I always hated the superior, judgemental attitude they took when someone chose not to answer the door. "home but hiding". They were always so disgusted that someone didn't have the courage to just come to the door, how hard is it? Did it ever occur to them that it is a bad time? Just because someone knocks does not mean the person is required to answer. If I haven't showered or am not dressed yet I don't get the door. No matter who it is. I had witnesses at my door a couple of weeks ago (I am fading and living in a new area, so they don't know who I am). I was loading my dishwasher and had just gotten out of the shower-wasn't dressed fully. I quick got out of veiw and went upstairs to look out. You should have seen their faces! Totally angry and disgusted that I didn't answer them-which they are sure is because I'm a godless heathen and have to hide from the Almighty message of the JW's. They haven't been back. Damn.
elliej
JoinedPosts by elliej
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37
What Can't You Stand About Jehovah's Witnesses?
by minimus ini'll tell you one thing that just got to me this morning.
i was playing tennis and at around 9:30 my tennis partner and i looked up and lo and behold!
2 witnesses were walking up the street.
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324
RICHIE RED ALERT
by RichieRich ini was on the phone speaking with verne thoren, presiding overseer of the willow springs, nc congregation of jehovah's witnesses.
he tells me he knows of my possesssion of the flock book.
he knows of my involvement on this site.
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elliej
Richie, I feel for what you are going through. Nobody likes to make decisions that they feel will hurt their loved ones. But as a parent I understand that at some point I have to let my children make their own decisions. And as a parent, I know that I will love them no matter what, even if I don't fully agree with them. That is what parents do, they love their children. They don't withdraw that love because their kids don't do exactly what they want them to. You seem like a very intelligent, well grounded young man. Whether your mom realizes it or not, it seems she has done a good job raising you. You have the courage to stand in the face of opposition and not back down. You are standing up for yourself and what you know is true. Good for you. I hope my children grow up to show such strength of conviction. Good luck and happy birthday a little early.
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Does this make any sense?
by elliej inokay, this is even confusing for me, so please try to bear with me.. i am working on a "presentation" to give to a jw family member to defend myself when the fade comes up.
i want it to be something that will make them think and this is what i have come up with.. this person believes in the whole 1914 chronology bible prophecy crap and can't believe this isn't the truth when they are so right about the date.
but i see a flaw with the way it was calculated and i need input to tell me whether i'm cracked or this might really work- get him to think.. according to the wts, "in prophecy, a year averages 360 days, or 12 months of 30 days each... so the kings "seven times," or seven years, were 360 days multiplied by 7, or 2,520 days.
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elliej
Yes, I did get you confused with someone else.
Thank God we got that cleared up. I would hate to be confused as some non-apostate!
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Does this make any sense?
by elliej inokay, this is even confusing for me, so please try to bear with me.. i am working on a "presentation" to give to a jw family member to defend myself when the fade comes up.
i want it to be something that will make them think and this is what i have come up with.. this person believes in the whole 1914 chronology bible prophecy crap and can't believe this isn't the truth when they are so right about the date.
but i see a flaw with the way it was calculated and i need input to tell me whether i'm cracked or this might really work- get him to think.. according to the wts, "in prophecy, a year averages 360 days, or 12 months of 30 days each... so the kings "seven times," or seven years, were 360 days multiplied by 7, or 2,520 days.
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elliej
Spectre, you must have me confused with someone else, I have read Rays book twice since November. I realize the 607 date is wrong, and I realize that secular historians trash the WT theory, but I'm trying to get a dyed in the wool JW to see the problems with the chronology. Simply telling them that Ray Franz exposed the problem or 607 is wrong according to everyone except JW's won't work. I need to find a fatal flaw.
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Does this make any sense?
by elliej inokay, this is even confusing for me, so please try to bear with me.. i am working on a "presentation" to give to a jw family member to defend myself when the fade comes up.
i want it to be something that will make them think and this is what i have come up with.. this person believes in the whole 1914 chronology bible prophecy crap and can't believe this isn't the truth when they are so right about the date.
but i see a flaw with the way it was calculated and i need input to tell me whether i'm cracked or this might really work- get him to think.. according to the wts, "in prophecy, a year averages 360 days, or 12 months of 30 days each... so the kings "seven times," or seven years, were 360 days multiplied by 7, or 2,520 days.
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elliej
Okay, this is even confusing for me, so please try to bear with me.
I am working on a "presentation" to give to a JW family member to defend myself when the fade comes up. I want it to be something that will make them think and this is what I have come up with.
This person believes in the whole 1914 chronology bible prophecy crap and can't believe this isn't the Truth when they are so right about the date. But I see a flaw with the way it was calculated and I need input to tell me whether I'm cracked or this might really work- get him to think.
According to the WTS, " In prophecy, a year averages 360 days, or 12 months of 30 days each... So the king’s "seven times," or seven years, were 360 days multiplied by 7, or 2,520 days. " Since these are "prophetic days" they do a day for a year. So good so far.
" The "seven times" of earth’s domination by Gentile powers without interference by God’s Kingdom therefore spanned 2,520 years. They began with the desolation of Judah and Jerusalem in the seventh lunar month (Tishri 15) of 607 B.C.E. (2 Kings 25:8, 9, 25, 26) From that point to 1 B.C.E. is 606 years. The remaining 1,914 years stretch from then to 1914 C.E. Thus, the "seven times," or 2,520 years, ended by Tishri 15, or October 4/5, 1914 C.E."
Here's my problem with this: Since they are saying that the 2,520 days are 360 days each, per bible prophecy, should they adjust that number since we don't calculate time that way anymore? 2520 yrs x 360days/yr = 907200days. To convert this period into our calendar year of 365.25 days we divide the period of 907,200 days by 365.25 days to reach a total of 2,483.8 of our modern calendar years. 607 bce + 2520 yrs = 1913 plus one year because there is no zero year. But 607 bce + 2483.8 = 1876.8 plus one year = 1877.8 or mid 1877.
Am I wrong or should they stick with the same calculating method? I mean, 2520 years with 360 days each just does not equal 1914 when added to 607. Any input would be helpful.
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If you were not raised in the truth.....
by jambon1 inif you were not raised in the truth but came in as an adult, how long did it take for you to realise that what you were taught in the bible study was`nt being practised in the congs.
for me, i realised things were`nt quite right before i was baptised, probobly within 2 years of association with the org.
when i became more heavily involved after baptism i realised that some elders/pioneers had drink problems and were involved regularly in 'secret' serious sexual misconduct.
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elliej
I was baptized before I had kids, and I was able to get out in service a lot and I felt like I almost fit in. But as soon as I had my first child things went downhill. All kinds of advice from sisters about how to handle the baby so I could listen at the meetings. Criticism for spending too much time in the "nursing" room-- pioneer sisters telling me to give the baby a good whack on the butt and they would learn to stay quiet in the hall. Sisters all wanting to take the baby to show me how to handle her. No thanks. Then the elders, "sister, will you please keep that baby quiet?" even when she was making minimal noise. Of course, all the back seats in the hall were hogged up by the people with no kids who liked to come in late and then leave during the WT study so we always had to sit up farther and it was a commotion to take the crying baby out. Yeah, it was about 2 years before it became very clear to me that things were not what I thought.
Then as the kids grew, the elders quizzing them on their bible knowledge and then comparing them to other kids who were already unbaptized publishers or knew all the bible books in order, etc. All competition. Do more, do more.
What sealed it for me was Sister Pioneer who answered during a Watchtower study that its easy to look at someone who you don't think goes out in service enough and think "What a loser!", but we should actually be trying to help them. The elder conducting the study had to explain quickly that she wasn't calling anyone a loser, please don't take it that way, but that is exactly what she was doing. By then it was clear to me that this was not about a brotherhood of love, but about slaving for the organization. That is when I started my fade.
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Complaints Against JW's in Local Paper
by Chloe ini've been amused at the verbal warfare going on in my local newspaper.
they have a column on saturdays and sundays where people can write in anonymously to say what they feel.
here is what someone wrote in a couple of weeks ago:
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elliej
To the person who thought it would be nice if we would not come to their door with Bible messages. You may be forgetting that a lot of people have interest in the Bible and enjoy visiting with us about it. We are going door to door to find them, and, believe me, we do find them. Also we are doing our part to fulfill the prophecy at Matthew 24:14, which is a privilege. No soliciting involved at all. If you change your mind, let us know.
Welllll, I think thats a stretch! In my years of door to door witnessing I can honestly say I never found anyone interested in the JW version of the Bible, let alone people who enjoyed seeing us. Sure, people took the mags, just to be nice, but I never saw anyone excited that we were calling. The only people I ran into with that response were Christians happy for the prospect to share their witness with me.
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Relationship with God
by dozy injust a general question , really.. i'm an active witness who is questioning & researching - unsure of any conclusions yet.
i've spoken to a couple of former apostates who have been reinstated as to why they returned (as i know that very few do) and the summary of their conclusions is given below.
i would appreciate your comments.. ...essentially they had a strong relationship with god and felt that this was the paramount purpose in life.
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elliej
Welcome Dozy! I have found that I am much closer to God in a more satisfying way because I no longer allow anyone else to define my relationship with Him. I act in accordance with my conscience instead of trying to live up to a relationship through the organization. I have not let my morals deteriorate, in fact I think they are stronger because I act to please my God now, not according to what the WTS tells me to do or not. Christian freedom is amazing.
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New forum member, have wife with a jw background
by insearchoftruth inhello, i have been a member of the discussion group for only a couple of weeks and have never taken the time to introduce myself.
i have posted a few threads which have been very helpful already and have had a few conversations with members of the group that have provided me support and insights that i did not already have and that i shall need.
now for my story.
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elliej
I agree, nip it, quick. I got involved with the JW's because the man I was in love with (now my dearly loved husband) was studying. I was warned right away about apostates, but I never saw any material against the society. Not that I didn't look, if only the internet was available then! The point is, I would never have gone along with it, got sucked in, whatever, if I had been shown the truth about this organization.
Get Ray Franzs book Crisis of Conscience and show your wife the info on the UN situation. Good luck.
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What has been your response with telling "devout" JW's about the UN scandal
by booker-t ini was talking to a elderly jw's lady at the donut shop the other day and i brought up the un and the wt scandal.
this woman told me that i was lying and that jw's leaders would never be apart of a "satanic" org as the un.
she said that "apostates" are spreading vivious lies about jw's and are only telling half truths.
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elliej
"I don't know anything about that!" And then he shook his head at my obnoxious, apostate lies.
I'm sure he isn't losing any sleep over it, he disregarded it before it was even out of my mouth.