." (Ephesians 4:1-6) There must be agreement among all true Christians, a unified message, if people are to hear what is correct, put genuine faith in the true God and call upon Jehovah's name with the prospect of being saved. Moreover, one spirit-directed organization must be used in connection with the sending forth of those truthful preachers of the "good news."--Romans 10:11-15.

INTERJECTION: I have to interject an aside. This last statement was rank sophistry and completely unsupported by the scripture offered. There is no scripture in the bible that indicates a spirit-directed organization, and to stretch that non-Scriptural concept to a point where it is declared there can be only one such organization doing a thing is an example of the worst kind of abuse of the Bible.

w79
2/15 p. 17 Visits from Older Men Benefit God's People
HOW VISITS BY OLDER MEN WERE VIEWED 4 It was following the Jerusalem Council of 49 C.E. that Judas and Silas were sent along with Paul and Barnabas to Antioch. If you had been there, what would you have experienced? According to Acts 15:32 the two "prophets" Judas and Silas "encouraged the brothers with many a discourse and strengthened them." Previously, there had been some dissension in Antioch over the question of circumcision. But now the receipt by the Antioch congregation of a spirit-directed letter, coupled with this visit of the two "prophets," had settled the matter. The congregation had reason to rejoice.--Acts 15:2, 22-31.
w72
3/1 p. 139 How to Stand Firm in This Time of the End
WHAT AIDS CHRISTIANS TO STAND FIRM? 20 First of all, to help us to stand firm we need the strength that only Jehovah can provide. Secondly, it is important to recognize the chief of enemies, Satan the Devil, as well as the demonic horde under his jurisdiction. In order to assist us to acknowledge the provision of strength to stand against an archenemy, we might look to the fine spirit-directed counsel that Paul wrote to the Christian congregation living in the wicked city of Ephesus. The information in the final chapter provides very specific admonition. He draws attention to the attack of the invisible enemies and at the same time points to the protection. In the eleventh verse he urges Christians to "put on the complete suit of armor from God that you may be able to stand firm against the machinations of the Devil." There is no question about the enemy or his attack. We can see that worldly authorities, governments and other agencies do the bidding of the one who is in charge of this system of things, Satan. (2 Cor. 4:4) Because of the criticalness of our times, Paul advised that only a complete suit of armor from God would provide protection. Christians are to 'put on the breastplate of righteousness, and have their feet shod with the good news of peace.' They are to 'take up the large shield of faith, with which to quench all the wicked one's burning missiles.' They must also 'accept the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the spirit, that is, God's word with every form of prayer and supplication carrying on prayer on every occasion in spirit.'--Eph. 6:11-18.
The spirit-directed counsel of Paul was spirit inspired, according to the WTS. I hope this helps clear up the mystery. The mystery is solved as soon as you realize that the average JW is untroubled by such ludicrous circumlocution.
Respectfully,
OldSoul
trevor

One of the Baptism questions is -
Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah?s Witnesses, in association with God?s spirit-directed organization?
Another is:
On the basis of this faith in God and his provision for salvation, have you dedicated yourself unreservedly to do his will henceforth as he reveals it to you through Jesus Christ and through the Bible under the enlightening holy spirit?
When I was a Jehovah?s Witness no one has ever explained how this mysterious spirit actually works. It was as vague or solid as the issue in question required it to be. The answer was along the lines that we cannot possibly understand how it functions because we have not been Spirit appointed and so are not qualified to comment on things so unreachably high and beyond the grasp of our foolish minds.
That is why we have been chosen to inherit the earth in place of the wise ones. Of course the wise ones reserved Immortal life in heaven for themselves. How did they know they had been chosen? Again this mysterious spirit informed them that they were special. Not only were they granted immortality but they got to swig the wine at the memorial. That is what upset me the most!
OldSoul

Trevor,
On the basis of this faith in God and his provision for salvation, have you dedicated yourself unreservedly to do his will henceforth as he reveals it to you through Jesus Christ and through the Bible under the enlightening holy spirit?
Not since 1985. Those two questions went away.
w85 6/1 p. 30 Subjecting Ourselves to Jehovah by DedicationAt the close of the convention baptism talk, the baptism candidates will be in position to answer with depth of understanding and heartfelt appreciation two simple questions that serve to confirm that they recognize the implications of following Christ's example. The first question is:
On the basis of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ, have you repented of your sins and dedicated yourself to Jehovah to do his will?
The second is:
Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with God's spirit-directed organization?
The old ones would present no problems for many mainstream Christians.
w73 5/1 p. 280 Baptizing Follows Discipling 25 After considering what has been published on the preceding pages, if you are one who has been learning and you wish to observe the commandments of Jesus Christ, what should you do? Peter reminds you that the way is open to you; Jehovah wants you to come into harmony with him: "Jehovah . . . is patient with you because he does not desire any to be destroyed but desires all to attain to repentance." (2 Pet. 3:9; see also 2 Corinthians 5:18?6:2; Revelation 22:17.) After the Ethiopian had learned from Philip, he asked: "What prevents me from getting baptized?" (Acts 8:36) If you feel the same about serving Jehovah God and taking Christ's yoke upon you, we suggest that you consider the following two questions, which are asked of candidates for baptism:
(1) Have you repented of your sins and turned around, recognizing yourself before Jehovah God as a condemned sinner who needs salvation, and have you acknowledged to him that this salvation proceeds from him, the Father, through his Son Jesus Christ?
(2) On the basis of this faith in God and in his provision for salvation, have you dedicated yourself unreservedly to God to do his will henceforth as he reveals it to you through Jesus Christ and through the Bible under the enlightening power of the holy spirit?
The significance may be lost, here. The relationship used to be between an individual and God. It used to be a question of individual enlightenment by holy spirit, however obscurely defined. Now it is indirect enlightenment through "earthling [men], to whom no salvation belongs." (Psalms 146:3)
Respectfully,
OldSoul
Rod P

Years ago I read a book by an ex-JW who had been high up in the Organization, with a kind of finger on the pulse on how the GB works.
Anyway, the gist of the advice being given about what is the truth from Jehovah, and what is not, went something like this:
"You can debate it all you want (i.e. a point of doctrine or prophesy or interpretation), but omce it comes off the sixth floor of the Watchtower (i.e. where the printing presses were), then that is "the Truth". At that point, there shall be no more debate.
So now you know exactly when what they say becomes "Truth" or "New Light"- when it hits the printed page! Perhaps we should all now bow down to the idol of the printing press, for that is the mouthpiece of revelation from Jehovah!
Bambie

Wow. I have to say I'm amazed at the response to this question. Thank you everyone. It's pretty much what I thought except I said inspired whereas it looks like they claim to be spirit-directed. Ah.... the subtlties of the wtbts.
I don't have the patience to read their literature anymore so I really appreciate the ones of you that do and keep us up on all the BS.
Sometimes when I do have conversations with other x-jws and we disagree on what the org. taught, I get frustrated because I was one of those "zealous" jw. I was in no way a flakey jw. So I feel pretty sure about my knowledge of what they used to teach. Although in the last 15 years anything could have changed. I just learned today of the flipflop on the voting issue. Which I have to say is such a doosie of a flip that I can't believe I hadn't heard of it before.
Anyway, thanks everyone, esp. oldsoul for all the information.
greendawn

Bambie I don't think your last post is meant to end this thread.

So I add that it became obvious from what was posted here that the GB are up to their well known trick of having two different definitions for a word and wondering all the time between them as it suits them. Their yes is not yes and their no is not no: Are you God inspired?Yes Are you God inspired?No

As Luna 2 says they are being cunning so as to have the best of both sides. AS far as I am concerned being God inspired or directed are really one and the same thing and as Old Soul confirms they themselves do use them interchangeably.

If I am Spirit inspired, God directly makes me aware of a certain concept. If I am spirit directed then he inspires me to read a certain 5 or 10 verses that taken together lead to that same concept. I think that's how they put it.

The old foxes are up to the usual silly mind games.
outoftheorg

Spirit directed or spirit inspired.
When I was appointed as an elder, I knew the wbts talked about elders as spirit inspired or directed or some other silly comment.
Anyway I kept waiting for that spirit etc. to show up and direct me or inspire me.
Never happened.
Unless it was there when I decided to resign and never ever be an elder again.
A good part of my decision to resign, was the obvious lack of love or caring and a large amount of self importance, arrogance and mean actions in the elder meetings and some times by the elders in the congregation meetings.
Of course not all elders were that way. But those that were seemed to seek and achieve the good will of the wbts representatives.
I would have men that were in the ms position or even still a publisher only, approach me and ask me to tell them how to become an elder.
Such as, " should I move to another kingdom hall?" What do I have to do to attract the elders? I really want to be an elder, "what do I have to do"?
It was obvious the greed of self pride and seeking to be over or in control of others.
Of the ones that asked me these questions, none of them seemed to be concerned with helping or caring for the publishers.
The good and kind ones didn't have that attitude.
Outoftheorg
Sunspot

They do not claim spirit-inspiration. They do claim spirit-direction,

Old Soul,
And after said "spirit-directed" idea is considered----and after the "vote" isn't 12-0, then how do they account for this? Aren't they all equally inspired? (The alternative would be that none of them is or was inspired)
Inquiring minds want to know. I never got a reasonable answer to this.
It's easy to "claim" anything, the proof is the hard part.
Annie
heathen

When God spoke through imperfect men in past times, they seemed to have got it right, beause prophecies were fulfilled
You got that right . The ancient jews had to kill the false prophets that lied about being directed by God . They do make lousy prophets .OHH that's right depending on what pubication you read they may or may not even be prophets ............. Good friggen grief . I mean jeeze the whole doctrine of the FDS is based on being chosen personally by God to deliver the proper spiritual food at the proper time through spirt direction and inspiration . Being anointed means you personally have received holy spirit and the spirit imparted to men is in union with the spirit that bears witness to truth . Once again the WTBTS has made a huge mess out of some very fundamental things in the bible . I would agree though that they are not spirit directed or inspired because they can't get anything right the first time. I mean jeeze they had people sitting around selling everything they owned in 1914 expecting the conclusion but guess what people, it never happened .Then they come up with this invisibility doctrine that has more holes in it than swiss cheese .
greendawn

In fact the invisible presence nonsense was first applied in the 1878 by Russell and the Adventists to justify their then prophetic failure on the second coming, and 1914 (1915 originally)was to be the complementary visible coming. When that also failed they brought forward the start of the invisible presence to 1914 from 1878. Opportunistic charlatans!

Does God speak directly to GB today?

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