my father, an elder, is willing to speak with me about the society's view of disfellowshipping.
i actually think that today i put a chink in his armor about the whole thing.
(i'm very shocked, and just a bit hopeful.
Okay, folks. I've got draft copies of the document I plan to show him. For those that are interested, I would love to hear any feedback you have about what works, what doesn't work, what's missing, etc.
The document is available in Word format ( http://207.218.192.12/~davisonline/dfvsshun.doc) or in PDF format ( http://207.218.192.12/~davisonline/dfvsshun.pdf). The PDF version came out a bit funky -- be warned.
I appreciate everybody's help in this once-in-a-lifetime (probably) event.
i'm curious: what rules have you dealt with that were just "too much" -- whether they were "official" (i.e.
in print) or not?.
i think a good, general one is r-rated movies.
After that I did some research on how movies are rated and realized that sometimes R movies should be PG-13 and PG-13 sometimes should be R. I then began to notice this when I watched movies, it is true. I can't believe I ever let myself fall for this crazy nonsense.
This is quite true. Additionally, it's important to note that those ratings are not a gauge of how "bad" the movie is; they are a guide for parents concerning their children. Why should adults be made to follow guidelines for children?
my father, an elder, is willing to speak with me about the society's view of disfellowshipping.
i actually think that today i put a chink in his armor about the whole thing.
(i'm very shocked, and just a bit hopeful.
Thanks, Goph! You're the best rodent I know.
I looked at this Web page and, to my embarrassment, ended up quite confused. One place where I became so is with Matthew 18:15-17. When it says "Moreover, if your brother commits a sin, go lay bare his fault between you and him alone," this sounds like more of a personal slight to me.
Also:
But now I am writing you to quit mixing in company with anyone called a brother that is a fornicator or a greedy person or an idolater or a reviler or a drunkard or an extortioner, not even eating with such a man.--1.Cor. 5:11 (NWT)Englishman said, "This plainly applies to sinners who insist on remaining in the congregation." However, I don't see the connection here. Where does it mention -- or rather, imply -- that this one insists on remaining in the congregation?
Also, what about 1 Corinthians 5:13? What's meant by "remove"?
I'm so confused! Help!
i'm curious: what rules have you dealt with that were just "too much" -- whether they were "official" (i.e.
in print) or not?.
i think a good, general one is r-rated movies.
My brother is catholic and is getting married in a church soon. If I last that long in the bOrg, thats when i'll make my stand. He came to my wedding so I will go to his. I'll probably get DF'd for it, cause I already talked to elders about it and they said it was considered getting into babalyon the great. Dog returning to its own vomit kinda thing. That is a rule that tears people apart.
Truthseeker1, there is NO doubt that you should attend that wedding. I've heard of some Witnesses being wary of entering a church, but I've never heard of someone being DF'd for it. That's ridiculous. I worked for a while as a wedding photographer with a Witness (great guy, too) and we entered churches all the time. This is a prime example of getting lost in the rituals. As Fire Dragon would say, it's like the Pharisees making the Israelites wash up to their elbows seven times or whatnot.
BEING 'advised' NOT TO ATTEND MY MOTHERS' funeral AS IT WAS IN A CHURCH.MY MOTHERS FUNERAL.Termite, this is horrible. They had NO right to "advise" this. How sick! Tell us, did you go? (I certainly hope so.)
Thanks, everybody, for some great -- and hilariously accurate -- replies!
by far the most boring part of all meetings is the written review.
what kind of stuff did you guys (male and female) do to pass the time.
i either to write computer programs, sleep talk to my wife or sleep in the car.
I never cared much for the review either. (I always did lousy because the meetings never held my attention.) I'd usually answer the true-or-false questions, the multiple choice, and the match-the-quote-to-the-scripture. Then I'd take out some paper and draw. Boy, am I glad that they never took those up. (I'm almost shocked that they don't, come to think of it. I guess the guilt of not knowing the answers is enough though.)
i'm curious: what rules have you dealt with that were just "too much" -- whether they were "official" (i.e.
in print) or not?.
i think a good, general one is r-rated movies.
I'm curious: what rules have you dealt with that were just "too much" -- whether they were "official" (i.e. in print) or not?
I think a good, general one is R-rated movies. Though to be honest, I'm half-expecting them to make a comment about PG-13 movies, the way they get away with so much in them.
In another thread, a poster (sorry, I don't have your name right now) provided the following too: not having anything to do with Pokemon (LOL!), not going to college, and not being a cheerleader in school.
Also, I think that their stringent policies about oral sex are ludicrous. What a husband and wife do in their own bedroom is their own business. The WTBTS really tries to cram itself into every aspect of life, doesn't it?
What else have you got?
my father, an elder, is willing to speak with me about the society's view of disfellowshipping.
i actually think that today i put a chink in his armor about the whole thing.
(i'm very shocked, and just a bit hopeful.
My father, an elder, is willing to speak with me about the Society's view of disfellowshipping. I actually think that today I put a chink in his armor about the whole thing. (I'm very shocked, and just a bit hopeful.) So what I'm looking for is succinct, clear evidence that the JWs' view of disfellowshipping is not biblical -- that it's not scriptural. I'm hoping that all of you can help me! What can convince an elder?
i've been studying with the jw's for about a year now.
i know that by nature (or nurture!
) i have an addictive personality so i have tried to be real careful that i'm doing the right thing by getting involved with them.
Take notice though that no apostate was able to refute what I said about them being immoral. That's because they can't. -- "You Know"
I'm not yet one, but I consider myself to be an apostate. Yet I am a very moral person. I didn't let my morals slide just because I'm leaving the organization. Plus, everything depends on your point of view. Seeing an R-rated movie might be immoral to you, but it's not to me. It's all perspective. I must say that JWs are very judgmental about things like this.
there is constant talk about sex here, false prophecy, preaching work etc.. but noone talks much about the demons.
i know i was frightened of them.my entire youth, every night, was spent engaging in paranoid little rituals to protect me from the demons.. watchtowers under the pillow, lights on, bible open by the bed.. and me wide awake listening to every tree branch creak, every board crack as the house setlled for the night.. i still have problems (occassionaly) even now.. who was terrified of the demons??
?
Demons don't exist. It's just another superstitious element to a superstitious belief system. There is an actual disorder that children can have that makes them see images that are frightening to them. I forget the name of it, but it exists. (Can anyone provide that name?)
I've heard funny tales about demon activity. For example, a friend's ex-father (she's disfellowshipped, you see) once claimed that a tie moved by itself once. Don't you think demons have better things to do than swing ties? Is there a demon division that is in charge of swinging items?
That same friend once swore (when she was in the organization) that she saw a demon at her window when she was very young. Though I wouldn't tell her at the time (because she was a closed-minded Witness), I knew that she came from a horrid childhood, so she was all the more likely to have the condition I mentioned above.
Demon's don't exist, but still their could simply be a race of individuals that has evolved beyond our senses, much like the aliens in the 2001 series. Maybe they visit Earth, and a few rogue aliens occasionally cause a bit of trouble. Nutty? Sure, but more likely than "the fallen sons of God"!
for once i will try to post a serious topic so here goes.... most of us here have rejected most if not all of the jw teachings.
i (as well as most of you) certainly do not believe that armaggedon will arrive someday in the future and everybody who is not a jw will die and the witnesses that are left will rebuild the earth.. so, the question i have is this: what do you think happens when you die?.
do you go to heaven or hell?
There is no concrete proof that anything happens after death. There's no evidence that the spirit lives on in anyway. It's all superstition stemming from a fear of death -- or rather, non-existence.
Think about it: animals are born, they live, then they die. Do we believe in an animal afterlife? No. The concept is only used to console young children who have lost a cherished animal. So if animals "just die," and if we humans too are animals, what should make us think that we're any better?
The problem is our intelligence. We're smart enough to fear death, unlike animals. When animals fight to survive, they're merely following instinct -- their inborn reflexes. When humans fight to survive, though there is instinct involved, we mainly struggle because we WANT to survive. We don't WANT to die.
As previously mentioned, the idea of nonexistence can be a bit uncomfortable -- even overwhelming. To just poof! not exist anymore IS scary. At least at first, it is. But once you live in the real world and look only at FACTS, you'll plainly see that any other ideas are just that: ideas. There's no disembodied spirit in us. We ARE our biological minds.
To look for an afterlife is to avoid accepting reality.
