hear, hear!
Posts by zarco
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10Mennonite elders demonstrate correct response to abuse within their ranks
by Simon in"colony elders suspected something was wrong when they wondered why one man was getting up so late in the mornings, and they decided to shadow him, said prosecutor freddy perez.. they then handed the case over to the police.".
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8117905.stm ().
not difficult really and a better reflection on their suitability as 'elders' in their community than the frequent "lets shove this under the carpet to protect our image" approach of wts elders ....
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Have you ever heard of brothers refusing to give public talks in other congregation(s)?
by asilentone inmaybe some of them do not like particular people in other congregations, so they refuse to give the talk there.
do you know of any experiences like that?.
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zarco
As LeavingWT mentioned, it is a practical matter. It takes an entire day to give a talk at another congregation. If the brother is even trying, he prepares on Saturday and then travels on to the KHall and gives the talk. After the talk it is common that the congregation feed the speaker, so then you have a lunch that lasts a couple of hours. Adding up the preparation time, the talk, the lunch and the drive home a weekend is gone. So from a practical point of view, a lot of speakers decide not to go outside their home congregation.
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47
An Open Letter to Jehovah's Witnesses
by AK - Jeff indear jw's -.
i was, not too long ago, one of you.
i loved jehovah, and his organization.
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zarco
Jeff,
Thank you for a thoughtful and reasoned letter to current Witnesses. Many of your points resonated with me. All the best to you and yours.
Z arco
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A little late for most of us - the top 10 reasons not to join a religion
by zarco inhttp://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/2008/05/10-reasons-you-should-never-have-a-religion/.
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47
What are the Major Issues with Jehovah's Witnesses?
by AllTimeJeff init's safe to say that in most instances, it appears that the catalyst for the final move away from jw's, the real start of a road toward a jw exit, is something that affected you personally, whether that was you or a loved one/family member.
we hit our personal bs level, can't take it anymore,.
then we start to examine the flaws of jw dogma.. i would suggest that most do not start a jw exit because they examine the dogma on a personal study project and find out that something isn't right.
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zarco
Jeff,
We have known the truth not to be the truth for years. We went through the motions for mostly selfish reasons and to some extent we still do. The personal experience that made us start to plan our exit was this:
We conducted many studies and rationalized in our minds that even though everything isn’t true that the people we studied with where better off with the truth than without. Those who see the type of people the Witnesses seem to attract – at least in recent times – understand what I mean.
So we study with a man and his live in. In a few weeks they are attending all of the meetings. They stop smoking, get married and want to live a life based on Bible principles. The wife was raised as a Witness, we knew this going in – but it had been about 20 years since she had even set foot in a Kingdom Hall. She was baptized as a child. When my fellow elders found out about her being baptized in the past they decided they should meet with her. I had no problem with this as I thought it might help her conscience to confess her past and move forward. You can guess what happened – they disfellowshipped her and said “ her acts of repentance where not commensurate with her sins”. WTF! Is that a requirement? Do acts of repentance have to match the deviation? Where in the Bible does it say this? That was the final straw. Never again would I submit to a wicked organization.
Zarco
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46
Has anyone got anything positive from the WT organisation?
by BloominMarvellous ineveryone seems to just hate the wt.. i am very upset with the way ive been treated but i dont hate them.. they have given me huge self confidence after helping me out of depression, although i have a fab counsellor, so they cant get all the credit.
they have made me independent as well, (i think my ex-study conductor regrets that!
) i suddenly have a mind of my own and am not afraid to use it.. i owe them quite a lot they have really helped me through some bad times but they have created some bad times for me too.
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zarco
Bloom,
Most organizations provide a sense of belonging, teach one how to engage and interact with others and because of the friendships that result from association – provide a support group.
If the organization is focused on a “common good” like teaching literacy, feeding those without the means to do so and other worthwhile endeavors, the sense of accomplishment can be life changing and meaningful.
Any positives in the Watchtower organization are not unique to the organization. For most of the folks on this website, the harm – intellectual, emotional and physical – far outweighs the benefits.
I am glad that you find some good in the organization. It is possible that you might have found it even better somewhere else.
Best,
Zarco
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57
To Fade or Not To Fade... An Opinion.....
by AllTimeJeff injust a couple of set of ground rules i would like to set for this.
frequently, one of two options for those who want to leave jw's are 1) a purposeful, public, resignation (or disassociation as jw's call it) vs 2) what is commonly called in the ex jw internet world, "the fade".
i know that emotions run deep on this subject for good reason, because of what is at stake, and all that is perceived to be lost.
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zarco
Narkissos’ point that “you can build self-value on approval from a group ( JWs , exJWs too... or other) -- or from the very opposite, by standing out or against a given group. In both cases you are still using the group” is where we endeavor to be in our actions and thinking.
However, once one is a Witness it is almost like being a citizen of a country. One cannot easily renounce one’s citizenship because of differences in beliefs or disagreement with the actions of a country. One could and likely would engage in a debate to express such disagreement.
It is insidious that we cannot engage in a healthy debate and express disappointment in or opposition to Watchtower positions. That path leads to losing one’s citizenship. It is sad to me that the only real choices are a stand against or a fade. The choice to “not use the group” is to me an end point of the two decisions.
For the record, we choose to fade. I resigned my position. I could, not in good conscience, conduct the bookstudy any longer. I still cannot believe that I could conduct the study in the Revelation book with a straight face. The last talk I was assigned was a special needs talk on education. I could not do it.
Fortunately, for years my family and I have always discussed how many of the Watchtower teachings are flawed. We were in the wait and see camp. Even before I resigned my family just went through the motions. We are now on active fade because of “health reasons” and “discouragement”. Interestingly, we may be the healthiest and most encouraged we have ever been.
We will get to the point where the group has no influence on us… just not quite there yet.
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57
To Fade or Not To Fade... An Opinion.....
by AllTimeJeff injust a couple of set of ground rules i would like to set for this.
frequently, one of two options for those who want to leave jw's are 1) a purposeful, public, resignation (or disassociation as jw's call it) vs 2) what is commonly called in the ex jw internet world, "the fade".
i know that emotions run deep on this subject for good reason, because of what is at stake, and all that is perceived to be lost.
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zarco
Narkissos’ point that “you can build self-value on approval from a group ( JWs , exJWs too... or other) -- or from the very opposite, by standing out or against a given group. In both cases you are still using the group” is where we endeavor to be in our actions and thinking.
However, once one is a Witness it is almost like being a citizen of a country. One cannot easily renounce one’s citizenship because of differences in beliefs or disagreement with the actions of a country. One could and likely would engage in a debate to express such disagreement.
It is insidious that we cannot engage in a healthy debate and express disappointment in or opposition to Watchtower positions. That path leads to losing one’s citizenship. It is sad to me that the only real choices are a stand against or a fade. The choice to “not use the group” is to me an end point of the two decisions.
For the record, we choose to fade. I resigned my position. I could, not in good conscience, conduct the bookstudy any longer. I still cannot believe that I could conduct the study in the Revelation book with a straight face. The last talk I was assigned was a special needs talk on education. I could not do it.
Fortunately, for years my family and I have always discussed how many of the Watchtower teachings are flawed. We were in the wait and see camp. Even before I resigned my family just went through the motions. We are now on active fade because of “health reasons” and “discouragement”. Interestingly, we may be the healthiest and most encouraged we have ever been.
We will get to the point where the group has no influence on us… just not quite there yet.
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Daniel Made Simple!
by Leolaia inthe large horn on the goat is the first king of greece (8:21), obviously alexander the great.
after his death, alexander?s kingdom was divided among four of his generals (8:22).
the high priest), and further causes the daily sacrifices to cease, and the sanctuary to be defiled (8:11).
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zarco
Leo,
Thanks for your excellent research. Like JWdaughter, I think some of these older technical threads are just amazing. I am shocked at my years of ignorance regarding the authorship, environment and motives of bible writers. At least I am figuring it out now.
Zarco
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19
Looking for a haircut? Try this place. Read first three reviews...
by Elsewhere inhe asked me if i wanted a free shave, i said sure.
other than that, it was a great place to get a hair cut and free shave.. .
by gretch03/15/2009pretty good haircut.
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zarco
I think there are a lot of local folks close. I am afraid to go to a gathering of us because, (1) I think I will meet an acquaintance and (2) we still attend from time to time for personal reasons. Regarding haircuts, my guy moved to Alameda, don't really want to head over there just for a hair cut.....
zarco