dedalus

Joined

• started 29 topics
• posted 929 times   see topics posted on
• send a message

Posts by dedalus

• 
  31

  No Moral Absolutes?

  by Rex B13 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hi gang,.

  those who claim that morality is subjective have painted themselves into a corner.

  how about this, kent, big jim, seeker, a.f., j.h., troglodyte trilobyte, hippo the dippo, lisa baby, mulan, ldh, boynenko, et al?.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  dedalus

  You're making the common mistake of over-simplifying scriture, which robs it of the all-important context.

  Wow, what a convincing rebuttal. I guess there are some contexts in which molesting prepubescent virgins is okay! Eh, Rex?

  Dedalus
• 
  31

  No Moral Absolutes?

  by Rex B13 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hi gang,.

  those who claim that morality is subjective have painted themselves into a corner.

  how about this, kent, big jim, seeker, a.f., j.h., troglodyte trilobyte, hippo the dippo, lisa baby, mulan, ldh, boynenko, et al?.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  dedalus

  I've only skimmed this thread, so I apologize if I'm being redundant, but:

  Isn't the Bible the most morally subjective code there is? Whatever God does is morally correct, simply because he does it. Thou shalt not murder, unless God does it himself or changes his mind and tells you to do it. Incest is wrong ... except in certain situations. Be loving and patient and considerate to your neighbors ... unless you're told to hack them up and take their virgin daughters for your own private use.

  What do ya say, Rex?

  Dedalus
• 
  42

  Are't You Sick of This??

  by Explorer in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  aren't you sick of being filled with so much hate ?

  i think hate is one of the greatest sins.

  satan hates jehovah, and his people.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  dedalus

  Explorer,

  I do not think you are stupid or naive. In fact, I think you are an intelligent person, and you should have more confidence in your intelligence.

  You write,

  I guess what one does in a case like that is just put it aside, at least I do that.

  Why put it aside? Especially when we're talking about the slaughter of billions of babies and children?

  I do have the answer: if there is a God, and he is omnibenevolent (God=love, as you initially stated), then the WTBTS does not understand him the least bit whatsoever.

  "But the Bible says he will destroy millions, including children!" you may protest. Well, if that's your conviction, then it isn't true that God is love -- for what could possibly be loving about a God who murders children? But if God is love, then the Bible must not understand him the least bit whatsoever.

  What do you think? I do think you're intelligent; I just want to see you apply that intelligence to this problem -- which doesn't mean that you have to end up agreeing with me, but that you'll explore the ramifications of each assertion you make. Thing is, all of the Witnesses I've known have not been able to engage this issue meaningfully. You might be the first, if you write back. I hope you will.

  Dedalus

  edited for content/clarification
• 
  42

  Are't You Sick of This??

  by Explorer in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  aren't you sick of being filled with so much hate ?

  i think hate is one of the greatest sins.

  satan hates jehovah, and his people.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  dedalus

  The answer, Wondering, is that Jehovah God is neither merciful nor loving. Of course, this would be more devestating if he actually existed.

  Dedalus
• 
  42

  Are't You Sick of This??

  by Explorer in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  aren't you sick of being filled with so much hate ?

  i think hate is one of the greatest sins.

  satan hates jehovah, and his people.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  dedalus

  Regarding those of you who think God himself seems not to be a God of Love, by your quotes from the scriptures, and the description of His judgment upon His Enemies, and their offspring, I can only say I can understand the feeling, but being myself flesh as I am, I just don't dare to judge the Almighty or his acts.

  Since when are babies and children the enemies of God?

  My questions deserve real answers, Explorer.

  Dedalus
• 
  45

  How the Net will reduce WTS ranks

  by Seeker in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  she is studying with one of jws.

  she has a study with her teacher, and then she comes here and talks about it.

  she learns that the wts teaches one thing to new ones, but something else entirely to those who are already baptized.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  dedalus

  Flip,

  Your qualifications to my statements are noted, but I fail to see why you're making them when I'm talking about the Organization's view of what a Witness should be. Another JW doctrine is that those who disbelieve but put on the appearance of believing are leading double lives, and hence are not good Witnesses.

  Dedalus
• 
  42

  Are't You Sick of This??

  by Explorer in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  aren't you sick of being filled with so much hate ?

  i think hate is one of the greatest sins.

  satan hates jehovah, and his people.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  dedalus

  God IS love, and love is forgiveness.

  Okay, Explorer. I need you to explain this to me, okay? I really, really want to understand. Will you help me understand?

  Here is a quote from a Watchtower that has made it difficult for me to understand how Jehovah can be a God of love:

  It is a serious time for children as well as adults, because children that do not obey Jehovah will not be among the survivors of that battle. God will not preserve them into his new world merely because they are children .... If you want to obey Jehovah you will engage regularly in the ministerial activities that are arranged by the theocratic organization. -- Watchtower 8/15/62, pp. 494-495.

  This makes me wonder about all of the billions of children whose parents aren't Witnesses, especially ones in countries like India, China, Japan, etc., where Christianity isn't the norm. How can a God of love kill babies? Please help me understand, Explorer.

  I also worry about my grandmother, who is an elderly Catholic. She goes to Mass and participates in the church and volunteers three times a week at a shelter. She's the sweetest person I've ever known, and although my family has given her some Watchtowers, she just won't change. I know she won't survive Armageddon, because the Watchtower says this:

  On Satan’s side will be all the rest of mankind, more than 99.9 percent, even as we read: ‘The whole world is lying in the power of the wicked one.’ That includes all the governments of the world together with their supporters, the commercial, religious and social institutions. Even the professedly Christian organizations? Yes, because all such that are friends of the world are making themselves enemies of God.” – Watchtower 10/15/58, p. 614-5.

  And my Kingdom Ministry from last year told me this:

  NO: “The masses of people facing annihilation if they fail to respond to the good news include our unbelieving relatives, neighbors, workmates, schoolmates, and acquaintances. -- Kingdom Ministry, September 2000, p. 1.

  So please, Explorer, help me understand how a God who is both love and forgiveness, who is indeed the very personification of these qualities, can kill so many babies, children, and grandmothers?

  Dedalus
• 
  45

  How the Net will reduce WTS ranks

  by Seeker in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  she is studying with one of jws.

  she has a study with her teacher, and then she comes here and talks about it.

  she learns that the wts teaches one thing to new ones, but something else entirely to those who are already baptized.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  dedalus

  I said the WTS is not the true religion, it is a publishing company.

  And Jehovah's Witnesses are required to give their allegiance to that publishing company. To be a Jehovah's Witness = believing everything that the publishing company publishes:

  We resolve that we shall obey all instruction received from the Watch Tower, knowing that such proceed from the higher powers, Jehovah God and Christ Jesus. We resolve to be completely obedient to the Society as the visible part of the Great Theocracy. -- Watchtower 2/1/40 p. 47.

  If we have love for Jehovah and for the organization of his people we shall not be suspicious, but shall, as the Bible says, ‘believe all things,’ all the things that The Watchtower brings out. -- Qualified To Be Ministers 1955, 1967, p. 156.

  Jehovah's organization as directed by his 'faithful and discreet slave' class should influence our every decision also. How may we avail ourselves of this good influence? By doing personal research in the Bible publications of the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society on whatever subject our decision concerns. This always proves to be a real aid in making clear to us the Bible principles involved and their application to our lives." -- Watchtower 10/15/98.

  I have just proven that being a Jehovah's Witness means obeying the "WTS," the publishing company that you claim is "not the true religion." Therefore, it follows that Jehovah's Witnesses are also false, since there is no meaningful distinction between Jehovah's Witnesses and the WTS.

  So who's twisting words now?

  Over and out. At least for today.

  Yeah, you always run away when it starts to get interesting. We'll see if you're back to face the logical implication of your post, namely, that Jehovah is a god of falsehood.

  Dedalus
• 
  113

  Silentlambs and Signifiers that Signify Nothing

  by dunsscot in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  call me a neopositivist, a semi-verificationist or semi-falsificationist, but the claims made by "silentlambs" reminds me of the shakespearean line that was quoted in the creator book published by the wtbts.

  that is, the contentions of silentlambs seem like much "sound and fury" that in truth signify nothing.

  i am of course referring to the supposed dateline show and the claims made about some members of the gb of jehovah's witnesses.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  dedalus

  Dunnscot,

  Well, if we all lead the kind of lives you advocate, there'd be no reason to write poetry, drama, literature. The problem with the positivist writers is that they fail to convey anything to do with the actual drama of being alive. Moliere's satires of middle class life, with all its attendant folly, can make me laugh, but he never convinces me that he knows what it is like to be in love, or has ever been in love himself.

  And your mind, which can do no more than regurgitate philosophical tidbits, atrophies without any real experience to think upon. The result: you come off as a bore and a snob.

  Dedalus
• 
  45

  How the Net will reduce WTS ranks

  by Seeker in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  she is studying with one of jws.

  she has a study with her teacher, and then she comes here and talks about it.

  she learns that the wts teaches one thing to new ones, but something else entirely to those who are already baptized.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  dedalus

  WTS is not the true religion. I know that, duh. The question is: who are Jehovah's people? I believe the Witnesses are and I choose to be with his people.

  So, let me get this straight -- I'll even put it into a neat little syllogism for you:

  1) Jehovah's Witnesses are not the true religion, which is the same as saying that they are a false religion.

  2) Jehovah's chosen religion is the Witnesses.

  3) Therefore, Jehovah is a god of falsehood.

  Cool! Thanks for proving what I've been saying all along, Godrules.

  Dedalus