... and if even female athletes use pregnency to improve performance and then terminate it few months later that's just sick.
Are You For or Against Abortion?
by minimus 152 Replies latest jw friends
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bisous
oh please you use an article from an urban legends site to promote that tripe? too funny for words.
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Big Dog
Oh no, I got your agreement, right before you went on to say that you were glad to be a woman and recipient of the benefits of such laws, and then more in the vein of dominion over your body, and the arguement that drug laws don't stop people from doing drugs, no, no more than the laws on the books regarding murder don't stop people from that activity either. But the laws do provide punishment for said acts, which, and laymen keep missing the point here, this is not a question of forcing your beliefs on another, this is a question of protecting life. We have laws regarding murder, which we have decided as a society that the taking of another's life without justification is wrong. The debate with abortion is that unborn children deserve that same protection under the law, the sticky point being when the become "people." This is the same problem with assisted suicide, I mean what's the big problem there? So old person decides they want to end their life, why stop them, eh? Its because we value life in this society, we think its precious and should be protected. Its not about someone trying to project their morality on you, its about people trying to protect life.
But on some level it appears that you do seem to get the inherent problem with the situation with regards to the domestic laws. But your advice to your childen would seem to negate most of the need for abortion, no? Why be so gung ho for abortion if what you really think the problems is, is people not wanting to take responsibility for their actions.
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zagor
Oh come one you know it happens, I've heard a lot about it, this was only a first link I was able to find on subject. Besides, you will see I've used expression if when relating to story from that site, also notice it say Undetermined so they are not refuting it...
here is another article:
ABORTION CAN BE USED TO BOOST ATHLETIC PERFORMANCE
Source: Report News Magazine
Date: February 4 2002
By Celeste McGovern
IT'S that time again. Winter Olympics. You know it because of the outbreak of television commercials from all the "proud sponsors." They show parents driving kids to practice at the crack of dawn, and years later standing proud in the stands as their champion takes a Gold. They show athletes sweating and straining...and smiling proudly on the podium. All very inspirational.
Of course, they don't show the guy who beat his son's playmate's father to death because his kid wasn't getting enough game time. They don't show Olympic officials taking bribes. They don't show teenage athletes injecting steroids like junkies. Or female Olympic athletes deliberately getting pregnant and having abortions--just to boost their red blood cell count for an edge on the competition.
"Blood doping" is a well-known scheme by which athletes take drugs that enhance their blood supply and oxygen supply for an estimated 10% boost in performance. It's especially popular among the endurance sports such as cross-country skiing and cycling.
In the old, unsophisticated days, dopers used to siphon off their own blood, store it while their body re-manufactured their supply, then re-injected the stored supply just before athletic events, for a muscle-fuelling boost. In 1984, a third of the 24-person U.S. cycling team loaded up with transfusions in a California hotel room prior to the Olympics. They won a record nine medals, and their doping scheme wasn't uncovered for months.
Today, athletes pump their veins full of drugs like erythropoietin and Hemohes, blood expanders initially developed for surgery and patients with blood diseases. Vials of the stuff reportedly litter the European cycling tours. And there were lots of questions about the unexplained deaths of 18 high-level international cyclists between 1987 and 1990.
The various athletic drug police learned of the drugs, however, and they now perform blood tests to detect them. Last February, six Finnish cross country ski champions tested positive for banned blood expanders. Two team doctors resigned and a team manager and two coaches were fired after they admitted their guilt.
Still, athletes are determined. Besides ego and national pride, the stakes, including multi-million dollar endorsement deals, are high. "It seems like they play cops and robbers--the athletes and the coaches find a new way to cheat, and the drug committee finds a new way to catch them at it," Mona Passignano, director of research at the Texas pro-life group Life Dynamics reports. "But [the athletes] are always a step ahead."
One scheme that's virtually impossible to ban is pregnancy. Early on, pregnancy has the effect of boosting a woman's blood volume tremendously to fuel her unborn baby's growth. Getting pregnant two or three months before an event and having an abortion days prior to it can grant as much as a 10 percent performance enhancement.
North American athletes have never been implicated in the scheme, says Ms. Passignano, but athletes from countries they compete with certainly have. She quotes a Finnish sports medicine expert: "Now that drug testing is routine, pregnancy is becoming the favourite way of getting an edge on competition." One Russian athlete told a reporter that as long ago as the '70s, gymnasts as young as 14 were ordered to sleep with their coaches to get pregnant--and then abort.
U.S Olympic regulations ban the "pregnancy/abortion" doping scheme, though it's basically an unenforceable law.
http://www.ncln.ca/uwsfl/newsletter28.htm http://speakout.com/activism/issue_briefs/1380b-1.html
Source: Report News Magazine
Date: February 4 2002
By Celeste McGovern
IT'S that time again. Winter Olympics. You know it because of the outbreak of television commercials from all the "proud sponsors." They show parents driving kids to practice at the crack of dawn, and years later standing proud in the stands as their champion takes a Gold. They show athletes sweating and straining...and smiling proudly on the podium. All very inspirational.
Of course, they don't show the guy who beat his son's playmate's father to death because his kid wasn't getting enough game time. They don't show Olympic officials taking bribes. They don't show teenage athletes injecting steroids like junkies. Or female Olympic athletes deliberately getting pregnant and having abortions--just to boost their red blood cell count for an edge on the competition.
"Blood doping" is a well-known scheme by which athletes take drugs that enhance their blood supply and oxygen supply for an estimated 10% boost in performance. It's especially popular among the endurance sports such as cross-country skiing and cycling.
In the old, unsophisticated days, dopers used to siphon off their own blood, store it while their body re-manufactured their supply, then re-injected the stored supply just before athletic events, for a muscle-fuelling boost. In 1984, a third of the 24-person U.S. cycling team loaded up with transfusions in a California hotel room prior to the Olympics. They won a record nine medals, and their doping scheme wasn't uncovered for months.
Today, athletes pump their veins full of drugs like erythropoietin and Hemohes, blood expanders initially developed for surgery and patients with blood diseases. Vials of the stuff reportedly litter the European cycling tours. And there were lots of questions about the unexplained deaths of 18 high-level international cyclists between 1987 and 1990.
The various athletic drug police learned of the drugs, however, and they now perform blood tests to detect them. Last February, six Finnish cross country ski champions tested positive for banned blood expanders. Two team doctors resigned and a team manager and two coaches were fired after they admitted their guilt.
Still, athletes are determined. Besides ego and national pride, the stakes, including multi-million dollar endorsement deals, are high. "It seems like they play cops and robbers--the athletes and the coaches find a new way to cheat, and the drug committee finds a new way to catch them at it," Mona Passignano, director of research at the Texas pro-life group Life Dynamics reports. "But [the athletes] are always a step ahead."
One scheme that's virtually impossible to ban is pregnancy. Early on, pregnancy has the effect of boosting a woman's blood volume tremendously to fuel her unborn baby's growth. Getting pregnant two or three months before an event and having an abortion days prior to it can grant as much as a 10 percent performance enhancement.
North American athletes have never been implicated in the scheme, says Ms. Passignano, but athletes from countries they compete with certainly have. She quotes a Finnish sports medicine expert: "Now that drug testing is routine, pregnancy is becoming the favourite way of getting an edge on competition." One Russian athlete told a reporter that as long ago as the '70s, gymnasts as young as 14 were ordered to sleep with their coaches to get pregnant--and then abort.
U.S Olympic regulations ban the "pregnancy/abortion" doping scheme, though it's basically an unenforceable law.
http://www.ncln.ca/uwsfl/newsletter28.htm
http://speakout.com/activism/issue_briefs/1380b-1.html -
stillajwexelder
Against but there are always exceptions - women raped etc
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Big Dog
Stillla, there are often mitigating circumstances, as with homicide we have different types, premeditate, depraved indifference, manslaughter, etc. Mitigating circumstances are used to lessen the severity of the crime.
If I were king I would probaby go with no abortion as retroactive birth control, allowed for these extreme (and in the huge minority of cases) situations rape, incest, endangering the mother, etc.
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bisous
BD Said:
But on some level it appears that you do seem to get the inherent problem with the situation with regards to the domestic laws. But your advice to your childen would seem to negate most of the need for abortion, no? Why be so gung ho for abortion if what you really think the problems is, is people not wanting to take responsibility for their actions
Still haven't made myself totally clear I guess. While I do agree that it is patently unfair to force someone to pay for a child he was tricked into conceiving, this to me is an issue separate from the issue of abortion. I advise my children to avoid unwanted pregnancy, of course. Either because my son would have no say over what the woman would do and my daughter, should she choose to have the child, could potentially be left to raise the child alone and without financial support.
I am "gung ho" (??) for abortion .. well gung ho for rights over my body for precisely that reason. I do not agree that upon conception the embryo is a person, or life. I also believe it is my right whether to continue a pregnancy in my body. I am not going to argue this point, it is solely my opinion and for use when making decisions about my body. I do not intend to get into a debate about that.
What you believe, or other women or men is yours and theirs to decide.
But as far as our exchanges on this post, I believe we are discussing 2 distinctly different topics ~ Abortion Rights and US Domestic Laws governing parental rights and responsibilities.
Enjoy the rest of your day BD!
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Big Dog
Actually we were discussing both, as they are entertwined to a certain extent, but as I said before, discussing such issues with a layman is often futile, unless you are a lawyer, then I would apologize for that comment and be more than a bit bewildered at your responses.
I will repeat myself, I heard exactly what you said and understand exactly what you said and was responding to both your pro-abortion, or should I say, your pro-my body is mine to do whatever I want with and agreeing with you that the domestic laws suck, but saying that you seemed to not really mind that they sucked.
I enjoyed the discussion, and hope that you have a nice day as well as you have more of it left where you are than where I am.
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Mary
Zagor said: That’s rather a lame attempt to sidetrack discussion away from the real issue here, and at that a favorite WTBS method. It is good to see that Theocratic Ministry School worked for you Mary
Don't be an idiot---this was not sidetracking the "real issue" here, it was good question to ask and I noticed you had no answer. You think it's better for totally irresponsible morons like this woman to go ahead and give birth and then completely ruin a child's life rather than have an abortion?
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Doubtfully Yours
Undecided. It varies from case to case.
In case of pregnancy resulting from rape, abuse, or incest, definitely for it. In cases where it's well established that birth defects will bring poor quality of life, definitely for it.
Let's say I had a drug addict daughter that got pregnant and was running the streets looking for drugs. I'd have her get an abortion, and if I had my say in it, I'd have her sterilized too. Same in the case of people that due to their mental of physical challenge cannot care for themselves, much less will they care for a baby.
It all sounds cold, I know. It's my reality.
DY