Posts by jaffacake

24

I was wrong, CT Russell was something of a prophet after all...

by jaffacake in

jw
friends

i am reading studies in the scriptures (1911) thy kingdom come..on page 145 ct russell describes what is wrong with religions of his day and their sunday schools & bible studies, ie people belong to earthly religions or organisations.

was he describing other sects of his day, or did he forsee what his bible students would eventually become?

methods hinder real growth in knowledge of truth...guarded, pointed questions, with prepared answers and no time left for the bible hungry student...bible study, skilfully directed, so that he may get no new ideas...brief sessions [one hour] more agreeable than bible study...they are led to feel they have performed a duty, and a sacrifice.

jaffacake

I am reading studies in the scriptures (1911) thy kingdom come..On page 145 CT Russell describes what is wrong with religions of his day and their sunday schools & bible studies, ie people belong to earthly religions or organisations. Was he describing other sects of his day, or did he forsee what his Bible students would eventually become?:

Methods hinder real growth in knowledge of truth...guarded, pointed questions, with prepared answers and no time left for the bible hungry student...Bible study, skilfully directed, so that he may get no new ideas...brief sessions [one hour] more agreeable than bible study...they are led to feel they have performed a duty, and a sacrifice.

the true teacher's place, and the true bible student's place, is outside human bondage, free to examine and feed upon all portions of the word of God, and untrammeled to follow the Lamb whithersoever he leads...[in these last days] individual liberty MUST outwardly be recognised as never before...there never was a time so restraining on personal liberties as now.

Every spare hour of a zealous sectarian is filled by some of the many meetings or projects so that no time for untrammeled thought and bible study can be had. The principle design of these meetings is sectarian growth and strength, and the effect is the bondage mentioned [by Paul] so detrimental to the real development of the consecrated children of God, the wheat [from the parable]

No wonder they let this stuff go out of print, and after blaming Satan for telling Christendom's clergy to burn these books.

6

Anyone know any info about the new tract...

by princesslele44 in

jw
friends

that was released at the district convention this year?

?

jaffacake

welcome princess, what's the new tract about?

100

A Christian question, but applies to all thinking Christian too!

by free2beme in

jw
friends

no longer being a christian, it has become a mind opening experience to look back and see certian things i once ignored or just brushed off.

yet now i can not help but see these things and wonder why other christians do not.. if you have ever studied greek, roman or any other cultures religions in history.

then you have no doubt read their legends, about gods and how things came to be, and no doubt you have enjoyed these and at the same time you must have wondered how people actually bought this enough to make it a religion.

jaffacake

If the Bible is true, then it all has to be true ...

I am a Christian, but I don't believe any of the Bible is true, that is if you are decribing truth as meaning literal, or verbally infallible, as the fundamentalists & JWs etc believe. It is full of myth, errors, as well as inspired truth. Its authors were often wrong. I still believe its authors, and others were inspired (discuss definition).

I am a Christian, largely as a result of my study of science, having been agnostic or possible atheist for most of my adult life. Although we come from completely different perspectives, I am a Christian who pretty much concurs with James Thomas' worldview. That may seem a contradiction, but that is because I cannot put my thoughts into words as he and others on this board can.

p.s. you may well be right.

5

28 Years Later...Do I ask Jehovah where he is? Or do I still wait on him???

by Apostanator in

jw
friends

since i was told to wait on jehovah, the brother who raped my ex-wife had just turned 83. what happens if he dies before jehovah gets here?

the elders told me that jehovah would take care of things soon.

so my question is, what's your definition of soon?

jaffacake

I am so angry that I am lost for words. I am also angry at my best friend who was baptised a JW last week despite what I have told him. He believes his lifelong friend is a liar, wheras JWs he has never met always tell the truth.

I don't think we have met - A Warm Welcome.

29

What is Death?

by Blueblades in

jw
friends

what is death?

is it the ceasing of bodily functions due to illness or malfunction of a vital organ reversing the order of what occured at birth?

is the body nothing more than a shell and subject to ordinary laws affecting matter once deprived of its operating force?

jaffacake

plenty of evidence out there to support some type life after death, even if it's just coming back here as someone else

Although I try to have an open mind on this subject I am amazed by this comment, if there has ever been any evidence whatsoever, then why has it never been presented. Frankly, even the tiniest scrap of evidence would be front page headlines in every newspaper in the world for months. There are plenty of claims and assertions, which some people describe as evidence. (see 120 years of watchtowers).

If we are all honest, whether theist or athiest, we have nothing but faith, no conclusive evidence. Perhaps humans even considering this question can be compared with a germ being expected to consider quantum theory.

I consider myself Christian, but perhaps my faith is very weak, because my honest opinion is that I just don't know. Death may be nothingness, or it may be eternal reality, and something possible to experience. If eternal life is a reality, I do not believe it is anything like those who take the Bible literally imagine - paradise earth idea is truly nonsensical, and not even Biblical. If life continues in some way, and perhaps life is an inadequate word, then perhaps we are talking about unimaginable other dimensions. I think it would be so different from being human, as if we were to experience what it is like to be part of gravity or electricity or something. For those who believe in inspired scriptures, they seem to teach, if read according to scholarly principles and without bias, that everyone will have eternal life, ultimately, for some ""as if escaping through fire, because God desires no less, and what God desires must at least be possible. The 3 words "God is Love" trumps everything else in the Bible, including the vindictiveness in both old and new testaments.

2

Cities with walls

by jaffacake in

jw
friends

i was driving to work today when i heard a thought for the day on bbc radio 4, i think by a jewish rabbi.

i can't remember the point he was making, but something in his story seemed applicable to the jw organisation.

he said jews were about to study the book of numbers, wherin 12 spies were sent out to various cities to assess their strengths.

jaffacake

Thanks classi,

I presume one of the cities was Jericho!? I would love to see the walls of the Watchtower tumble.

11

When j.w.'s testify in court, who's Bible do they swear on?

by hubert in

jw
friends

let's say, in a child custody case, or something of that nature.. do they ask for the nwt?.

if they use the standard bible, because it's not the one they believe in, does that give them reason to lie in court?

(in their own minds).. hubert

jaffacake

When Covington and Franz testified under oath in Scotland in 1954, they told the truth. They admitted under oath that unity was more important than truth, they admitted false teaching and false prophecy and saw no problem with the idea that it was better for witnesses to follow false teachings of President Knorr than to follow correct teachings independently. It must be unity AT ANY COST. Even at the cost of truth.

Ironic that these are the people who describe themselves as in the truth, they have to keep convincing themselves.

2

Cities with walls

by jaffacake in

jw
friends

i was driving to work today when i heard a thought for the day on bbc radio 4, i think by a jewish rabbi.

i can't remember the point he was making, but something in his story seemed applicable to the jw organisation.

he said jews were about to study the book of numbers, wherin 12 spies were sent out to various cities to assess their strengths.

jaffacake

I was driving to work today when I heard a thought for the day on BBC Radio 4, I think by a jewish rabbi. I can't remember the point he was making, but something in his story seemed applicable to the JW organisation.

He said jews were about to study the book of numbers, wherin 12 spies were sent out to various cities to assess their strengths. All but 2 of the spies returned with pessimistic reports, that the cities had solid high walls which meant these enemies were very strong peoples indeed. Apparently that intelligence proved to be false. The point made was that people who have to separate them selves from others and hide behind solid high walls, may think they are strong, wheras in fact they are very weak. Only very weak and insecure people have to create such boundaries.

I am not familiar with the book of numbers but I can see clear paralells with the extreme insecurity of the JW organisation.

27

We are NOT appostate

by jimakazi in

jw
friends

not to rain on the collective parade but what makes people here think they are appostate?

most of us have come to a rational conclusion that the jw / wtb is directed by a bunch of old men not directed by the holy spirit, is fallable, and cynically changes doctrine.

so to be against that is not to be appostate.

jaffacake

Every significant piece of so called new light is apostasy, and the great apostate to this religion was Rutherford, surely?

31

Intro/Is it ok for me to be here?

by Sad emo in

jw
friends

is it ok for me to be part of your 'gang'?

you see i'm not a jw and never have been and a bit of of me feels like i'm gatecrashing.. i was raised in a strong roman catholic family - i was expected to believe everything the church taught without question and i did.

when i left school, i found myself working with an evangelical christian who, because she questioned my beliefs slowly made me look into them for myself - i truly hated her at the time for doing that and admit that i made her life a misery in revenge - but eventually i began to see that some of the stuff she was saying was right, we became very good friends and my real journey out of the rc church began.. i was too scared to leave straight away because of the doctrines i'd grown up with - no salvation outside the church and you can only really communicate with god through the priest (big issue here was how do i get my sins forgiven cos if i don't i'm gonna go to hell) - it was another 10 years before i finally plucked up the courage to leave and this was because of two things that happened:.

jaffacake

Sad Emo,

I'm another ex catholic, until early teens, then converted to adventist (evangelical) & baptised. Then rapid fade followed by agnosticism for 25 years or so.

My friend has just been baptised a JW, & his studies got me interested again, if only to prove JWs wrong. I have discovered much about what is wrong with catholicism, adventists and other fundamentalist religions through recent studies. I've never been a JW either but know more about JWs than most JWs, thanks to this site.

I too have suffered from depression, and am still unsure about my beliefs. I have however made some recent breakthroughs in my own understanding. You are very welcome, this site is not just for ex JWs. I came here to get my mate out of JWs, but I stayed on because of the great people.