Yeah I would have been a lot happier and a lot richer. Thinking that the end was nigh made me not want to prosper.
Spectrum
JoinedPosts by Spectrum
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JW answer to why Jesus was tortured to death...
by Spectrum in.. and not just quickly executed with a sword.
their answer is, "jehovah to show that a perfect person can withstand temptation under the harshest circumstances thereby proving that adam was not under undue duress when he took the fateful decision to follow lucifer".
so the more that christ was tortured and resisted the more this statement must be true.
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Spectrum
.. and not just quickly executed with a sword.
Their answer is, "Jehovah to show that a perfect person can withstand temptation under the harshest circumstances thereby proving that Adam was not under undue duress when he took the fateful decision to follow Lucifer".
So the more that Christ was tortured and resisted the more this statement must be true.
What could be more diabolical than having 8 inch nails hammered through your ancle and rist bones that was preceeded by a battering.
The logic that a loving God would allow torturing to death a person for the sake of others as the only solution to the Devils challenge is ludicrous.
THis explanation is not particular to JWs though. -
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TURIN SHROUD/ Has anyone found a faith after leaving??
by chuckyy inhi.. ive recently been reading some really interesting stuff about the turin shroud, how it could be authentic after all, and the evidence that points to its authenticity.
of course, this gives me reason for thinking that "what if the gospels are true after all?
has anyone else here looked at the subject of the turin shroud??.
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Spectrum
Yeah, myself, common sense and faith in myself and the realisation that I will die so make the most of a good decent life NOW.
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Spectrum
When I first left 25 years ago I thought of going back a few times and almost did. I'm so glad I didn't because with time I realised that their "this is the truth mantra" (which gets on my nerves hearing it nowadays by the way) is way off the mark. You need time to step back and analyse everything they have indoctrinated you with. But you have to be emotionally intelligent to see the truth of the matter otherwise they'll suck you back in. I sister is still in and as unsatified with life as ever as are her daughters.
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There is so much evidence around us to prove an Intelligent creator.
by nicolaou inthat's an 'ever so slightly' adapted quote from tophat on another thread; http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/12/108341/2880755/post.ashx#2880755.
i've been really dismissive of god/s, religion, faith and the abandoning of reason but when it comes to the 'argument from design', well you just have to give it a bit more .
respect?
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Spectrum
IP_SEC, Your checkered board is very interesting abstraction that to my mind could go towards evidence of a designer. If I saw something like that I wouldn't say it was impossible that the cards are only on the white tiles, I'd say where did the cards come from then I'd say how comes they are only on the white tiles. Environmental pressures don't prove the non-existance of God, therefore your black tiles don't come through for your evolutionary/no-god-needed bias conclusion. I believe that the laws of the universe are in two parts the physical laws and the evolutionary laws laid down by a creator who is probably nothing like the one envisaged by the world's religious community. Landing on the black tiles is easily explainded - grinding a wheat seed into flour is simple compared to creating one ie environmental pressure to destroy reducing entropy. On the otherhand landing on the white tiles something clever has to happen ie environmental pressure to create, add, change. Those playing cards have to turn into computer memory cards and you know that ain't going to happen for the next 4 billion years no matter how many layers of checker boards you have unless there is a law that says it is predestined to happen just like there is a law that says NaOH will always react with HCL to always produce NaCl and H2O. I have to say that if evolution is a random chance and environmental pressure alone then you would think that there would be alot more of it in evidence in this solar system. What do you think?
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Redemption of sin by Christ. OT support or made up?
by Spectrum indoes the ot support the christian doctrine that a heavenly messiah would come and redeem us of our sins, due to adams fall, hence the advent of jesus christ?
or was it a made up doctrine by the early followers of christ to give credence and purpose of existence to their faith?
if the latter is the case then it is understandable why the muslims believe that the christians are so wrong in belief in christ as a heavenly figure.
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Spectrum
So how did the Christians make up this elaborate doctrine? And do the Muslims and Jews have a point? I realise that it is a big issue to discuss so if anybody has any references I'd appreciate it. The JWs always bang on about how wonderfully the OT and NT are interwined and seemless and how one makes no sense without the other.
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Redemption of sin by Christ. OT support or made up?
by Spectrum indoes the ot support the christian doctrine that a heavenly messiah would come and redeem us of our sins, due to adams fall, hence the advent of jesus christ?
or was it a made up doctrine by the early followers of christ to give credence and purpose of existence to their faith?
if the latter is the case then it is understandable why the muslims believe that the christians are so wrong in belief in christ as a heavenly figure.
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Spectrum
Does the OT support the Christian doctrine that a heavenly Messiah would come and redeem us of our sins, due to Adams fall, hence the advent of Jesus Christ? Or was it a made up doctrine by the early followers of Christ to give credence and purpose of existence to their faith? If the latter is the case then it is understandable why the Muslims believe that the Christians are so wrong in belief in Christ as a heavenly figure.
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Acts 1:24 - Kurios
by TheListener inacts 1:24 in the nas reads "and they prayed and said, "you, lord, who know the hearts of all men, show which one of these two you have chosen".
the nwt says jehovah instead of lord.. the greek word translated lord or jesus (in some translations) or as jehovah by the wts is kurios.. can someone with the wts cd at hand tell me which manuscripts they state support this rendering?.
i have read the context and quite frankly it makes sense that it was jesus who they were talking to.
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Spectrum
If you consider the following about the first Christians: That the early christians didn't have the concept of the trinity. That all power came from God That Jesus said that he performed miracles with the power of God or his permission That the only text the jews had at the time was the hebrew scripture (OT)from which there God would help or smite. If Then you read the words Narkissos underlined then you can see that Lord is God and that they (christians) would perform the sort of things Jesus had peformed with Gods power but through Christ's name.
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Anyone from London? Help
by Wordly Andre ini just booked a trip to london, also booked some theater tickets, but now i am looking for a good stonehenge 1-2 day tour, any suggestions?
this is not my first trip to london, but i've never been to stonehenge and my wife really wants to go.
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Spectrum
Unless there is a guide there that can bring them alive for you then they are probably not worth going to. It's not like going to the Coloseum or the Acropolis.
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Logically consistent theories of ID exist.
by hooberus inthe following is one theory that comes from the id book the biotic messagehttp://www1.minn.net/~science/contents.htm by walter remine.
"an intelligent designer is necessary for the origin of life from non-life.
" the biotic message page.
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Spectrum
Can someone explain to me the assertion that a Designer requires a designer. This assertion it seems is always prompted by the statement that life requires a Designer? I think that this is simplistic reasoning that gets in the way of an honest searching analytical debate. a = b therefore b must equal c yeah if you want it to. There are a myriad explanations as to the origin of life and there are a myriad for the origin of God. Perhaps only one is correct for the origin of life and only one for God the two that are the truth don't have to be related as perceived in human logic terms ie if we were created by god then who created god. Therefore one of these myriad of explanations could be that biological life requires a designer but the designer does not require a designer. If life was spontaneous then perhaps life would just crop up all the time all over the place and biological reproduction would not be necessary. But it doesn't seem to happen that way. Something creates something else. Galactic dust clouds are the womb of stars. Something begets something else. You don't need a test-tube to scientifically test for that it is all around you. Something I don't understand is why evolutionist go apeshit when Creationists bring a Creator into the mix when all they are doing is exactly what evolutionists are doing which is observing facts and theorising around those facts.