That is good stuff. I wonder if they'll let me upload my version of "Dark Days Are Here" (The Bible's Hope for Mankind).
Posts by Cygnus
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5Listen to Kingdom Melodies as performed by the stars
by ezekiel3 in.
check out latindimples.com.
apparently a site hosted by a jw, you can listen to george benson, larry graham (sly and the family stone), the brother formerly known as the artist formerly known as prince, and others perform kingdom melodies.. my favorite is a instrumental by prince, life without end at last.
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31
Is It True That Since Leaving The JWs That You're Totally Angry & Unhappy?
by minimus inthe watchtower tries to say that "apostates" are in a bedarkened environment.
they are looking for "true freedom" which they say does not exist.
we are said to be "gnashing our teeth" and angry.
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Cygnus
I quit the Witnesses and now I suffer from anger/depression. I take 80 mg of Paxil a day, 2 mg of Klonopin, I self-medicate with 6-8 pills of 20/600 hydrocodone a day, sometimes I take a Xanax or three, I'm up to about 40 beers/drinks a week, not counting shots of Black Velvet whiskey, my business and personal relationships have all gone to hell, I feel like a walking time-bomb so I take 150mg of Haldol. On top of all of this I at various times scold and criticize my parents, my siblings, and even God himself without remorse. My girlfriend left me, she took both my dog and my truck, and I foreclosed on my house and live in a group house of five other degenerates. So I'm thinking that the Kingdom Hall isn't such a bad place after all. What do you all think?
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Cygnus
I quit associating with the Witnesses in 1997, but it took them until 2000 to DF me. My unrepentant sin was associating with a disfellowshipped person. I asked, How can I be disfellowshipped when I'm not fellowshipping?
So I brought my DF'd friend with me to the Kingdom Hall where the judicial meeting was held. I brought him as my witness to testify that he never, under any circumstances, EVER associated with me at all. The elders didn't think it was funny and I got the formal boot.
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Society says,"The 144,000 are sinners and have made mistakes!
by Blueblades inby permitting pressure and allowing his servants to come into new situations jehovah gets to know their motives and is able to select the 144,000 "sons" from the earth for his government.. the question is not: have these members always done the right thing?
since they are sinners and have made mistakes.
so, the society admits this in a public talk given 22 years ago!.
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Cygnus
1958 Watchtower, pg. 478
One
of Jehovah?s witnesses who claims to be of the anointed remnant recently went to the hospital and took a blood transfusion, voluntarily. Should she be allowed to partake of the emblems of bread and wine at Memorial time??R. J., United States.We, of course, regret with you that this sister who professes to be one of the anointed remnant took a blood transfusion voluntarily during her stay in the hospital. We believe that she did the wrong thing contrary to the will of God. However, congregations have never been instructed to disfellowship those who voluntarily take blood transfusions or approve them. We let the judgment of such violators of God?s law concerning the sacredness of blood remain with Jehovah, the Supreme Judge. The only thing that can be done in the cases of individuals like this is to view them as immature and therefore not capable of taking on certain responsibilities, hence refusing to make certain assignments of service to such ones.
Since an individual is not disfellowshiped because of having voluntarily taken a blood transfusion or having approved of a dear one?s accepting a blood transfusion, you have no right to bar this sister from the celebration of the Lord?s Evening Meal. As an anointed member of Christ?s body she is under orders and command by Christ Jesus to partake. Whether she is unfaithful as to what she professes to be by virtue of taking the emblems of the Lord?s Evening Meal is something for Jehovah God to determine himself. His judgment begins at the house of God. It is not for you or anyone serving the Memorial emblems to act as the judge, but to allow the emblems to go to anyone in the audience as these are passed along in the normal manner of letting each one have the opportunity to partake.
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If attending meetings: Are brothers still "reaching out" ?
by truthseeker init's been a while since i read any figures on the number of elders and ministerial servants in the united states.
i can't remember who said it, but one poster said a co commented that "there are more elders than ministerial servants.".
is this true?
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Cygnus
Why would anybody want to reach out and do anything in the kingdom hall? The atmosphere is so boring and sterile and dull and no individuality is allowed. Every hall has the same music, the same platform arrangement, the same sound system and mic system, the same system for territories and accounts, etc etc etc. Everything is the same. Everything sounds the same (too much treble, too little volume), all the decorations and color schemes are the same. Borrrrrrrring.
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Question on DF'ing
by Agent Smith in.
ok...if 2 dubs divorce just because they hate each other, they are not free to remarry.. if one of them does remarry, he or she will be df'ed.
lets say that this person gets married with another dub....what happens to that person?
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Cygnus
The whole thing is retarded.
My ex-mother in law, a JW, divorced her non-JW husband. Not because he beat her or cheated on her or pressured her to do non-JW approved things, but because she felt that she was "spiritually endangered" by remaining married to him (she basically just hated his guts).
Now I hear that she's getting remarried after some 8 years or so. When he got remarried several years ago she was so happy that she was now "scripturally free." My question was always: how can she be scripturally free after he's shacked up when he's not a JW and she was the one who left him?
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Celebrating Birthdays--Disfellowshipping Offense--Where stated in WT pubs?
by blondie inblondis is asking for help.
where does it state that if a jw celebrates a brithday that it is a disfellowshipping offense.
i have searched and searched.
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Cygnus
I'm pretty sure that if you quietly celebrated your birthday with a small group of friends and family there would be no issues with the congregation.
Whereas if you went ahead and printed out birthday celebration invitations, passed them out at the Kingdom Hall, complained if people didn't want to come, or held a huge party with lots of drinking and carrying on, and then kept talking about what a great time everybody had and advocated it to others, then you'd probably get counseled heavily. If after the counsel you kept on advocating birthday parties, then you might get DF'd for "starting a sect" or "conduct unbecoming a Christian" or some such.
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Watchtower Admits We Should Get Out of Her!!!
by minimus inthe july 15, 1915 watchower made this comment about the international bible students association (also known as the watch tower society), "if the i.b.s.a.
can be shown to be a section of babylon, we all ought to get out of it....if anyone can tell me how he got into babylon by getting interested in the affairs of the watch tower bible and tract society, let him show me how he will jump out, and i will jump with him".
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Cygnus
Pgs. 350-3 of "What Pastor Russell Said"
I.B.S.A.
? True Definition of Babylon.QUESTION (1915)
?2? If the I.B.S.A. headquarters should promulgate methods not understood orapproved by us are we to apply
Rev. 18:4 , "Come out or her, My people," and if so, how?ANSWER.
?I think if the I.B.S.A. can be shown to be a section of Babylon, we all ought to get out of it. Ifwe all get out on the same side, where shall we be then? I think we shall be pretty close together if all get out on
the same side.
The word "Babylon" signifies "confusion," and in
Rev. 18:4 , it is used in reference to mixing the things of Godand of men. There was a time when, throughout Europe, the kingdoms came very much under the influence of the
Roman Catholic Church. To some extent those kingdoms came under the influence of Christianity?to the extent
that there was Christianity in the Roman Catholic Church.
It is well to emphasize that there was a time when the Roman Catholic Church was the only church in the
world, and when the people knew no better than to be in it and of it. Where would they have been otherwise? Then
there came a time when the church officials, those who were high in the church management, succeeded in coming
into affiliation with the Roman Empire; and the Roman Church became its successor. Then the Church of Rome
began to sway the nations and to tell the people of this or that principality, "Your king is not in harmony with us.
You can select another one." Then there would be a revolution. The Pope and the Catholic Church were back of
these changes. That is the way it began. There is where the illicit marriage of the nominal church and the world
took place.
In many European nations this has now been gradually changed. In some the church and the state are
completely separated. But this change has not been made in Austro-Hungary. The people are strictly under the
control of the Roman Catholic Church. The church has to do with everything. In Great Britain, the representatives
of the church of England sit in Parliament, as part of the government. The church bishops are members of the
House of Lords. In Germany and Sweden, it is very much the same. Their government and God?s government are
linked together in the minds of the people.
This state of things God calls Babylon?the professed Church of Christ being married to worldly governments.
These have been called Christian governments by mistake. They are not Christian. Look at the present conditions
in Europe. The governments at war are not manifesting the Spirit of Christ. There are Christians in all these
governments, but the governments themselves are not Christian. The nominal church has been responsible for this
state of things. The situation has so warped men?s minds that they think their present course the right one. They
think that Christ is now reigning. In their minds the reigning kings and the parliament represent God on earth. The
Lord would have us separate from all this.
There is another way in which the spirit of Babylon manifests itself; as, for instance, in the Protestant
churches-Methodist, Baptist, Presbyterian, etc. They pander to the worldly spirit. They take note of the rich, trying
to work in with the rich and get the rich into positions in the church. Thus they recognize money above spirituality.
In many cases money runs the church. That is not the basis under which the true Church operates. There is a
system in connection with all of them, even in the Baptist church, the most liberal of all.
The Baptists will say, "We are in no bondage; we have no ecclesiastical control at all." They do not realize
that the spirit of Babylon has gotten into the church. Suppose we have here a congregation of Baptists. As a
congregation they call their own minister and attend to their own affairs. A certain minister, then, Brother A., is
called to serve them. But he must be ordained as pastor of this congregation. So they send for some other Baptist
ministers?say Brother B., Brother C., and Brother D. to ordain him. But Brother A. does not stand in very well
with the ministers called to do the ordaining. So they say, "We will not ordain Brother A.; he is irregular." And the
congregation ask, "You cannot ordain him?" Then they reply, "We have nothing at all against Brother A., but we
will not ordain him." So you see the preachers have the rule, and the people do not know it.
The Baptists will tell you the preachers have no authority at all. But the Baptists cannot do a thing without the
consent of the preachers; this they do not seem to know. The preachers hold a power that God did not repose
there. God never authorized any men to go and ordain another men to preach the Gospel. God does the ordaining;
and it is for the church to decide, according to its best judgment, whom the Lord ordains or calls as a pastor. All
this ordination by men is Babylonish, a species of machinery to manage the people. It is all worked just like
politics.
Nevertheless, the Baptists are the nearest free, of all so-called "orthodox" sects. The people in the Methodist
church have almost no liberty, except the privilege of giving money. That is the principal liberty they enjoy. The
bishops rule in co-operation with the presiding elders. At each annual conference the presiding elder and the
bishop have it fixed what minister is to go here and what one there. The minister that does not stand by the
presiding elder will go to the country place which pays only $400; while the one who does stand by him, though no
more capable, will be sent to a place that pays $1,000 or more. I have had several Methodist ministers tell me this.
They complain about it, but do not want to get out of a job altogether. That is not the liberty wherewith Christ
makes free. I realize that this is a system. Let me show you what a system it is. The bishops control the presiding
elders, and under them the presiding elders control the preachers; and so it is all the way down to the class leaders
They have their head or chief amongst them. They have a human head. The General Conference is the highest
authority.
So the Presbyterian church has a head in the way of a General Assembly which has the deciding of matters.
All this is according to the course of this world. The simplicity of Christ is not generally observed, except amongst
the friends of the International Bible Students? Association. There it is very general, and the Word of God is
observed. They learn to take notice when things are going wrong. The simplicity of the matter is evident to all.
On one occasion I was called upon by a minister of the Reformed church. He wanted to know how I managed
my church I said to him, "Brother?, I have no church." He said, "You know what I mean." I answered, "I want you
to know what I mean, too. We claim that there is only one Church. If you belong to that Church, you belong to
our Church." He looked at me in surprise. Then he said, "You have an organization; how many members are
there?" I replied, "I cannot tell; we do not keep any membership rolls." "You do not keep any list of the
membership?" "No. We do not keep any list; their names are written in heaven." He asked, "How do you have
your election?" I said, "We announce an election; and any or all of God?s people, who are consecrated and are
accustomed to meet with this company, or congregation, may have the privilege of expressing their judgment of
who would be the Lord?s preference for elders and deacons of the congregation." "Well," he said, "that is
simplicity itself." I then added, "We pay no salaries; there is nothing to make people quarrel. We never take up a
collection." "How do you get the money?" he asked. I replied, "Now, Dr.? , if I tell you what is the simplest truth
you will hardy be able to believe it. When people get interested in this way, they find no basket placed under their
nose. But they see there are expenses. They say to themselves, ?This hall costs something, and I see that free lunch
is served between meetings, for those living at some distance. How can I get a little money into this thing,
anyway?? " He looked at me as if he thought "What do you take me for?a greenhorn?" I said, "Now, Dr.?, I am
telling you the plain truth. They do ask me this very question, ?How can I get a little money into this cause?? When
one gets a blessing and has any means, he wants to use it for the Lord. If he has no means, why should we prod
him for it?"
There would be nothing to come out of, as an organization, if one is an International Bible Student. You cannot
get out of anything you have not gone into. If anyone can tell me how he got into Babylon by getting interested in
the affairs of the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society, let him show me how he will jump out, and I will jump
with him.
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Were Jonadabs called JWs in 1931?
by Cygnus ini was always under the assumption that the jonadabs were not called "jehovah's witnesses" but were called "companions" and other terms.
then tonight i'm reading schnell's book for the first time and he says that in a 1931 watchtower the judge used the parable of the penny to denote all watchtower adherents as jws (a gift, as it were).
what's the real scoop?
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Cygnus
: The "penny" article is a classic example of switch-and-bait.
OK, but I'm not sure I get it. Did that 1931 Watchtower mentioned by Schnell call Jonadabs "Jehovah's witnesses" using the parable of the penny or didn't it?
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Were Jonadabs called JWs in 1931?
by Cygnus ini was always under the assumption that the jonadabs were not called "jehovah's witnesses" but were called "companions" and other terms.
then tonight i'm reading schnell's book for the first time and he says that in a 1931 watchtower the judge used the parable of the penny to denote all watchtower adherents as jws (a gift, as it were).
what's the real scoop?
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Cygnus
I was always under the assumption that the Jonadabs were not called "Jehovah's Witnesses" but were called "companions" and other terms. Then tonight I'm reading Schnell's book for the first time and he says that in a 1931 Watchtower the Judge used the parable of the penny to denote all Watchtower adherents as JWs (a gift, as it were). What's the real scoop?