and, while we're at it, what did you feel was the best technique/were the best techniques for 'awakening' jws to the problems/threats within the wtbts??.
i was initially awakened by the realization that the bible writers had no clue about how the earth really worked - which meant that their god had no clue, either.
when exodus 19: 16-19 was read in the kh, i realized (as a young child, 7 or 8 if i remember correctly...) that those bible verses were describing a volcanic eruption - and the isra-el-ites - and their 'god' - were totally clueless as to the true nature of that eruption and mountain.... that was my first eye-opener... then there was the fellow - a householder - who said to me when i was a cute kid at the door helping 'spread the word', "those people are using you!".
I wish I could help somebody out of the cult, like my wife.
But I helped several get in. And they are still there, most are elders or missionaries all believing they're doing all this work and labor for GOD.
Isn't the world just full of people believing they're doing everything for God. It just boggles the mind.
Aloha,
i never thought we'd be here.
after a long discussion last night, my wife now wants to know the 'other side of the story'.
what made me leave.
That is what I want to hear from my wife too! Just for her to think and consider a different point of view. Congratulations to you my friend. How did you do it? And yea, it's getting to be such a burden living with such unreasonableness. I just don't know how to help her. So again if you get a chance tell how you got her to even ask a question?
JT,
considering any religious presumption to be that we have fallen from perfection, is it realistic to expect an imperfect memeber of our speceis to fare any better than a perfect one who failed initially?.
considering the often added feature of multiple deceptions and the rampant claim of an evil superpower who tricks what we see as truth in an angel of light format, can it seriously be expected that we have the mental wherewithall to accurately decipher truth from lies and also cope with all our biological urges often branded evil?.
or is the truth that our biology is perfectly natural and our preoccupation with 'holy' in fact even dirties natural and beautiful gifts?
This is a question from a thinker. It is welcomed. What a puzzlement, yes? How could we possibly figure this out? My question now is what advantage, or what is the good to the one that tries to do good compared to the one that sees others as pawns and does what is bad?
I don't have the answers but it seems to me that we should try to do what is right and treat others around us fairly. In the end, we will die. It's just when.
So again it seems we should try to find something of interest to us and pursue it. Better if what you loved to do was helpful to others and mankind in general and you could make a living at it.
That's all,
i'll try this again, last time i guess i did something wrong.
anyway i think some will find this audio interview interested in this story: npr: bart ehrman, questioning religion on why we suffer.
fresh air from whyy, february 19, 2008 it's one of the oldest faith questions: if there's an all-powerful and loving god, why do human beings suffer?.
Hi Gopher,
There either is or is not a God It just seems to me that there is a God. By just looking at what is around us there is order, rules by which things work. From the smallest thing to the giant universe. If there is no God, I see no reason to deny the personal name Jehovah, our English language, then nothing can be explained.
i'll try this again, last time i guess i did something wrong.
anyway i think some will find this audio interview interested in this story: npr: bart ehrman, questioning religion on why we suffer.
fresh air from whyy, february 19, 2008 it's one of the oldest faith questions: if there's an all-powerful and loving god, why do human beings suffer?.
I'll try this again, last time I guess I did something wrong. Anyway I think some will find this audio interview interested in this story: NPR: Bart Ehrman, Questioning Religion on Why We Suffer
Fresh Air from WHYY, February 19, 2008 • It's one of the oldest faith questions: If there's an all-powerful and loving God, why do human beings suffer?
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=19096131&sc=emaf
This is the first I heard of him but he presents some interesting thoughts. The steps of growth he has taken through his life, that’s what is interesting to me. You know when we were young it all seemed so clear and straight forward. Got it all figured out. Now things are just not that easy are they? I'm not saying I agree with everything he says but interesting.
And one more thing; to his question, “Why We Suffer” I am comfortable the WBTS explanation on why there is suffering. The settling of the issues of who is to decide right from wrong, can man do it independently from God.
That’s all I’ve got for now,
JohnT
i saw some mention of this in another post, but i wasn't sure if there was a topic about it.
being raised in the "truth" its always pointed out that even people who haven't been to meetings in years still come to the memorial.
ive noticed that a lot of time that is actually the case.
I have been thinking about this same question. The “doing it for the family” is a valid point but after reading these responses I’m thinking of something different.
If we, the enlightened, the unplugged Borg, use this Memorial event as an opportunity to make a statement. To use it to say to the WBTS is wrong. That this whole concept of being appointed by Jesus Christ himself is just garbage. Yea it might hurt some but at least they will hear you.
hey guys!.
i can't wait to tell you something that happened last night.
in order to understarnd it, let me give you some details about me first: i'm still an elder, with my wife and the whole family and friends inside the borg.
This is an encouraging experience. It gives me hope that I can do the same for my wife. I think the "just saying a little bit a time" is a good thing. I am going to try doing just that as the opportunity presents itself.
I am glad for you. Good luck.
http://www.twth.org/about/commonly-asked-questions/index.html#what_is_twth_book.
ok, i'm a little freaked by this man and this 'society".
it is so jw like it scares me.. anyone know who karl loren is?
Karl Loren of Vibrant Life is a avid researcher and prolific writer on issues of health. His main products are oral chelation vitamin formulas. FYI; chelation in this context, is the removal of metals within the body. There is IV (Intravenous) or oral and it is the removal of the metals that reduces free radicals within the body thus to improve ones health. Most of us older people know about chelation.
Anyway Karl Loren does some super research and presents a lot of information. See his web sites.
i actually saved a classified ad from an east coast paper that needed experienced crew on a 48' sailing yacht.
i was at this town for my 10th wedding anniversary and staying at a nice b&b.
this was back in april.
I don't see much point to anything either. My wife is firmly in the Borg so very hard to move forward. I just try to find some joy in life. I really wish I had some purpose or even passionate about my job or hobby or anything.
It's like a journey to nowhere.
That's all I've got for now.
just read the book.
the plot has some inconsistencies, but the issues the book deals with are interesting nonetheless.
conspiracy theory nuts will love it.
Fear is what everybody is selling but only worse, that's what everybody is buying.
It's not a healthy environment. That's all I've got.
