Welcome Bobbi. I'm glad you're checking the place out.
Enjoy the board.
TheListener
JoinedPosts by TheListener
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70
Please welcome my wife to the JWD
by Paralipomenon inthis has been an interesting week.
early in the week my wife started corresponding with one of her old friends.
he is no longer a witness and while i'm not sure what the catalyst was they started talking about why he left the witnesses.
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48
Was the Watchtower taken off guard by the internet and XJW forums
by JH indo you think that the internet and xjw forums caught the watchtower off guard?
just a few years ago, disfellowshipped ones were powerless and rendered silent by the watchtower.. to what degree do you think the internet has made life difficult for the watchtower?.
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TheListener
I've thought about that too Tatiana.
I think it has to do with being artistic rather than purely logical. Just because someone is famous they aren't logical. In fact many famous people have business managers that handle their financial empires. Perhaps it is sort of an extension to have a religion handle your faith? Others may feel that a very structured religion grounds them and gives them some defined moral center.
I know the WTS attracts artistic and logical people and some that are both but artistic individuals tend to be more sensitive to the world around them and a future paradise earth (minus the first 6 billion deaths) must seem attractive.
imho.
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57
I know it's only a discussion forum...
by nvrgnbk inbut how has having a place like jwd improved your life?.
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TheListener
Since finding this forum I've lost weight, grew hair on my balding head, found a supermodel girlfriend and bought a Ferrari.
Oh, sorry, that was a tv commercial for making it rich in real estate.
I have met some great people that I consider true friends and I feel I have the support necessary to deal with my situation and enjoy my life.
Thank you all very very much.
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48
Was the Watchtower taken off guard by the internet and XJW forums
by JH indo you think that the internet and xjw forums caught the watchtower off guard?
just a few years ago, disfellowshipped ones were powerless and rendered silent by the watchtower.. to what degree do you think the internet has made life difficult for the watchtower?.
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TheListener
Terry I see one flaw in your Rome/Hanibal comparison.
The WTS depends upon converts. They need fresh recruits to constantly refill their ranks. The information on the internet may be useless to many dubs because they won't look - but potential converts do look - especially potential converts in industrialized nations with disposable income.
Sure Rome could hide behind their walls and wait Hanibal out. The WTS can't. They must venture out into our territory and preach.
Plus Hanibal had the chance to sack Rome directly after his victory at Cannae. Instead he tried to win allies using diplomacy. We cannot sugar coat the truth about the truth. Why would we? We must state the facts and let the possible converts decide for themselves. In my opinion this is how we take the fight right to the WT. We use their talk outlines, their literature, their recorded District Conventions, Circuit Assemblies, Special Assembly Days and the experience of thousands of former members to take the theological fight to their very door step.
We are in a battle for people's freedom. I believe the information on the internet has slowed the flow of new converts. Good.
Let the WTS cower behind their walls; let them warn their membership about us; they have now power over us or those they meet in the ministry.
More whiskey anyone?
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August KM provides solid evidence of declining JW morale
by sir82 inas you may or may not recall, the february '07 km (for the us) had a huge article, taking up the full 4 page insert, on the "blessings" of auxiliary pioneering.
the part covering that insert took up the entire service meeting (aside form the announcements).
the "encouragement" was that the us branch had set a goal of 160,000 auxiliary pioneers for the month of april ("if only one of every 6 publishers signs up, we can make it!")..
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TheListener
I'll look through my previous threads. I did a calculation over the past few years about how many english DCs there were versus Foreign Language DCs.
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I had no idea there were people who felt like me
by Orgull ini've recently begun challenging my beliefs.
all my beliefs, including those ingrained in me as one raised "in the truth".. a few years ago i sought therapy for chronic depression and my treatment was remarkably successful.
as a side effect, things that used to "work" for me no longer fit with the new emotional pathways and strengths i was developing.
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TheListener
Welcome Orgull.
I'm really glad you found the board. It's a real life saver.
It's great to talk with people who have similar experiences and can help each other.
I look forward to your posts and hearing how you feel as you learn more and more.
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23
R.F'S MUM JUST HAD EMERGENCY SURGERY
by free2think ini just spoke to r.f.
he told me his mum was rushed to hospital early yesterday morning in a great deal of pain.
she subsequently had emergency surgery and is now in intensive care.
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TheListener
I'm really sorry to hear this R.F.
I wish you and your mother the best.
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56
Birthdays—Simple Deconstruction of the JW Rationale
by AuldSoul into deconstruct the jw rationale surrounding birthdays, a few simple guidelines should be followed.. (1): don't waste any energy trying to convince a jw that birthdays are not pagan, if they suggest that, readily agree.
whether or not the celebrations are pagan turns out to be a non-issue that distracts from the main point.. (2): stay focused on the fact that jws disfellowship people for celebrating birthdays.. (3): stress the point that there should always be clear scriptural reason for disfellowshipping someone.
ask them often throughout the discussion whether this is the case, get them to reinforce this need to themselves.. (4): remember, the first goal is deconstructing their rationale, not giving them a new rationale, not convincing them that celebrating birthdays is a good thing.. once you have these well in mind, the deconstruction can begin.. jw rationale, in brief:.
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TheListener
From New Advent Encyclopedia:
So also in the Hieronymian Martyrologium (c. 590), besides the constantly recurring natale applied to the festivals of martyrs we have, e.g. on 2 August, In antiochia natalis reliquiarum Stephani protomartyris et diac. None the less a certain stress was often laid in Christiansermons and in mortuary inscriptions upon the idea that the day of a man's death was his birthday to a new life. Thus St. Ambrose (Serm. 57, de Depos. St. Eusebii) declares that "the day of our burial is calledour birthday (natalis), because, being set free from the prison of our crimes, we are born to the liberty of the Saviour", and he goes on "wherefore this day is observed as a great celebration, for it is in truth a festival of the highest order to be dead to our vices and to live to righteousness alone." And we find such inscriptions as the following
PARENTE FILIO MERCURIO FECE
RUNT QUI VIXIT ANN V ET MENSES VIII
NATUS IN PACE ID FEBRWhere "natus in pace" clearly refers to eternal rest. So again Origen had evidently some similar thought before him when he insists that "of all the holy people in the Scriptures, no one is recorded to have kept a feast or held a great banquet on his birthday. It is only sinners (like Pharaoh and Herod) who make great rejoicings over the day on which they were born into this world below" (Origen, in Levit., Hom. VIII, in Migne P.G., XII, 495). Naturally a certain amount of confusion resulted from this use of the same word natalis sometimes to signify natural birth, sometimes the passage to a better life. The former was consequently often distinguished as natale genuinum, natale de nativitate, the latter as natale passionis or de passione, sometimes abbreviated as N.P.
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Birthdays—Simple Deconstruction of the JW Rationale
by AuldSoul into deconstruct the jw rationale surrounding birthdays, a few simple guidelines should be followed.. (1): don't waste any energy trying to convince a jw that birthdays are not pagan, if they suggest that, readily agree.
whether or not the celebrations are pagan turns out to be a non-issue that distracts from the main point.. (2): stay focused on the fact that jws disfellowship people for celebrating birthdays.. (3): stress the point that there should always be clear scriptural reason for disfellowshipping someone.
ask them often throughout the discussion whether this is the case, get them to reinforce this need to themselves.. (4): remember, the first goal is deconstructing their rationale, not giving them a new rationale, not convincing them that celebrating birthdays is a good thing.. once you have these well in mind, the deconstruction can begin.. jw rationale, in brief:.
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TheListener
The Origen quote is found in the new kids book "listening to the great teacher" or something like that. It came out a few years ago.
Anyway, you can look the quote up on the catholic encyclopedia to find out the actual context. It has to do with celebrating our life on earth instead of celebrating the day of our death and we inherit our heavenly reward. It doesn't have to do with christians not celebrating their birthdays due to paganism.
If I'm mistaken on this please post it to this thread.
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Where Are Our Elders.....?
by Seeker4 in....here on jwd?
as in, we have tons of younger to 50 year olds, but only a handful of folks in the 70-plus category, from what i can tell.
so, is it just that older folks aren't on-line or computer savvy?
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TheListener
I know several in their 60s who have left but they have no interest in online discussions. I've tried to explain that helping others can be reason enough. They agree, yet they still do not post.