Give Nat Sherman's a try. Lots of smoke, good punch, and yes, six pack of beer buzz...My new weekend smoke.
j
done4good
JoinedPosts by done4good
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20
How much control does the WTS really have?
by dozy ina theme regularly running through ex-jw / apostate posts is their conviction that the worship of jws is at best of a high control basis or at worst exhibits cult-like tendencies , so they often delight in the freedom that they now enjoy.. but in reality , how much control is exhibited on the average witness?
to take one example , at least 40k are dfd in an average year , and one would assume 3 - 5x this figure are reproved privately or publicly.
that means that over a 10 year period 20% - 25% of jws are seriously flouting the strongest moral code of jws , usually for immorality , emphasized in wt after wt , meeting after meeting.
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done4good
The real control victims (if that term is advisable) are the hard core 20%. These are the ones learn foreign languages , actively pioneer , give up parenthood , often have the most mind numbing of secular jobs or toil away in Bethel for years. They apply WTS counsel to the smallest level , even down to the smallest trivial degree , often to their own disadvantage. Sadly they take on board counsel that isn’t really directed at them
See your other comment below:
Ex-Jws often point to WT articles or quote public talks which state strict and often silly restrictions , non or dubiously-biblical in many cases. I’ve even highlighted some of these myself , in the past. But how much notice is really taken by the average JW? Other than a hard-core 20% (which you would get in any organisation) , I just don’t see the average JW paying much attention , and they often seem happy to duck and dive and rationalise away any issue that they don’t agree with.
This is precisely why the "real" mind control victims are the "average" jw. Despite the fact that they CAN ignore the counsel given off the platform, they still believe lock, stock, and barrel. If that isn't mind control, I don't know what is.
j
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38
Why So Many More Atheists in Europe?
by bavman intop 50 countries .
with highest proportion of atheists / agnostics.
(zuckerman, 2005)below is a list of the top fifty countries containing the largest measured percentage of people who identify as atheist, agnostic, or non-believer in god.
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done4good
Europeans have evolved more than the rest of us living in the "New World" (ie. Australia, NZ, USA etc).
Thye have had so much more time to evolve past the religion stage. It has nothing to do with intelligence, education, genes etc.
It just takes time.
Pope
A simple, yet very astute post. I think you nailed it, Pope.
j
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What Stage Are You At Now?
by mtsgrad ini was born in the "truth" and reached the dizzy heights of becoming a servant and that attended the ministerial school.
in the last three years i emotionallly left the "truth" and stopped attending last year.
however, i am still very confused theologically.
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done4good
Libery's right-sagan! I just finished a book called "misquoting jesus" actually written by a bible scolar of which the WT org has none on staff... as a matter of fact, the ignorance most witnesses have about the bible other than their ability to misquote it, is really amaizing. Check this book out dude, you'll love it,
Good read, Dawg. I read it a few months ago myself.
I would say Liberty stated my take perfectly. No need to reiterate.
j
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38
Why So Many More Atheists in Europe?
by bavman intop 50 countries .
with highest proportion of atheists / agnostics.
(zuckerman, 2005)below is a list of the top fifty countries containing the largest measured percentage of people who identify as atheist, agnostic, or non-believer in god.
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done4good
Btw, I do not intend any USA-bashing here as done4good puts it: those are really interesting and complex questions.
I did not mean to paint with too broad of a brush here, I just saw the thread may have been veering towards another "dumb American" thread again, and wanted to cut that off at the pass. I would agree that this is a very interesting topic, and I only intended to keep the content to the facts.
Jason
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34
Do you think that the 'Convention' tract work will seem silly to most?
by AK - Jeff inin this territory it will mean 'inviting' people to a religious convention about 200 miles away, about a religion that most already do not care about.
i believe this could be a 'tactical error' on the part of the gb, who seem mostly interesting in keeping the urgency level on high with this.
but as far as future converts are concerned, won't most people who were riding the fence as to classifying this group as a cult, go ahead and jump down on the affirmative side of the fence with this stupidity?
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done4good
So, is it OK for these non-jws attending to stay in a non-society recommended hotel now???
Just a thought.
j
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38
Why So Many More Atheists in Europe?
by bavman intop 50 countries .
with highest proportion of atheists / agnostics.
(zuckerman, 2005)below is a list of the top fifty countries containing the largest measured percentage of people who identify as atheist, agnostic, or non-believer in god.
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done4good
No education, the get tested to the hilt so they never get a good education until colledge. Which most can't afford.
No offense 5go, but with that spelling, and sentence structure, I wouldn't be talking about lack of education on anyone else's part. I trust you were just trying to make a point here...
Jason, (Of the tired of all of the USA bashing class), and yes, a proud agnostic.
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done4good
Working from home this week...Picked up the goodies yesterday. Humidor, lighters, cutter, and an assortment of stogies. Gonna light up a Mac now, in fact.
j
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done4good
Nvr, my take on the subject is this:
Probably the most convincing aspect of "the Lie", to most dubs, is that there really is a "top down" belief in the rhetoric they teach. In other words, a person who truly believes in what they preach is a very good salesman, no matter how wacked out thier explanations may be. Hence, I would say that as a group, they believe. (Can't get red to turn off, damn, the idosyncracies of this website drive me nuts sometimes!!). As individuals, they can and do disagree with what the org. officially teaches. This, unfortunately, is built in to their system. They are allowed to do that, so they see nothing wrong with it, and can remain true believers as a group.
I knew Dan Sydlik on a personal level somewhat, and he often had his own ideas on things, privately. He also saw nothing wrong with telling others these things. The trouble is, as a group, they believe in the "group think" concept, more than anything else.
Jason
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47
How did you feel when first posting on JWD?
by R.F. ini was in heavy doubt about the organization, but still in the back of my mind i was a bit hesitant of posting because it was the "unforgivable sin".
i think it took me 20 minutes to type my first post.
i still felt that once i submitted my post that a bolt of lightning was going to come down upon me, so my hands were shaking as i was typing.
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done4good
That said, just looking at the cover of CoC when it arrived, scared the $%!t out of me!
j