Posts by Pahpa

33

Watchtower deception regarding the TRINITY

by jwfacts in

i have finally finished an article outlining the deceptive way in which the watchtower presents its anti-trinitarian information.

any constructive criticism such as regarding errors that may have crept in is welcome.

since i cannot embed a page i hope entering the html code works, otherwise it can be read at http://jwfacts.com/index_files/trinity.htm.

Pahpa

I just wonder how important doctrine is when it comes to Christian belief. We are told clearly in Scriptures that we will be judged by our "deeds" not doctrine. Trinitarians and unitarians can line up various Bible verses and quote from the "Church Fathers" to promote their views. In the past, trinitartians and unitarians (Arians) killed each other over this one particular doctrine. In doing so, they violated the basic Christian teaching about love.

Jesus used the best parable: The Good Samaritan. In it, he illustrated how those who had "the truth" of that time (the priest and Levite) lacked the human compassion to help one in great need. It was the Samaritan who responded even though he was despised by the Jews for his apostate beliefs and his false religious practices. Yet, Jesus clearly illustrated who the "good neighbor" was....not those possessing "the truth" but the one who showed compassion and mercy. It's a great lesson for everyone today.

50

Notes From Hawaii-Gerrit Losch Talk

by Save My Soul in

a (conditional) friend sent me some notes from the talk in hawaii.

gerrit was the keynote speaker.

this occurred 'immediately after the tribulation of those days' (matthew 24:29), referring to the destruction of babylon the great.

Pahpa

I became associated with the Watchtower organization in 1952. Nearly every candidate and elected president used the expression "peace and security" as part of their political campaign and political speeches. And JWs would always point to this as "evidence" that this was in fulfillment of Paul's prophetic statements. 1 Thess. 5:3

The Watchtower Society has a history of using current events to justify their prophetic predictions. But it also is careful not to print material that could be used later to expose its errors. In these cases, they will usually blame members for reading too much in the articles or accuse the members of personal speculations.

But not too many years ago when discussing the "king of the north" and "king of the south" the Society clearly identified the Communistic bloc of nations led by the Soviet Union and the Democratic bloc lead by the U.S. as fulfilling this end time prophecy in Daniel. It also stressed that we were in the final part of the prophecy and were awaiting the "king of the north" to take the aggresive step to over run those democratic nations as described at Daniel 11: 40-45. It was understood by every JW that this was the view of the Watchtower Society.

Now, the silence of the Watchtower Society on the fulfillment of Daniel's prophecy is deafening. It is as if the Society never promoted its past interpretation. The only warning is not to speculate. Older members must have group amnesia to ignore this glaring contradiction.

15

My Memorial Experience

by oneairhead in

first of all i noticed that this just seemed like another meeting.

when we drove in we had people parking us in strange ways, not to mention that the amount of cars there was just as many as a highly attended sunday meeting and we do fine then when we have no one to park us.

they had more seats set out and there were no new ones just people who had not come in awhile.

Pahpa

I always thought it odd that JWs, particularly the women, took the Memorial as an opportunity to "dress to the nines." Yet, the same practice of others during Easter Sunday brought criticisms from the majority of JWs. It's just another one of those double standards that permeate the Watchtower Society.

29

What's more important??

by The Last Nephilim in

i'm placing this into the "scandals and coverups" section for good reason, i think.

a few days ago i had an elder and one of "the anointed" come by to encourage my wife and i to "get back to the meetings before it's too late".

i proceeded to tell him a few of the reasons why i've lost confidence in the elders and the organization, and he retorted with a real- life example of how i need to see that although the "brothers" can make mistakes, it's best to accept it as "jehovah's will" and play along.

Pahpa

There is one consolation over these obvious inequities in the organization. It has an accumulative effect with those who are aware of such injustices. It may not cause one to leave right away. But over the years it is registered in one's heart and mind and may eventually motivate one to question the entire structure upon which the Watchtower is built.

This was the case of my wife and me. It took years. But finally we concluded this could not be "God's organization."

13

Do you know any young(er) people taking the emblems?

by hotchocolate in

the memorial i think is getting close to being over in most parts of the world.

i'm really interested to know if the recent watchtower article encouraged any to partake for the first time.

did anyone notice this?

Pahpa

One of the oddest incidences happen to a brother from Maine. He was in his forties at the time when he decided he was one of the "anointed" and began to partake of the emblems. A few years later, he decided he wasn't of this class and stopped. Everyone who knew him kind of raised eyebrows over this on again, off again decision.

3

A recent ex study phoned to invite me to the memorial

by strawberry cake in

i have a friend,who i used to study with for quite a while.

she was slowed down in her 'spiritual progress' because she had to work tuesday nights.

so couldn't get to all the meetings.this prevented her from becoming a publisher for many years.

Pahpa

SC

The sad fact is that these feelings of love will be squeezed out of her as she progresses in her association with JWs. Obviously, she values your friendship at this point. It might be nice if you sent her a note to express your appreciation for her concern. You could express your own feelings of how you value her friendship and that you'll always be there for her. It may not change the situation. But it might also plant a seed of doubt in her mind about the unchristian course of shunning and disfellowshipping.

Pahpa

29

What's more important??

by The Last Nephilim in

i'm placing this into the "scandals and coverups" section for good reason, i think.

a few days ago i had an elder and one of "the anointed" come by to encourage my wife and i to "get back to the meetings before it's too late".

i proceeded to tell him a few of the reasons why i've lost confidence in the elders and the organization, and he retorted with a real- life example of how i need to see that although the "brothers" can make mistakes, it's best to accept it as "jehovah's will" and play along.

Pahpa

TLN

This is so typical of the "justice" one finds in the Watchtower Society. Instead of clearing the name of the offended brother and announcing his innocence, the leaders "reinstate" him to give the impression that he has been forgiven his misdeeds after seven years. Thereby, they cover over their own failings and don't have to apologize for this travesty. It is hardly what one would expect from a truly Christian organization. Rather, it smacks of the pharasaic attitude that permeates the entire organization of Jehovah's Witnesses.

11

WTF.... JW Official Website...1914 glossed over...GT in 1975 NOTHING!!!!!!!

by Alpaca in

wtf.

i nosed around on the jw official website for over an hour just to see how they were handling some of the dates that are/were central to their understanding of bible chronology.. there was absolutely no significant connection made between 1914 and our current time period being the purported last days.. and, even if they did shoot themselves in foot with the 1975 debacle, presumably the 6,000 year anniversary of adam's creation, which would have been marked in 1975, would still be a significant date in the witness timeline that would help to bracket the last days.. the jw website's internal search mechanism brought up articles mentioning 1975 only in the context of general interest articles about animals, current events, and other "fluff" articles.. the lying bastards have completely buried anything and everything that would incur culpability.. without 1914 and the generation that "would not pass away," they are citing evidence for the last days that is so flimsy, i don't see how they can sustain any significant growth or keep young ones from bolting once they are old enough.

their "solid" evidence is the same old recycled crap about wars, earthquakes, famines, selfish people....yatta, yatta, yatta... that could apply to any time in history.. i hope we are seeing the beginning of the end for the borg.

Pahpa

Alpaca

This has been the strategy of the leaders of the Watchtower Society from earliest times. It started with Russell's predictions that were altered as the dates came close or closer to the fulfillment time. Rutherford revamped the whole dating system of Russell. And he threw in some of his own predictions (Ex. the return of the "ancient worthies) that failed. These too were glossed over as we entered the Knorr era.

However, it is to be noted that each disappointment or change caused some to leave the organization. And this also continues today as confirmed by those on this forum. I admit that it is hard for me to understand why more don't question the obvious. But many are held by fear of losing their loved ones in the organization. But I do know that many of the "old timers" in the organization no longer have the zeal and enthusiasm they once had.

Pahpa

2

Watchtower Hierarchy

by Pahpa in

for years, the catholic church was the focus of the vitriol of the watchtower society.

but it is amazing how much the organization has become like the catholic church in certain aspects.. in the bonham, texas trial the society's lawyers argued that the society was a "hierarchy.".

in the sexual abuse cases, they argued for "clergy privilege of confidentiality.".

Pahpa

For years, the Catholic church was the focus of the vitriol of the Watchtower Society. But it is amazing how much the organization has become like the Catholic church in certain aspects.

In the Bonham, Texas trial the Society's lawyers argued that the Society was a "hierarchy."

In the sexual abuse cases, they argued for "clergy privilege of confidentiality."

One of the new corporations formed is "The Religious Order of Jehovah's Witnesses.

Can anyone add to this list?

17

just been to memorial

by 10p in

it was pretty ho hum.

probably the first time i've actually paid much attention to the talk (i used to be one of the puppets passing around the emblems) - it amazed me how little he talked about jesus, and how much revolved around the technicalties of the 144000. and is the number of anointed getting larger?

i thought it was down to 8-thousand something - he said it was 9 thousand and something last year??

Pahpa

It is very difficult for those who still have relatives in the organization ...especially mates. And they deserve our sympathy and compassion. Whatever course they decide, we have to respect their decision. After leaving the organization 25 years ago, there is still pain and sorrow felt by our family because of the separation from our loved ones. And I'm sure this is also experienced the members who remain in the organization.