Posts by LanDi

20

How much control does the WTS really have?

by dozy in

a theme regularly running through ex-jw / apostate posts is their conviction that the worship of jws is at best of a high control basis or at worst exhibits cult-like tendencies , so they often delight in the freedom that they now enjoy.. but in reality , how much control is exhibited on the average witness?

to take one example , at least 40k are dfd in an average year , and one would assume 3 - 5x this figure are reproved privately or publicly.

that means that over a 10 year period 20% - 25% of jws are seriously flouting the strongest moral code of jws , usually for immorality , emphasized in wt after wt , meeting after meeting.

LanDi

I find that a rather strange question !! I think the problem stems more down to insinuation , far more than actual - ' You must not ' or similar lines , although the Watchtower has frequently stated Jesus words ' My followers are no part of this world' and stretched it with comments such as ' Christians cannot move to the moon' cleverly insinuating that there is great peril outside the Org, and without actually realising it, you grow a subconscious fear of all things outside, especially mixing with outsiders for fear that you may be misled ( Kind of like a group of lions isolating its prey - trapped from out side help) Their pictures are also highly suggestive, I remember well over a decade ago reading an Awake article which showed a Christian (Witness) being invited into a pub - which he refused. This cutting off from Society surely does not give a very good Witness !

The scriptures are a gold mine for gaining control - a relative of mine who has recently become a Witness, one of the first scriptures they knew of by heart, down to page and verse was ' Beware of Bad associations.' You can see from that fact, the power of the Org beginning to gain control. Once in there's little coming out the scriptures say ' make sure of all things' yet a witness is not allowed to read anything contrary, "apostate" and is greatly discouraged from reading bible literature produced elsewhere - despite the huge quality of work produced by eminent biblical scolars. I can agree with avoiding the work of the likes of the Archbishop of Canterbury who reportedly does not even believe in God but this is bordering on ridiculous.

The society controls almost all aspects of your life through its articles, even down to releasing articles on what is acceptable communication (in Gods sight) in the Bedroom with your wife ( Who is the third person in the marriage - God - there is no biblical mention of a fourth - the WTS) Who assigned these clowns authority to control our lives to such a degree?

Oh wait, " the faithful and discreet slave." - appointed by his master over all his belongings, and the marvelous truths that have been uncovered ( such as 1975,1925, 1874, 2000(!) the generation of 1914 , the date 1914, ) Only enthusiasm to see the end of this wicked system , just like Jesus apostles. Yet they conceal the greatest wickedness of all.........................

16

What if you put an envelope in the box- "For the Lawsuits" ?

by OnTheWayOut in

another thread made a similar suggestion, so i thought what if....?.

what would happen if you put an envelope in the donation box with a check, and on the .

envelope (also on the comments portion of the check) it said "for the child-abuse lawsuits".

LanDi

We're just filthy apostates who don't want to accept the truth - (agents of Satan) Jehovah must be so mad at us for obstructing the good work at this critical time of the end - think of all the lives we are jeopardising. Where's our love for our fellow humans ? Satans just trying to obstruct gods work , blah blah.

We're just opposed to the wonderful truth because we are wicked. Oh, hang on............

Jesus to the pharisees " If you were blind you would have no sin, yet you say we see, your sin remains.". Unlike other religions, Jobos Witnesses are constantly shouting out how ungodly they all are because of A , B , C . So therefore - they knowing better, are the most reprehensible of all.

I'll have try that, putting money in the contribution box for lawsuits, not real money mind - those animals dont deserve it. Their KHs are stained with blood over children anyhow.

'GET OUT OF HER MY PEOPLE ' - Revelation

93

How the Religious View Homosexuality

by serotonin_wraith in

for people who are still religious, what are your views on gays?.

for me (an atheist) it goes against my own morality to think of them as sinners or somehow doing wrong, and yet in the bible it teaches that it is wrong.

it's one of the main reasons i could never go along with the jws.. i'm curious how religious people address this issue.

LanDi

Well, the religiously unenlightened amongst us will spout them all as devils and disgusting freaks and prejudice and all that - it is now finally considered a hate crime.

Well, the religious. God created Adam and Eve not Adam and Steve. But there is, without getting politically correct - more to it than that.

We now like in an age of Science and we know what caused homosexuality, it is different for each Gender. Particularly in men, homosexuality is caused and contributed to by an excess of female hormone in the brain( both genders fluctuate with both) but sometimes in forming in the womb or through emotional trauma later in life - the balance is thrown off. Relgious prejudice of ' You chose to be wicked' is offensive, because many 'Gays' swear they were born that way, and some boys exhibited female behaviour very early on and throughout life, despite having 'normal ' upbringing and 'normal' siblings. This is proof that homosexuality exists on a chemical level. We as men were all conceived female !

If I, although being a religious person am against homosexuality, then that is for me because the people who are 'gay' may not believe what I believe. A relative of mine abused two lesbians round the shop recently - " Thats not in the Bible" he said ! That's disgraceful - they might not even believe the Bible! If the bible condemns homosexuality, that means I as a follower of that belief system - cannot be gay.

If someone else chooses to be then that is their wish - same as what convinces me to believe in what I believe wouldn't convince others. I firmly believe that one can be a ' Christian ' and not hate Gays, yet fit that in without twisting scripture - it is wrong in Gods eyes but there are extra reasons beyond what you read. You can't be gay and a christian but then - if you are Gay deep down - can you keep lying to yourself?

10

The Governing Body must stop this wickedness & reproach NOW

by yaddayadda in

the watchtower society said the following as part of their media statement concerning the recent multi-million dollar settlement of 16 child abuse court claims: .

and we will continue to do our utmost to protect children from this horrible crime and sin.

how utterly abysmal is the society's failure to follow their own advice.

LanDi

Yeah. They're bringing reproach on Jehovahs name like cancer. Good job Jehovah " He who causes to become " is artificial and not really representive of Yahweh " He who is ".

Man.Still the truth though. And all other religions are wicked and from Satan. This joke ain't funny no more.

53

They didn't know 18 to 20 years ago, that pedophiles were harmful?

by horrible life in

http://www.jw-media.org/vnr/2122827332/717263.htm.

that explains it all.

they just didn't know, that it would be harmful to a child.

LanDi

Well, I would have thought 'Jehovahs holy spirit' would have guided them in that matter. We are after all, encouraged not to think on a matter, but rather wait for them to come up with the answer. I get criticism on this forum for being too open minded toward JWs - but I think at moments like this - you can look from the outside and see what a bunch of a*se it really is. How many children have these idiots harmed ?

not like the scripture (sorry lost my bible!!) ' look after the fatherless boy.' (some where in the front)

10

Is the WTS saying Armageddon is 'delaying' - Matt 24:45-47?

by yaddayadda in

yes, it appears they are.

there seems to be a trend lately for the watchtower society to increasingly refer to habakkuk 2:3 and indicate that we are now in a period of 'delay' before armageddon.

for the vision is yet for the appointed time, and it keeps panting on to the end, and it will not tell a lie.

LanDi

Its a little odd, because as we saw on a previous post, approximately 80 million people are born each year, and to be fair and just everyone has to have the chance to know the truth. So the longer it drags on, more and more potential customers come your way. So you have to lengthen the stay of execution of Gods day of anger, it is the only loving thing to do. When would be a just time to bring the end. According to the WT (sorry dont have date issue) God only destroyed his enemies at the very last moment, and with their wickedness, archaeologist couln't believe he waited so long, may have been the caananites.

26

Happy New Year! 80 million more "wicked" ones added to the bird food pile.

by Open mind in

what is the net effect of every year that our loving god jehovah, who is patient and desires "none to be destroyed", holds back the winds of destruction?

it ultimately results in roughly 80 million more humans to be added to the pile of post-armageddon bird food.

i've read this concept several times before on jwd but decided to do a little googling to get the 80 million number.

LanDi

Yes, it seems a pretty harsh penalty for not selling the Watchtower and not submitting to the will of " the faithful and discreet slave.".

Bullies.

31

What is the net worth of the Watchtower Society?

by R.F. in

LanDi

This is a difficult one, because the information is a little hard to come by. Word is that the WTS refuses to publish the details because its enemies "may distort the information" and use it to hinder the good news ( paraphrasing here but that is the basic message)

The worth is is difficult to estimate, the value of land and property will sky rocket as we get more overcrowded in this world. They have an awful lot of both ! According to Diane Wilson (Awakening of a Jehovahs Witness), they budgeted $50 million for the refurbishment of a building project, this doubled (despite all the free labour that the Dubs " give to Jehovah " HOW???) and one of the head honchoes said to her " No matter how much we spend the amount we have in the bank never decreases. Its wonderful to see how Jehovah provides ". So they have significant resources . Where from ? The magazines were sold for seemingly pittance (don't be misled! Some larger commercial magazines will sell for approximately the same - take into account cuts [ distributer/ store/ main firm/ partners/] although also remember the advertising revenues balancing it out) The WTS has the largest printing press in the world and with buying in such bulk - are sure to be laughing all the way to the bank. There was a report (New Yorks richest companies - sorry don't have the link but it is on this site) where their yearly net income (Brooklyn) was listed as just short of a BILLION dollars - they have 3340 staff - remember all volunteers ! Then count all their business interests , which they try to deny having! Plus, how many of the faithful donate to the Society in their will and are encouraged to make donations of land and benificiaries. This is a Scandal! All to benefit the distribution of the good news so we can't criticise the good news and important work. Surprisingly profitable. JWs are one of the richest religions around, and size for size, I would argue the Richest in the world! Imagine if, for example counting membership and equilent halls owned per faithful the value of the Catholic Church ?????? And then the JWs call the churches blind for being loaded, when the are even filthier rich !

" If you were Blind, you would have no sin. But you say 'We See' . Your Sin remains. ". - Jesus to the Pharisees

" We are not like Some Peddlers of Gods Word." - (somewhere in Corinthians - sorry dont have a bible to hand - sat in an internet Cafe!)

13

How can scipture be used to dispute a JW when they alone understand it?

by The Dragon in

i hear and see this alot.....debates consisting of two sides picking and hurling scriptures at one another to back up their assertions and guesses...it usually goes nowhere but wastes time and energy that could be more productivily used.. problem being is...in the case of the dubs...they believe that they and their leaders/teachers alone are being granted divine understanding...and you are trying to convince them they do not understand the book they wrote, and what they were trying to say in it basically.

they are allowed to pick and choose what is to be taken literal and figurelative without opposition...and should you point this out..you are in effect calling their leaders and trusted teachers liars.

you would have better luck convincing hitler what exactly he meant and really wanted from his book mien krap...could you convince him he really didn't have a clue and you knew it better than him?

LanDi

I don't believe it is at all possible, as many repsondents have stated. The Governing Body (Gods Wife and our mother) knows all and has told us to wait for them to clarify a point, rather than us reason it for ourselves (contrary to scripture incidentally). JWs always parrot the societies answer, which is kinda scary. No matter how well you voice your scriptural points, Jws will not understand it ( lifting the veil? ) and act as if you've gone off the subject, when they will indeed use something nothing to do with the subject at hand, usually a " core " JW scripture or a point from the Watchtower to prove they were right. And then they can always call you an apostate, no matter how well backed up your point is. Leave them to it, as Jesus said " Leave them be.Blind guides is what they are. If a blind man guides a blind man, both will fall into a pit.".

There are none so blind as those who will not see !

But then ............

64

Why do dubs act as if 1975 wasn't failed prophesy or misleading?

by NotaNess in

from the evidence i have found, it was all but etched in stone.

so why try and defend the wts by saying "they never stated armageddon would be in 1975", as one witness tried to throw back at me.. seems that you could show them all the evidence in the world of this false organization, and it will repel right off them.

is there some sort of "force field" kool-aid they're serving at the halls?.

LanDi

Well, to do that would be to accept that Jehovahs wonderful spirit guided organization that holds our hand and thinks for us, isn't what it says. This would leave a terrible crisis in a persons life, imagine leaning on a pillar, and then suddenly the pillar vanishes. But, to doubt the Org or to say anything against the Org is a sin, and something you do not want to do. Its not a pleasant situation, to think that everyone who criticises Jehovahs Witnesses is an agent of Satan trying to mislead you, but that's the reality of the situation. (isn't it amazing how dubs quote the society rather than think for themselves)

It is simply, a mistake. But then, how much of Gods spirit can they have if they base their whole line and promises on a simple mistranslation of a simple word, something a schoolboy wouldn't miss ? New light though. Hang in there.