Posts by lovelylil

12

Praying in the name of Michael

by moomanchu in

.

why not?

that is who jesus is in heaven.

lovelylil

The view that Jesus and Michael are the same person is absolutely false. It is a false teaching by Jehovahs Witnesses and Bible Students. In order to come to this conclusion, you have to read things into the scriptures that are not there. There is absolutely no scripture that states directly that Jesus is Michael or vice versa. No where in the Bible did ANY of Christs followers teach this. And the last Apostle to speak with Jesus, when he was resurrected to heaven (in Revelation) was John and he ONLY referred to Jesus as Christ Jesus or the Lamb of God. I spent over a year working with my husband and some friends taking the three so-called proof texts that Jesus is Michael, that the WT gives, along with other bible texts to show this is a false teaching. The WT started this because they do not understand the true nature of Jesus and how he is like Jehovah in Nature. (not the same person), so they had to explain who he was before coming to earth and because they claim he is a created being, they had to give him a name. So they said Michael based on the premise that he is the ONLY Archangel. Which he is not. If anyone would like to see my research, please email me and I will email you a copy. [email protected]

By the way, this teaching started with the 7th Day Adventists church and Russell belonged to such a church prior to starting his own religion. Lilly

56

Short Survey for Non-Trinitarians

by Amazing1914 in

jw
friends

the survey is intended for any ex-jws who remain christian, but continue to be non-trinitarian.

please give a concise, well developed statement of what you believe regarding the holy spirit.

please do not go into lengthy dissertations trying to prove your point.

lovelylil

Tor,

There are some doctrines we should agree on as Christians such as that Christ paid the ransom for our sins, and then died and on the third day was resurrected. Also that the Bible is from God and he is our creator. And some other basic doctrines. However, early Christians did disagree on some issues. And like Jim pointed out, everything is not black and white. I dont believe anyone or any one religion really has ALL the right answers. But you can tell if someone or some group as the Holy Spirit by the fruit it bares. You will have Love, joy, peace....see Galatians 5 for the rest. You are correct not everyone has it. Those like the WT and others who put down everyone but themselves and says they are Satanic, without even knowing all their personal views, is really showing they do not have the right Spirit. Also like you mentioned, those who can kill others you would question as to whether they had the spirit or not.

We can debate mildly about some issues (like the EXACT nature of the Holy Spirit) but must do so with mildness of spirit, not name calling or being aggressive. We have to look at all fellow Christians as ones that can teach us. Not only we trying to teach them. Ultimately though it is not even head knowledge that shows who is Jesus' diciples and who has Holy Spirit, but LOVE that shows us for who we really are. Lilly

56

Short Survey for Non-Trinitarians

by Amazing1914 in

jw
friends

the survey is intended for any ex-jws who remain christian, but continue to be non-trinitarian.

please give a concise, well developed statement of what you believe regarding the holy spirit.

please do not go into lengthy dissertations trying to prove your point.

lovelylil

Jim,

I think I will read the finished product and then give you feedback. Only because I am so busy with bible study and helping to teach others. Also, I am working on several research projects myself. And on top of this, a friend in India who mails out a Christian Magazine has recently asked me to write short articles and poems for his mag. But, I will read your paper, as I am always open to other people's views. And I think you are a good example of someone trying to work with the Spirit! Lilly

33

Update On Russell Owned Allegheny Graveyard

by Rig Boy in

"they write their boasts upon tombstones; they incorporate their deeds in obelisks; they place their hopes of remembrance in solid stones joined to other solid stones, dedicated to their subjects or their heirs forever, forgetful of the fact that stones that are deserted by the living are even more helpless than life that remains unprotected and preserved by stones (quoted in young 1993: 5).

a lot of skeptics have tried to weasel their way out of debates over weather masons planted the pyramid next to russell's grave and as to wether or not they wrote c.t.

russell's epitaph.

lovelylil

On the Pyramid next to Russell's grave it clearly shows the Masonic Knight Templars symbol (cross and crown) and the all seeing eye of the illuminati at its peak. (see also our $1 bill). Also, an elderly lady in my old KH (was 100 years old) had the original studies in the scriptures books and these had on the front of them the two winged disk sun god RA from Egypt. I have research Freemasonry and the winged sun disk represents the actual Masonic God worshipped in the higher levels of the Masonic order. I wish I had taken the books from this lady. I knew something was very strange about these pagan symbols.

34

Who really has the "TRUTH"???

by architect in

even if all else looks bad, due to the fact that jw's preach the goodnews of the kingdom in harmony with matt 28, doesn't this make them the true religion since technically no other religion can make this claim?

lovelylil

I don't believe that preaching to people that unless you become a part of the Jehovah's Witness organization, filled with pedophiles and false teachings and obey all the commands of men given by the self appointed Governing Body you will be destroyed at armegeddon by a vengeful unforgiving God, And that even if you do this and underline all your WTs , go to the endless boring meetings, and rat out those who are straying, plus put in countless hours peddling magazines that have nothing to do with Christ - and still you may not be saved by Jehovah when armegeddon comes is the SAME good news or gospel that Jesus and his diciples preached to others, do you?

34

Who really has the "TRUTH"???

by architect in

even if all else looks bad, due to the fact that jw's preach the goodnews of the kingdom in harmony with matt 28, doesn't this make them the true religion since technically no other religion can make this claim?

lovelylil

I am not sure if you mean bible truth only? There are many true things in the world. I am convinced though that there is no person alive today nor any religion that can claim that they are have the only truth. We can only claim to have our own interpretation of the truth.

17

Im annoyed about this

by jambon1 in

having been out of the org for a while now i have come to realise that when you think about certain viewpoints/activities of jw`s, it can really make you annoyed/upset/angry/laugh etc etc.

one thing that is pissing me off right now and has done for a while, is their attitude towards 'the worlds selfish pursuits'.

how often did you hear that those who seek an education to get a good job are 'seeking glory for themselves' and are doing the wrong thing.

lovelylil

cyber-sista,

You had me rolling with laughter with your last comment. How did you know I was on anti-depressents when I was in the Borg? Its like you can read my mind! LOL

Funny thing is since I left, I have been cured of my depression. I know it was from the boredom and swalling all the s***. that I knew was not true. And the constant argueing with my hubby about it. He was in the Navy a long time before becoming a JW, and was used to taking commands from the higher ups and walking in lock step. Thank God he finally woke up.

About the basketball, I knew one elder who punished his kids severely for shooting baskets at the park with other kids. He screamed at them for an hour about how Jehovah would kill them at armegeddon unless they were loyal to him. (I was a nieghbor and heard the whole thing). These kids were maybe 12 and 14 at the time. For Gods sake, all they were doing was throwing a ball. You would have thought they were caught stealing or taking drugs. I told my husband that I would never do that to our kids and never did. I was the TALK of the hall because my kids rode up and down the street on their bikes with "worldly" kids next to them. The elder who still lives down the street and his wife used to give me dirty looks about it. One day the elders wife came over to tell me she "noticed" that my kids seemed to enjoy playing with the worldly kids a lot. I looked her in the face (with obvious sarcasm) and said, Yes I know, isn't it wonderful that my kids are so sociable and well liked by everyone? OH, THE SHAME!

Nice comment about the elder who said you may become like them: We dont want the JWs to become nice, happy, well adjusted people who dont need meds now do we?

17

WERE THERE ANY SCAMS IN YOUR CONGREGATION?

by badboy in

jw
friends

any takers?

lovelylil

we had the usual tupperware, pampered chef, vitamins, all of that but also had a pyramid scheme. I dont remember exactly how it worked but the ones on the top were getting money and the ones on the bottm were not. When I was approached by a "sister", I was like no thanks that is a scam. She was so offended. I dont think she even had the brain power to know it was a scam. Anyway, I dont know how many got burned but we had a local needs talk about that type of scam a short time later.

33

Update On Russell Owned Allegheny Graveyard

by Rig Boy in

"they write their boasts upon tombstones; they incorporate their deeds in obelisks; they place their hopes of remembrance in solid stones joined to other solid stones, dedicated to their subjects or their heirs forever, forgetful of the fact that stones that are deserted by the living are even more helpless than life that remains unprotected and preserved by stones (quoted in young 1993: 5).

a lot of skeptics have tried to weasel their way out of debates over weather masons planted the pyramid next to russell's grave and as to wether or not they wrote c.t.

russell's epitaph.

lovelylil

Kenneson,

You said it is all lies. What are you referring too? Is it the pyramid that you are saying is not really there? Is it the tombstombs surrounding Russells that obviously are buried freemasons? What about the Laodician Messenger written on Russell's tombstone? If he was a special messenger, how come he got so much wrong? Please read the old WTs. That is if you like comedies. I think it is VERY interesting that there is a Masonic Temple right next to the grave yard. Also, when I first left the Witnesses and went to a Bible Student meeting, it took place in...........you guessed it..........A MASONIC LODGE. I was totally outraged and asked the elder how you can bring the supposed living church of christ and his body into a mason temple for worship. He said they looked at it like a VFW hall or something. It is not becuase the free - masons God is Lucifer. How much more proof do you need? And about the pyrmidology, that is FROM THE OCCULT. How can Russell claim to be appointed by God if he was involved at the time in any way with the Occult?

There is so much evidence pointing to his involvement with the free masons. But some, even if you were to show them a list of masons with Russells name on it, they will still deny it. They have to deny it because in order to accept it they will have to admit they were just following a man with no special abilities. This goes for JWs and the offshoot Bible Students. There is an expression: if it walks like a duck, talks like a duck and acts like a duck - then its a duck! And likewise Russell was a Freemason!

Please note: there are some groups called "free bible students" who do not adhere to Russell's false dates and do not believe he is a special messenger who taught the only truth.

17

Im annoyed about this

by jambon1 in

having been out of the org for a while now i have come to realise that when you think about certain viewpoints/activities of jw`s, it can really make you annoyed/upset/angry/laugh etc etc.

one thing that is pissing me off right now and has done for a while, is their attitude towards 'the worlds selfish pursuits'.

how often did you hear that those who seek an education to get a good job are 'seeking glory for themselves' and are doing the wrong thing.

lovelylil

It has been shown that the more educated a person is, the harder it is too control them. All the cults speak against higher education. They do not want you to broaden your mind and learn how to be critical thinkers. One thing that helped me finally leave the org. was that I was educated when I came in. Unfortunatatley, they put on only a good face in the beginning. The longer I was in, I noticed a lot of things wrong with the WT. My husband and I were always fighting about this. Because I studied english in college, I picked up right away on certain cues that are meant to control you like these:

On the one hand they would say in the WT that you should each carry you own load and some have different circumstances as far as how many meetings they could attend or hours in the ministry but then with the next breath, they ask things like, Could your lack of attendance or lack of zeal for the ministry be that you do NOT APPRECIATE WHAT JEHOVAH PROVIDES FOR US THRU HIS ORGANIZATION? or you DO NOT APPRECIATE THE COMMAND TO TEACH OTHERS THE TRUTH BY FOLLOWING THE COMMAND OF JESUS TO PREACH TO OTHERS? Hello, talk about double tongued!

Also, they ask questions that provoke a mindless applause:

Friends, isn't it true we are the happiest people in the world? Who is going to admit they are not happy? Especially when we are supposed to be in the only true religion?

On top of these I noticed in a short time that they only used a few key scriptures in the WT and REPACKAGED them over and over and over and over and over again. This is why we all suffer from MIND NUMBING BOREDOM in the Tower. Once you are in a very short time, you have heard it all. It is the same spiritual JUNK FOOD!

About knocking those who do charity, Once I tried to take up a collection for battered women in my hall. Remember when they had the Awake on the subject? While calling around some shelters to see if they wanted free copies, I found that they needed a lot of supplies. Well, while trying to take up a collection from some sisters of clothing etc., they tried to accuse me of giving to Babylon the Great. When I told them these shelters had no religious affilliation, I still got reamed out by the "sisters" asking me what have you done for the truth religions lately or the friends? Well let me see, I give over 50 hours per month peddling their magazines, give money monthly to support the work, take the elderly to doctor appts., give friends who are in need (including elders) money and food, clean the KH every month, volunteer at conventions, and still you have the nerve to ask what I have done?

One more thing: the totally stupid thing we used to be told about how we dont need to do charity because we are teaching the truth to them and this will last longer than a ham sandwich thing: well, we all heard this one before. How teaching the "truth" is more beneficial than food, clothes, or medicine, etc. because those things will not last like the paradise. I am sorry if my child is sick I would want medicine for him first. And I remember in the bible many times when Jesus Healed First, taught secondly. Can you imagine if Jesus said, yes I have it in my power to help your hunger, pain, etc. but I am only going to tell you about the kingdom which may or may not come in time to help you with your immediate problem. But too bad for you.

Maybe I should have given that elder in need and his family some old WTs to nibble on instead of the bags of food?