Among other things did any ever wonder why since they were fertile (adulte since the first day in this account) and perfect and that it was one of their first command (make kids to populate the world) why they didn't have kids before they have sined? ... This story just can't be taken literally.
Posts by RAF
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87WHO IS THE INJURED PARTY? What is wrong with this doctrine?
by Terry inwho was the injured party?
in the garden of eden when both adam and his wife, eve rebelled against instructions from their landlord, jehovah.. "in the day you eat of it (the fruit) you shall surely die.".
adam and eve ate of it.
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RAF
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Defining Christianity
by Carmel init seems i constantly am confronted with those who are trying to make a "christian" out of me.
in various threads on this forum the term is used as if everyone understands what it means and there is no fuzzy edges.. i wonder if all here assume that only those that follow "jesus" are to be considered "christian"?.
consider that the title "christ" was not the name of the nazarene, only a title!
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RAF
wow this thread is from 2000 ...
ok my answer would be whoever follow what Christ asked us (whatever religion there are in or not - cause it's not a question of religion) is a christian ... there is only one baptisme and it's not the water one (but JWBATS = GB do not agree with me on this ... LOL ... since they want to divided to be ruler)
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87
WHO IS THE INJURED PARTY? What is wrong with this doctrine?
by Terry inwho was the injured party?
in the garden of eden when both adam and his wife, eve rebelled against instructions from their landlord, jehovah.. "in the day you eat of it (the fruit) you shall surely die.".
adam and eve ate of it.
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RAF
Whatever you read is someone else's way of saying something (literal or imaged) ... and for a book like this what you read is something which have been written a long time ago (to be understandable at that time *), and translated, also the translation have been translated etc and etc. Don't you think that you can't just read this book literally? ... You either have to try to read in between the lines (then it makes sense or not) or be inspired (LOL). It's not about fitting in to make it works for you.
(*) Now you might tell me that this book should be understandable for us now (it is – cause we know a lot about the past – but those before us did not know about now)
So it's not because you don't see how it is coherent that it is not coherent (reading it is not enough) symbolisms, history, cultures, human nature and and and ... have to be taken into consideration in the understanding where they need to be.
Biblically talking nobody have to believe the same thing … NOPE … There is a quote for that (ask ABR if he got it in mind). You can even blaspheme again Christ himself – means biblically God himself - it doesn’t matter for what is really important. Now you might see an incoherence here when there is none because God (the NT one = the posterity = Christ) is not self oriented, he putted everybody on the same shelve … The last will be the first / the greatest will be the tiniest (it's a balance that just put everybody on the same level if you really think about it).
Faith is not about believing in God, it’s not even about believing in an account for being the exact truth (biblically talking the Jews and angels had a particular relationship with God but a lot didn’t have faith they where supposed to know God better than we do) but in what didn’t they have faith? In the wisdom of God about why Not this but That at the moment (to make it short) if you want to live in a paradise (= satisfied wherever/whenever you are) since it’s not worthy to live without free will but moreover love (now we know why JWLand is Depressing). So faith is not about believing in God, faith is about believing/adhering in the wisdom of love (true love = charity – because we can’t love everybody the same way: Parents – Spouse – Kids – Friends – Neighbours - others).
All the OT is about how it’s not worthy to be protected by a super being in having to follow laws … (since laws do not help for real on the long run without love anyway - and that it can be unfair to just follow a law) the real protection is the love/charity we can have for each others.
To come back to the main subject: Unless Charity/love takes place where hate and selfishness/Ego lead to chaos. Chaos is the legacy.
That’s of course only point of view ….Also the bible is not the only book which say that in substance, any book which does is somehow well inspired from God (= wisely talking for and about "everything").
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Women Knowing their place........
by crazyblondeb inwomen knowing their places.
barbara walters of television's 20/20 did a story on gender roles .
in kabul , afghanistan , several years before the afghan conflict.
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RAF
... ...
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87
WHO IS THE INJURED PARTY? What is wrong with this doctrine?
by Terry inwho was the injured party?
in the garden of eden when both adam and his wife, eve rebelled against instructions from their landlord, jehovah.. "in the day you eat of it (the fruit) you shall surely die.".
adam and eve ate of it.
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RAF
I'll make it short : Reading is not enough
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What are YOU passionate about?
by lonelysheep inok, so we all know the wt used to be our passion till that died!.
what are you passionate about today?
kids are an automatic, and so are spouses for some people.. i'm referring to your interests that make up the core of you..
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RAF
What I'm really the most passionate about is human nature (it's fascinating) observe them to get an idea about their why's
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87
WHO IS THE INJURED PARTY? What is wrong with this doctrine?
by Terry inwho was the injured party?
in the garden of eden when both adam and his wife, eve rebelled against instructions from their landlord, jehovah.. "in the day you eat of it (the fruit) you shall surely die.".
adam and eve ate of it.
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RAF
Black Man
Most of people I guess are quiet ambarassed with the story of Adam and Eve as this story with its consequence seems to be so unfair to others (the kids). Since the begining I was wondering how can something/a story like that being told for being fair from human perspective and also God's perspective.
The answer which came to me is related to what is also underlying : we are not the kids of Adam and Eve (our Parents are vessels in the right time to developpe and bring us to human life) biblically talking we've been created by God's essence as a spirit first (all unic for the need of diversity) and giving life by Christ/the spiritual God of the essence of God.
Biblically talking John the baptiste was Eli (before being his seconds parents kids) because he did existe before and before ... as a spirit (awake or switched on "off") did John the baptiste knew he was Eli ? (I do not remember something like that being written in the bible - but Jesus did say he was Eli)
We can believe in this/those story(ies) as real or conceptual/imaged but it always means the same ... we are all in Adam or Eve's position from the start (at birth) and we will make our own choices for ourselves (whoever will pay the first bill = anyone who have been forgotten in the equation - in the process of the decision on purpose because we don't care or because we forgot or we didn't know yet about what will be the consequences).
"Everything" in this story could be God (what is telling us that what we are doing is wrong/unfair/stupid/unbalanced ...) like our Parents or simply what we know (history) ...anything. Also most of people might say it's the snake or my wife (whathever) which pushed me to "chose" that ... but who made the decision ? And WHY (it's always about the why) in knowing or not the conséquences.
I mean when we chose something we have always have a "personal" reason.
As a parent I haven't always been able to explain some things to my son ... I could only tell about those things in my own way (short or long version) ... but I just knew he had to experience some things to get them for real. But at the end what he wants is still his own choice (which can have nothing to do with what he does as a reaction to anything psychological or biological/physical) .
A man who follow the JW doctrine have made his choice and if what he can see (past/present) do not tell him that the WTBS is wrong ... he made the choice to not care about it ... Why ? because he "wants" to believe it's right or doesn't matter (regarding to his own agenda).
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RAF
What Sacrifices Did YOU Make For The "Truth"?
None, all my decision have been mine ... whatever sacrifices I've made it was for someone / something I loved/liked or believed in (I'm just glad I didn't believe in the JW's teaching Bulls).
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87
WHO IS THE INJURED PARTY? What is wrong with this doctrine?
by Terry inwho was the injured party?
in the garden of eden when both adam and his wife, eve rebelled against instructions from their landlord, jehovah.. "in the day you eat of it (the fruit) you shall surely die.".
adam and eve ate of it.
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RAF
This story only talks about choices, because bad as an effect of something just can occur / so does the knowlegde - it have to come with time. More you know and more you'll be able to use those knowledges for the good or the bad ... You can be nice/cool or you can be ugly/vicious.
Who is injured ? (well everybody who will have to suffer from a bad decision) and if God is all God is injured. This story talks about do not forget about the other ones.
Adam and Eve's story is the story of every human from birth since we have free will we have the choice but we do not always know the consequences even if sometimes people or history tell us but we don't want to hear about it ... So the bad experience is switched on "on"
Also in every matter whatever we do or not can have an impact on everybody. (it's a legacy = good or bad). And sins (biblicaly talking from the NT) is more related to wills / than acts.
As an image eating the fruit is only a confirmation of what was wanted (the moment the choice have been made).
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Today's Text is Scriptural Blasphemy
by gumby inhey gang, this morning as i was making some coffee i saw the "text book" lying there and decided i'd read todays text as i never do, just to see what it had to say.. it was taken from john 15:12 which says..... " this is my commandment, that you love one another just as i have loved you".. anyways, it goes on to say what jesus told his diciples who asked him which was the greatest of all the commandments and jesus answered them that "you must love god with all your heart and love your neighbor as yourself".
then it went on to ask if this law was also important to christians today and the comment was.... ( and heres the kicker) "absolutely, the law of christ involves a heartfelt love of god and includes a new command.....christians are to have a self sacrificing love for one another".. so rather than say christians are to love your fellowman, they twist the scripture and say christians are to love other christians.......and we all know by that statement they mean other jehovah's witnesses since they hold no regard for christians of this world.
yes, once again they play mind tricks on the publishers and tell them to love each other...rather than your fellowman and people of this world in general as was the case in the illustration jesus himself gave with the good samaritan.. it's no wonder jehovah's witnesses are despised by many in this world with their self rightous attitudes and beliefs regarding their fellowman that is induced in them by a few old men from brooklyn new york.. i hope your reading this wtbts spies, i really do.
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RAF
... twister they are (cause twister they need to be) to hold their grip on their flock ... *VOMIT* !!!
so many scriptures talks about the twisters (who they are for real) ...