the oldest manuscripts are not considered the most reliable.. there are no "autograph" texts.
none.. there are no "original" manuscripts.. no two manuscripts agree.. the bible as we know it only came together in the form it now holds because certain men decided it should do so.. neither jesus nor his apostles or disciples carried bibles.. the apostle paul didn't carry a bible and none of his letters were in any of the scrolls considered holy scripture at the time he was preaching and forming christian theology as it is now understood to be.. largely, what the bible is today, is the result of certain men with certain agendas who had the authority to make their project happen.
they also had the power to destroy writings which did not agree with their agenda.
Satanus,
Not for that exat reason, but if I were to get knocked over the hea and believe in Jesus again I would be a Catholic.
PS: I'd like to start a new topic but the system says I have to wait 27 hours, and my last two attempts at replying here have been stopped by the software. How's about an explanation, Simon?
Edited to add; ezekiel, thanks for looking up that article. It is, I believe, what I referred to earlier.
the oldest manuscripts are not considered the most reliable.. there are no "autograph" texts.
none.. there are no "original" manuscripts.. no two manuscripts agree.. the bible as we know it only came together in the form it now holds because certain men decided it should do so.. neither jesus nor his apostles or disciples carried bibles.. the apostle paul didn't carry a bible and none of his letters were in any of the scrolls considered holy scripture at the time he was preaching and forming christian theology as it is now understood to be.. largely, what the bible is today, is the result of certain men with certain agendas who had the authority to make their project happen.
they also had the power to destroy writings which did not agree with their agenda.
I'm too lazy, depressed, tired, sad, sick, etc. to look it up, but I love how a c.1960 Watchtower brushes the whole argument aside and said that the Bible itself proves its authenticity and we don't need no stinkin' Catholics or anybody else to say what it is or isn't.
Cyg, of the slept all day and just got up at 6:30 PM class
yeah its morbid... but since we're not gonna live forever like we thought we might the first half or so of our lives, we're obviously gonna die someday.. and i dont want " keep your eyes on the prize " played at my funeral.. (keeping in mind that theres no one thats gonna claim my body to bury it anyway when the time comes).
i want " if you could read my mind" by gordon lightfoot.
" carry on my wayward son" by (kansas?
Don't care. Whatever my surviving family wants. I won't be able to hear it.
i know from going door to door that people are generally divided as to who god is.
what are your thoughts?
is jesus almighty god?
Well, I know people who would disagree with you, Tyre. None of us or anyone alive now was there, so who knows what was meant,
i really enjoy reading the stories/experiences you guys all post on here from your jdub days..... the funny, ridiculous, ironic ones make me laugh but reinforce in my mind that i've done the right thing by leaving that organisation.. the hurtful, sad, mean ones make me hurt as well but again - reinforce in my mind that i've done the right thing by leaving that organisation.. the scandals that go on - well same again - they reinforce in my mind that i've done the right thing by leaving that organisation.. i do appreciate the time you all take in writing down your stories and will never tire of reading them.
so if you have a story you haven't relayed here before because it is didn't seem relevant to a thread i would love to read it!.
cheers - miss peaches
Peaches, I guess this is as good a time as any to briefly recount how I came to be disfellowshipped.
Briefly:
After three years of complete inactivity (no field service, no meetings, no Memorials, no weddings, no JW functions of any kind), two elders stopped by my house under the pretense of inviting me to the (year) 2000 Memorial. I said thanks, but no thanks. They then remarked, 'Well, the REAL reason we're here is there is a judicial hearing scheduled on Saturday evening regarding the possible disfellowshipping of you and we'd like for you to attend.' My reaction was, to paraphrase, 'You mean I invited you men into my house, and you have the stones to tell me this? By the way, how can you dis-fellowship me when I am not even fellowshipping!"
The official reason for my DF'ing was because I had been seen associating with another DF'd fellow, a friend of mine at the time (we no longer see each other). So I arrived at the judicial hearing with my DF'd friend, and the elders asked, "What is he doing here?" I replied by stating that he was my witness, and that he was going to testify that at no time, under any circumstances, had he ever associated with me at all and the accusation made me against me was lies! Lies, I say!
The elders didn't think it was funny and made him sit in the coatroom.
They began the judicial proceeding and I spoke up and said, 'Hold on a second. I've read the Flock book. I happen to know I'm allowed a statement before the proceedings begin.' So they allowed me to read it, which basically consisted of me telling them I wouldn't recognize the "authority" of the council I was sitting before, and I ended with a scripture from Proverbs 18:24, which reads:
"There exist companions disposed to break one another to pieces, but there exists a friend sticking closer than a brother."
I said to them, 'You all wish to break me to pieces, but my friend out there is sticking close to me like a real brother."
Got DF'd anyway. But at least I got my point across.
Edited to change a typo: the word "and" for the mistakening typed "at"
i know from going door to door that people are generally divided as to who god is.
what are your thoughts?
is jesus almighty god?
Heh. I dig your style, Joe. Always have, for the 8+ years I've known you.
i have always had one "motto" that i have stuck by for as long as i can recall........to treat others as they have treated me.
on a discussion board we can and do get into things that may get heated at times, but most of us can usually agree to disagree and be done with it, dignity and feelings intact.
some folks have done some "bad" things and have dealt with them or in the process of doing so.
Hmmm... 18-19 year olds sure have a lot of testosterone. I'm not sure where I'm at, at 33 1/2 years old. I know I've had enough psychological trauma and way too much physical trauma for someone of my age. I consider myself an empathetic, family-oriented, confrontation-avoiding person. Even in my bar-hopping days of my 20s I was always known as the "peace-maker," breaking up fights and cooling things down with the right words (I'll spare you all the anecdotes). I've found that these days I can be calm and quick to say "sorry," but I get a sense of fury when my family or those I am close to are wronged. All part of growing up I suppose. Yahweh knows the JW cult stunted me until I started thinking for myself when I was 25. So these foreign emotions are still rather new to me and seeing psychologists, talking with very wise friends, and doing a lot of reading has helped.... I hope. And yes, this post is genuine; I'm not f**king around here.
since it seems people have trouble with percieving the transparency of others, i thought the idea of a "thread" for this was dy-no-mite!
(not only that but i also have a knack for mischief).
anyway...cyg have you won the oscar yet
I think some people, like Annie, post because they have a heart of gold and want to make even the smallest positive impact on someone's life. Others post because they're in love with the Net equivalent of 'the sound of their own voice' or they just get off on voicing their opinion. I think I'm somewhere in-between. Edited to fix a (what I consider) a grievous spelling error (I typed "their" instead of "they're).
i know from going door to door that people are generally divided as to who god is.
what are your thoughts?
is jesus almighty god?
Inquirer, I agree with you, as well as Jn 8:58 being rendered: "Before Abraham was, I am." Terrible grammar, and as you say, illiterate.
BTW, how many angels do you think would fit on the head of a pin?
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it's diamondblue74's big day tomorrow!
here's hoping the special day goes perfectly and wishijng a beautiful wedding db74 and very long and happy marriage.. crumpet x
I hate to rain on the parade, but for whatever reason after the initial fun wears off, the new bride seems to hate being married for the first 12 months or so. Clear that hurdle, and you'll be in pretty good shape, that said asssuming everything else goes well.
OK married laides, flame me away...
