Posts by Jeffro

35

The JWs slipped up again with the same Alpha and Omega error from 1978

by booker-t in

the saying people will make the same mistake over and over again is so true.

in the "revelation grand climax at hand" the revised one 2006 the wt again makes the same error and attributes the words at rev 22:12 to jehovah on pgs 306 and to jesus on the last page 319. you would think they would have learned their lesson from the 1978 wt blunder.

they almost use the same wording discussing the suddeness of jesus coming and jesus encourages his followers of his sudden coming and they list 5 scriptures and say jesus spoke them and one of the verses is (rev 22:12).

Jeffro

Again you are taking our definitions of the words and applying them to the activities of the anceients. The ancients on the other hand saw the two as connected and the same. We can review many of the greats like Copernicus, Galileo and others and they all did both. Astrology was considered science back then.

Your quotes about Copernicus and Tycho demonstrate the point I already made. As I've already stated, and as you've also said here, they - like the Babylonians - did both. That doesn't mean that both are the same thing. In any case, even if you like to consider them to have been the same thing, it remains that the elements that actually were of value were those parts related to astronomy, and not those aspects that were actually astrology.

We can see this in Job 32, where the author is using them hand in hand and interchangable.

Um... no.

35

The JWs slipped up again with the same Alpha and Omega error from 1978

by booker-t in

the saying people will make the same mistake over and over again is so true.

in the "revelation grand climax at hand" the revised one 2006 the wt again makes the same error and attributes the words at rev 22:12 to jehovah on pgs 306 and to jesus on the last page 319. you would think they would have learned their lesson from the 1978 wt blunder.

they almost use the same wording discussing the suddeness of jesus coming and jesus encourages his followers of his sudden coming and they list 5 scriptures and say jesus spoke them and one of the verses is (rev 22:12).

Jeffro

They were the same back then. There was no distinction.

No. They weren't. The definition of the word astrology didn't change somewhere in between. (The word didn't even exist at the time.) What the Babylonians did was a combination of astronomy and astrology, but the two are still separate classifications.

Astrology is a form of divination about people, and it is based on false premises. Astronomy is the study of celestial phenomena and their interactions.

Observing and predicting locations of stars and planets is astronomy. Speculating about the alleged 'meaning' of an eclipse or constellation is astrology.

But aside from semantics, I don't think you're really disagreeing with me in principle anyway.

345

My chat with 2 Dubs yesterday about UN membership

by jookbeard in

i live close to a resonanbly busy street, 20 odd shops banks, a train station,a couple of cafes and coffee shops etc and usually see dubs doing street work close to the station and i'm now on nodding terms with an elder who is out most days of the week and have got close to recognizing most of the hard core of about a dozen of them , i was walking out of the cafe yesterday to be greeted by a couple of newbies i'd never seen before , a scruffy short dumpy man and a fairly well presented middle aged lady, i'll try and abridge the conversation as best as i can, we must have chatted for about 15 minutes and it was all in a good mannered style;.

me " have you sold many of those this morning ?".

jw guy " oh no we dont sell them we give them away for free" (like i didn't know that).

Jeffro

In short, it's like this (apparently )...

The Watchtower, January 1, 1979, p. 30-31: A JW signing up at the YMCA to use the pool = bad

'jehovahsjudgment.co.uk': Watch Tower signing up to use the UN Library = no problem

In even shorter:

It's a farce.

35

The JWs slipped up again with the same Alpha and Omega error from 1978

by booker-t in

the saying people will make the same mistake over and over again is so true.

in the "revelation grand climax at hand" the revised one 2006 the wt again makes the same error and attributes the words at rev 22:12 to jehovah on pgs 306 and to jesus on the last page 319. you would think they would have learned their lesson from the 1978 wt blunder.

they almost use the same wording discussing the suddeness of jesus coming and jesus encourages his followers of his sudden coming and they list 5 scriptures and say jesus spoke them and one of the verses is (rev 22:12).

Jeffro

Splash:

Jesus - Light (1930) p. 268
Jehovah - WT 53 1/1 p. 31
Jesus - WT 55 7/1 p. 387
An angel (speaking for Jehovah) - Awake! 66 6/8 p. 28
Jehovah - WT 67 11/15 p. 680
Jehovah - Awake! 8/22/78 p.28
Jesus - WT 10/1/78 p.15
Jehovah - Revelation Grand Climax (1988) p. 316 para. 6
Jesus - Revelation Grand Climax (1988) p. 319 para. 15
Jehovah - WT 99 12/1 p. 19
Jesus - WT 03 12/15 p. 21

Surely you're not implying that they... don't know what the hell they're talking about?!

Except... Page 319 of the Revelation Climax book does not call Jesus the "Alpha and Omega". Read the introductions in paragraphs 6, 9, 13 and 15 on pages 316-318.

The fact that the author of Revelation probably intended to refer to Jesus as the "Alpha and Omega" in the passage is not the same as the attribution indicated in the Revelation Climax book.

35

The JWs slipped up again with the same Alpha and Omega error from 1978

by booker-t in

the saying people will make the same mistake over and over again is so true.

in the "revelation grand climax at hand" the revised one 2006 the wt again makes the same error and attributes the words at rev 22:12 to jehovah on pgs 306 and to jesus on the last page 319. you would think they would have learned their lesson from the 1978 wt blunder.

they almost use the same wording discussing the suddeness of jesus coming and jesus encourages his followers of his sudden coming and they list 5 scriptures and say jesus spoke them and one of the verses is (rev 22:12).

Jeffro

YOu are misunderstanding astrology in ancient times.

No, I'm not.

Astrology was how the ancients kept track of the seasons and time which was very important for their harvest and agriculture. Its easy to see how they associated this star appearing here to control the start of summer, which is exactly what the egyptians thought of the appearance of Sirius and the flooding of the Nile.

You're combining astrology with astronomy. They did both, but what they did know of astronomy doesn't validate their ideas about astrology.

Dont compare the nonsense in the papers today and give the ancients some credit for understanding time and calendars.

Their astrology was not exactly the same as, but not less nonsensical than, modern astrology.

Revelation is not prophecy its history written after thef act.

Duh. Likely while under the influence of ergot.

47

ONLY 500 DAYS REMAINING until the 100th Anniversary of Jesus reign...

by Calebs Airplane in

lurkers.... check your calendars... october 2, 2014 is only 500 days away.... look for illogical nu-lite from the wt in publications and conventions that will attempt to explain this away.. they've already bought themselves some time by splitting a "generation" into 2 overlapping generations... still, they have a lot of explaining to do... this should get really interesting... stay tuned.... .

Jeffro

Larsinger58:

That means christ would have to arrive within less than a year of April 6, 1993 and thus sometime in 1992-1993. That means Jerusalem has to fall in 529 BCE and not 607 BCE or 587 BCE.

As soon as someone insists that something "has to" fall at a particular time in order for some magical thing to happen, you can safely conclude that the person saying it is wrong.

47

ONLY 500 DAYS REMAINING until the 100th Anniversary of Jesus reign...

by Calebs Airplane in

lurkers.... check your calendars... october 2, 2014 is only 500 days away.... look for illogical nu-lite from the wt in publications and conventions that will attempt to explain this away.. they've already bought themselves some time by splitting a "generation" into 2 overlapping generations... still, they have a lot of explaining to do... this should get really interesting... stay tuned.... .

Jeffro

Este:

I might be considered a lurker and I say that the reign of Jesus Christ begin after the 911 attacks say sometime in the year 2005 say March 11th or so to be exact lol.....what about those apples?

No.

22

Men who lived almost a thousand years.....it makes me speculate!

by Terry in

i was waking up out of a sound sleep and a complete thought presented itself to me.. i should write it down.. so here goes.. the bible says adam lived 930 years.

methuselah lived 969 years.. now.... that led to other thoughts.... seems more likely the old stories of adam and methuselah use a word misunderstood by some later writer and maybe a confusion resulted.. maybe the word should have been moons.

like the apache use to say, "i've lived many moons...".. after all, the word month is a corruption of the earlier word moonth which means 30 days.. the lunar calendar was a very popular means of counting time waaaaaay back in the olden days.. .

Jeffro

Terry:

I hope the Judicial Committee looked into that one!

Yahweh hadn't bothered to tell them about statutory rape. So, probably not. But they probably filed away a blue envelope, just in case. I'm sure it's in Brooklyn now.

35

The JWs slipped up again with the same Alpha and Omega error from 1978

by booker-t in

the saying people will make the same mistake over and over again is so true.

in the "revelation grand climax at hand" the revised one 2006 the wt again makes the same error and attributes the words at rev 22:12 to jehovah on pgs 306 and to jesus on the last page 319. you would think they would have learned their lesson from the 1978 wt blunder.

they almost use the same wording discussing the suddeness of jesus coming and jesus encourages his followers of his sudden coming and they list 5 scriptures and say jesus spoke them and one of the verses is (rev 22:12).

Jeffro

Cold Steel:

Revelation isn't about astrology, for no one has been able to predict anything in the book using astrology signs or readings.

Revelation is a lot of nonsense. But even aside from that, astrology is also a lot of nonsense. So there's no reason at all to expect that anyone could accurately predict anything 'astrological' from Revelation even if it is 'really' about astrology.

many of its prophecies have already taken place;

No... (though some of the things in the author's past had already taken place)

and the rest appear to have excellent chances of being fulfilled.

... and, No.

51

Jeremiah Source Material

by Bobcat in

i started this thread as a single place for anyone who would like to add references to source material, or anything else for that matter, pertaining to the jeremiah book study.. .

page 52:.

here is a thread and numerous comments concerning jeremiah 13:1-11 and whether or not jeremiah traveled to the euphrates to hide a garment.. .

Jeffro

Bobcat:

Those articles basically formed the book of Jeremiah around four main characters: Jeremiah = F&DS; Few good people that helped Jeremiah = Great Crowd, Bad Jewish leaders = Christendom's clergy, Everybody else = Everybody else.

They do like their 'classes' don't they?! I wonder if anyone has ever pointed them to James 2:4...

Sorry, who was everybody else again?