Posts by scout575

13

"Why Won't God Heal Amputees?"

by scout575 in

"according to believers, god is answering millions of their prayers every day.

prayer seems to be especially powerful in the medical arena - god eliminates cancers, kills viruses, reverses the efffects of poisons, heals internal organs, repairs injuries etc.".

the above quote is taken from an ex-christian website.

scout575

"According to believers, God is answering millions of their prayers every day. Prayer seems to be especially powerful in the medical arena - God eliminates cancers, kills viruses, reverses the efffects of poisons, heals internal organs, repairs injuries etc."

The above quote is taken from an ex-Christian website. If you a JW considering joining a church that believes in miraculous cures, please spend time thinking about the question: If God is supposed to be healing the medical problems of Christians, why does he never restore the limbs of Christians who are amputees?

9

Scriptures You Will Not Hear at the 30-04-06 Church Sermon

by scout575 in

"but the same day that lot went out of sodom it rained fire and sulphur from heaven, and destroyed them all.

even thus shall it be on the day when the son of man is revealed.

" ( luke 17: 29, 30 ).

scout575

Lovelylil: Thanks very much for your comprehensive replies. I wish you peace in your life too.

9

Scriptures You Will Not Hear at the 30-04-06 Church Sermon

by scout575 in

"but the same day that lot went out of sodom it rained fire and sulphur from heaven, and destroyed them all.

even thus shall it be on the day when the son of man is revealed.

" ( luke 17: 29, 30 ).

scout575

Lovelylil: I agree with you that the Luke 17 account is indicating the sudden and unexpected nature of Jesus' return, but it is ALSO indicating that, just as the people of Sodom were destroyed by God, so too the 'ungodly' living at the time of Jesus' return would be destroyed by God. What is Jesus' sudden and unexpected return supposed to accomplish in connection with the 'ungodly' who will be 'caught off guard' by his return? The same thing as happened ( if you believe the Bible ) to the people of Sodom: Their destruction.

Notice that at Luke 17:30, Jesus refers to, "when the son of man is REVEALED." This is the same word used at 2 Thessalonians 1:7, where the writer refers to, "when the Lord Jesus shall be REVEALED." What does this revelation of Jesus accomplish in connection with the 'ungodly'? Verses 8 and 9 say, "In flaming fire taking VENGEANCE on them that KNOW NOT GOD, and that OBEY NOT the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall be PUNISHED with EVERLASTING DESTRUCTION from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power." The NT is very clear about this: All those who aren't Christians will be destroyed by Jesus when he returns. It is this ugly threat that I don't like. Happily, I don't believe a word of it.

SLICK WILLIE: Forgive me if I'm wrong but I got the impression from your reply that you think I'm still a JW. You'll notice from the last sentence of the above reply to Lovelylil, that that isn't the case. My purpose in making these weekly posts is simply to encourage JW 'lurkers' who may considering joining a fundamentalist church, to think very carefully about it beforehand.

By the way, I would welcome a weekly post from you listing the 'nice' bits of the NT. Believe it or not, although I am now an atheist I still enjoy reading certain parts of the Bible. I particularly like the KJV because of its charismatic turn of phrase. Look forward to your posts.

21

Giving a Talk on JW's

by aniron in

i have been asked to give a talk on the jw's, about 30-45 mins long.. but there is so much i would like to say that it could end up being either very long or boring or both.

if you had to give a talk about jw's to a group of people who really had no idea about jw beliefs and culture.

what would you included ?.

scout575

Aniron: I would mention how they believe:

1 - The 100% inspiration of a deeply flawed, barbaric, ancient text called the Bible.

2 - The grotesque punishments meted out by God in the Old Testament.

3 - The NT threat that anyone not listening to Jesus will be executed ( Acts 3:23 ).

4 - Jesus' promise that a fate similar to the incineration of the people of Sodom awaits the 'ungodly' at his 'return' ( Luke 17:29,30 ).

5 - The 'end of the world' is nigh.

I'm sure these points would be enough to put most people off JWs, and maybe a few other religions, aswell.

43

Do you not see, Do you not hear, Are you asleep?

by jw in

o timothy, guard what is laid up in trust with you, turning away from the empty speeches that violate what is holy and from the contradictions of the falsely called knowledge.

21 for making a show of such [knowledge] some have deviated from the faith.

2 timothy 3:1-13 .

scout575

Peacefulpete: I was always struck by the similarity between the 'last days' description given at 2Tim 3:1-5, and the then present-day description given at Romans 1:29-31. However, if the writer of 2 Tim 3:1-5 was describing attitudes that he believed were already prevalent, why did he use the future tense, "in the last days perilous times SHALL come."?

43

Do you not see, Do you not hear, Are you asleep?

by jw in

o timothy, guard what is laid up in trust with you, turning away from the empty speeches that violate what is holy and from the contradictions of the falsely called knowledge.

21 for making a show of such [knowledge] some have deviated from the faith.

2 timothy 3:1-13 .

scout575

jw: I remember a public speaker once saying that, reading Paul's description of the attitudes that would prevail during the 'Last days', was like reading the newspaper. I suspect that he read the Daily Mail, If Paul were alive today, he would be the paper's Editor-in-Chief.

9

Scriptures You Will Not Hear at the 30-04-06 Church Sermon

by scout575 in

"but the same day that lot went out of sodom it rained fire and sulphur from heaven, and destroyed them all.

even thus shall it be on the day when the son of man is revealed.

" ( luke 17: 29, 30 ).

scout575

"But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained FIRE AND SULPHUR from heaven, and DESTROYED THEM ALL. Even THUS SHALL IT BE on the day when the SON OF MAN IS REVEALED." ( Luke 17: 29, 30 )

"And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ASHES condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ENSAMPLE unto those that after should live ungodly." ( 2 Peter 2:6 )

"Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, AND THE CITIES ABOUT THEM in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are SET FORTH FOR AN EXAMPLE, suffering the VENGEANCE OF ETERNAL FIRE." ( Jude 7 )

The New Testament believes in, and condones the Old Testament story of God incinerating the men, women AND CHILDREN of Sodom and Gomorrha, and the surrounding cities ( Deuteronomy 29:23 ). The NT presents God's destruction of these people as a presage of what will befall the "ungodly" when "the son of man is revealed."

21

"I am Finally Free."

by scout575 in

"i read everything i could get my hands on, from secular scholarship to apologists, hoping and praying that christianity was the truth.

i had no choice but to come to the logical conclusion that christianity was untrue.

i actually went around for a while thinking i would go to hell because i no longer believe in jesus.'.

scout575

Auld Soul: I fear that you are pushing at an open door with me. Although my posting immediately above yours, partly answers your question about how I define early Christianity, I suspect that I didn't make myself very clear in the posting that you are responding to. I don't feel that its inappropriate for you to interpret Christianity as you wish, I don't want you to anchor your beliefs in a 2000-year-old-dogma ( far from it ).

The fact is that many Christians ( possibly most ) view the NT is the standard for Christian orthodoxy, and that any deviation from the NT is therefore heretical, and unchristian. My own belief is that the NT is a collection of writings of men who believed in a supernatural Jesus, WITHOUT any direction, oversight or inspiration by God.

21

"I am Finally Free."

by scout575 in

"i read everything i could get my hands on, from secular scholarship to apologists, hoping and praying that christianity was the truth.

i had no choice but to come to the logical conclusion that christianity was untrue.

i actually went around for a while thinking i would go to hell because i no longer believe in jesus.'.

scout575

Peacefulpete: Whilst it may well be true that Christianity was never a monolith, its clear from the Bible books that you cite, that their authors had much in common with eachother. They all believed in a supernatural, redeeming, returning Jesus, a day of judgement, eternal salvation, eternal damnation, reliance on the OT, belief in the Devil and demons etc.

These are among the beliefs that many liberal Christians have 'reinterpeted' out of their belief system ( who can blame them? ). Maybe the continual 'chipping away' at the Christianity revealed in the NT will eventually leave a 'Christianity' that is solely about being kind and helpful to people. As welcome as this would be, it would leave the label 'Christian', meaningless.

9

JW vs Orthodox Study, Developing a Verse

by jgnat in

a young man who has been asked to develop a talk around isaiah 60:22 "how does is this verse being fulfilled today" .

he asked me to help, but not just to prepare the jw-sanitized version, but how we might include some, you know, alternative interpretations.

i thought it might be helpful to compare how a jw would study and prepare for a study, versus orthodox (or the highly unorthodox scholarship of jwd) when tackling the same verse.. 22 the least of you will become a thousand, .

scout575

One of the most heartwarming aspects of the Bible are the restoration prophecies of Isaiah. They paint a beautiful picture of a glorious golden age that would exist among the post-exilic Jews in Palestine ( Isaiah 65;17-25 ). However, when we compare those prophecies with the reality of life, as shown in Bible books like Malachi, we find that the prophecies were a lot more inspiring than the 'fulfilment'.