Honesty

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Posts by Honesty

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  27

  Did Polonius kill his wife? A problem with apolegetics

  by bohm in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a basic problem with christian apologetics when applied to the bible is that it relies on the tacit assumption you can draw reliable conclusions on the material.

  the most common form of apologetics start out by certain claims (the tomb was found empty, the disciples had post-crusifiction experiences of jesus that transformed their lives, etc.

  this is hearsay since the person who made the statement cannot be sworn in.

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  Honesty

  Caedes
  I would very happily change my mind if I was provided with empirical evidence that I was wrong. In fact I would welcome people providing such evidence. If people choose not to change their mind after being presented with such evidence then they are fools. You are assuming that the default religious position of believing things despite evidence also applies to more rational individuals. 

  Do you have any solid evidence that Jesus was a real person who was resurrected?

  Do you believe that Jesus was resurrected?

  Caedes
  Honesty,
  There is no empirical evidence for either Jesus being real or being resurrected.

  Any discussion regarding the reality of Jesus and His resurrection necessitates a degree of faith and participants willing to admit that they don't have all the answers, otherwise the discussion will go nowhere fast.
  

  
  
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  27

  Did Polonius kill his wife? A problem with apolegetics

  by bohm in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a basic problem with christian apologetics when applied to the bible is that it relies on the tacit assumption you can draw reliable conclusions on the material.

  the most common form of apologetics start out by certain claims (the tomb was found empty, the disciples had post-crusifiction experiences of jesus that transformed their lives, etc.

  this is hearsay since the person who made the statement cannot be sworn in.

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  Honesty

  Caedes,

  Do you have any solid evidence that Jesus was a real person who was resurrected?

  Do you believe that Jesus was resurrected?

  
  

  
  
• 
  27

  Did Polonius kill his wife? A problem with apolegetics

  by bohm in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a basic problem with christian apologetics when applied to the bible is that it relies on the tacit assumption you can draw reliable conclusions on the material.

  the most common form of apologetics start out by certain claims (the tomb was found empty, the disciples had post-crusifiction experiences of jesus that transformed their lives, etc.

  this is hearsay since the person who made the statement cannot be sworn in.

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  Honesty

  bohm
  Since the holy spirit obviously choose not to reveal anything to me we can only agree to disagree. The intent of this topic is to examine the rational basis for believing in the stories in the bible and introducing the holy spirit is OT. 

  
  

  I have no problem with agreeing to disagree with you or anyone else because each person is unique and has different views, opinions and beliefs than any other person who has ever lived.

  
  

  BTW, in the New Testament,  Jesus promised that He would send the Holy Spirit after He went away according to John 16:7-11.
• 
  27

  Did Polonius kill his wife? A problem with apolegetics

  by bohm in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a basic problem with christian apologetics when applied to the bible is that it relies on the tacit assumption you can draw reliable conclusions on the material.

  the most common form of apologetics start out by certain claims (the tomb was found empty, the disciples had post-crusifiction experiences of jesus that transformed their lives, etc.

  this is hearsay since the person who made the statement cannot be sworn in.

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  Honesty

  
  

  bohm

  
  Honesty: The argument in the OP is exactly trying to address the rational basis for forming ones view regarding Jesus and the bible in general. Asking if people think someone can change their mind is a distraction as their psychological predisposition is not really of importance. The issue is what the arguments in fact are and what is reasonable to believe. 

  
  I understand that.

  
  What is rational or logical about the "King of kings and Lord of lords" being conceived out of wedlock, being born in a barn, raised in a financially destitute home, going from town to town followed by a ragtag group of people who were looked down upon by the social elite as he preached a message of love, tolerance and change, imprisoned for his views and crucified alongside known criminals?
  
  Any discussion regarding Jesus' resurrection necessitates a degree of faith and participants willing to admit that they don't have all the answers, otherwise the discussion will go nowhere fast.

  
  A person who believes the resurrection is fact does not need all the facts to believe in the Resurrection, because the Holy Spirit intimately and powerfully reveals Jesus to them.  
  
  
  
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  26

  Called on a DF'd person today.

  by kairos in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  wow, what a surprise that was!.

  i expected a warm welcome, as this was someone i have known for a very long time.. nope, uber disfellowshipped jw.

  totally caught me off guard.

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  Honesty

  I know a woman like that.

  She was disfellowshiped for leaving her elder husband and moving in with a 'worldly' man.

  i asked her if she still believed Jehovah's Witnesses have the truth and after she said, "yes!" she refused to discuss anything critical of the Watchtower Society and called me an apostate.

  
  

  
  

  
  
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  10

  Dawn Bible Students TV Commercial

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  have you seen it?

  i saw two of them last night.

  they seem very similar to the watchtower society.

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  Honesty

  Then again, few people over 60 would see anything wrong with a homepage that looks like it dates from the mid-Clinton administration.

  
  

  I'm over 60 and see more than a lot wrong with websites whose look and feel is more suitable to 1989 instead of 2015.

  In my opinion the following website's homepage piques my curiosity just enough for me to exit out of it without further investigation. 

  http://www.dawnbible.com/content.htm
  

  
  

  
  
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  27

  Did Polonius kill his wife? A problem with apolegetics

  by bohm in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a basic problem with christian apologetics when applied to the bible is that it relies on the tacit assumption you can draw reliable conclusions on the material.

  the most common form of apologetics start out by certain claims (the tomb was found empty, the disciples had post-crusifiction experiences of jesus that transformed their lives, etc.

  this is hearsay since the person who made the statement cannot be sworn in.

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  Honesty

  I have a few questions to ask the posters on this thread who don't agree with or understand my views regarding Jesus. 

  
  

  1. Do any of the posters on this thread believe Jesus is real and is not frozen in history, distant from our circumstances and remote from our life experiences?

  If you don't believe Jesus is real and is not frozen in history, distant from our circumstances and remote from our life experiences do you think that I, or any other person can convince you otherwise?

  
  

  2. Do any of the posters on this thread believe Jesus is present, active, involved and engaged in our time and place and is still speaking and acting to make Himself known and to change the world?

  If you don't believe Jesus is  present, active, involved and engaged in our time and place and is still speaking and acting to make Himself known and to change the world do you think that I, or any other person can convince you otherwise?
  

   
• 
  27

  Did Polonius kill his wife? A problem with apolegetics

  by bohm in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a basic problem with christian apologetics when applied to the bible is that it relies on the tacit assumption you can draw reliable conclusions on the material.

  the most common form of apologetics start out by certain claims (the tomb was found empty, the disciples had post-crusifiction experiences of jesus that transformed their lives, etc.

  this is hearsay since the person who made the statement cannot be sworn in.

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  Honesty

  
  
  

  Why would anyone care to dissect the events surrounding Jesus' resurrection in order to know the truth about it?

  
  

  A person either believes it took place or they don't.

  
  

  sir82 sez:
  What an odd statement.
  Would you apply that same standard, "even you believe it happened or you don't", to any other important circumstance? A criminal investigation, a spouse's claim of infidelity, a legal document, anything?

  
  

  I am not into speculating, arguing or debating about an event that has been submerged in controversy for almost 2,000 years for several reasons.

  1. No one alive today was there to either confirm or debunk the event.

  2. What is the point in speculating, arguing or debating the event when most people have already made up their minds if it took place or not.

  3. I have a lot better things to do with my time than to try to enforce my personal opinions and beliefs regarding the subject on people who should be intelligent enough to determine for themselves that the event took place or it didn't.

  
  

  Have a nice day.

  
  

  P.S.

  FYI, I won a very important civil court case on December 4 during which the defendant, who lives in another state vehemently denied to the court any knowledge of. The defendant was convicted on 4 of 5 counts and the only reason he wasn't convicted on the 5th count is because the plaintiff agreed with the defendant's testimony regarding that alleged violation of civil law. 

  On a side note, if I had remained in the Jehovah's Witness cult I would have never been able to receive an education which would have afforded the lifestyle and financial benefits I enjoy since leaving it unless my name was Carol Wah or Phil Brumley.

  
  

  
  

  
  
• 
  10

  Dawn Bible Students TV Commercial

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  have you seen it?

  i saw two of them last night.

  they seem very similar to the watchtower society.

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  Honesty

  
  

  minimus
  They seem very similar to the Watchtower Society. Hmmm,

  
  

  Fruit doesn't roll too far from the tree.
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  5

  E-mail address of WT usa

  by paradisebeauty in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  anyone knows the email address of wt usa?

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  Honesty

  The Watchtower's address and phone number are listed on their jw.org website but the email address is not.

  
  

  I used to have a list of the email addresses for several of the higher ranking bethelites but have misplaced it, not that I would have any reason to email any of those frauds at this stage of my life.