history has demonstrated:.
religion is following orders by implicitly trusting someone or something.. science asks questions.. religion purports to answer questions.. science seeks to disprove its own conclusions.. religion seeks to reinforce its own dogma.. science is error-correction toward adjusting for realities as they unfold.. religion internalizes against reality by mocking up a substitute.. science is the most recent development of the human mind.
technology proves science to be successful in advancing human progress.. religion disdains human progress and waits for the end.
What I FEELabout things is largely because of how I value things. That isn't my spirit; it is my intellect fed by my choices based on my observations and moderated by my personal taste.
errrr ... , no comment ! ...
Also you don't only have technical sciences you also have social sciences (psycho stuff) ...
Voilà.
history has demonstrated:.
religion is following orders by implicitly trusting someone or something.. science asks questions.. religion purports to answer questions.. science seeks to disprove its own conclusions.. religion seeks to reinforce its own dogma.. science is error-correction toward adjusting for realities as they unfold.. religion internalizes against reality by mocking up a substitute.. science is the most recent development of the human mind.
technology proves science to be successful in advancing human progress.. religion disdains human progress and waits for the end.
Terry,
I trip over that word: Spirituality. I don't much care for it. You want to know why? It doesn't mean anything. It has no definition. It is more of a vague feeling than a state of being.
Do you think that there is a state of being without feeling this state? (when alive and not in coma - also some people says that when in coma they still had a sens of being)
I invite you to give it identity if you so choose so that I may consider it and learn from you. As it now stands I think it is a term made up to avoid admitting to being religious without anything particular to believe in.
You won't really learn anything from me (you can only acknowlegdeeverything and from that think for yourself about and come up to anything from it - its all yours to learn about something or not) you are open or you are closed to some things it is your choice, There is nothing I can do for or against.
To me, spirituality is like the word "cute" or "cool". People use it to mean whatever they want it to mean and leave it to the listener to fill in the blank for themselves. Okay. But, that isn't communicating; that's playing MAD LIBS.
I'm willing to be wrong. But, for me to abandon my opinion I need something to fill in the hole left.
What EXACTLY is "Spirituality"?
a way to explain spirituality would be to say for instance : when you read a poetry what matter the words (= material) or the deepest meaning (= spiritual)
Sorry No comment about your 2 following questions that would be a repeat. But lets talk about this
What is best for everybody? Food, shelter, clothing is about it. Then there is quality of life and purpose. Oh yes, there is longevity and health. Are all those things so debatable? I thought we were all pretty much the same when it came to all that.
ok your spirituality is about the purpose of your life its meaning to you (more or less material and spiritual) regarding you and others (what is the most important for you). We all have a spirit therefore a spirituality (so also a spiritual state) and were you are right is that we don't need religion for that (we have it) the only probleme that I can see with religions is to give God a meaning wich leads to war (any kind with anyone) but you also know that we are also going to war for oil for instance ...
Humanity has the same nature. We have the same needs. It is our tastes and opinions which differ tempermentally.
If we have the same basic physical needs, we do not have the same purpose in life (that's the spiritual part of it).
Religions or phylosophies (they are somehow connected and confused but you don't need the former and can have your own phylosophy which lead your life regarding to your aim/purpose) are good or bad spirited toward others and we are each one of us an other for the other ones ... So when any religion or philosophy (even very personal) bad spirited towards others is spread (by words/actions or reactions) it is a probleme for everyone.
um, what's the deal with this?
i'm speaking with a witness and he keeps talking about the resurrection and the way it's explained sounds like it's really a re-creation of all of our memories in god's mind then put back on earth in a re-created body.
so in essence a clone of me with my memories and personality will live forever in paradise, how exactly is that a resurrection.
The part of the spirit in essence in the whole which is you ... will always be you ... dead or alive (if its about talking about existence)
in light of the current deep philosophical discussions whirling around, i thought i would post another topic to ponder.
hillary step motivated me to start this topic by this comment on another thread:.
if there is anything that i have learned in my 500 years of life, is that none of it matters much anyway.. we all end up in some dismal cemetry with drunken kids urinating on our tombstones anyway.
Possibility #1: There is a god, and the bible is more or less right. OK, if I believe this is so, then I will be held accountable to god when I die for my actions as a believer
Ok just about that for a begining (because the subject is big - even if the answer can be resumed in a few words, I leave it to be discuss deeply on this thread :
Our spirit can only evolve (it's only you which can retro act about it - but then it's a denial and it doesn't lead anywhere but hypocrisy and hypocrisy need to be supported by any third party, if not, you have to acknowledge your hypocrisy fully anyway) ...
So when it comes to be accountable about what we have done it is most about being aware of what we have done (know at some point that we have been wrong)I remember me (which is really not into strinking kids at all) doing it 2 times on my son - and I still regret it BADLY (since I know I was wrong about the reason and the way - that's hell).
several weeks ago the issue of god's 'perfect nature' came up on a thread.
the concept of "perfection" is a persistent in vitually all faith traditions and theological constructs.. jws in particular, have an obsession with the concept of perfection and use it regularly in their propaganda: "live forever in a perfect paradise earth"; "live forever in perfect health"; "humans and animals will live together in perfect harmony", etc etc...... the point was raised about the possibility or impossibility of god being perfect.
if we begin with the basic judaeo-christian tenet that god created the universe from nothingness, then he is the designer and creator of every single entity, sentient or non-sentient, and object within reality.
If he is so objective and loving, why would he have published (or allowed to be published) such a subjective, flawed, confusing, violent, sexist, sexually explicit, and contradictory account of himself in that book?
I think god would have to ba a lot smarter than that; and if he were perfect, he would also be perfectly loving and would not point us to a book that causes so much argumentation, confusion, violence, oppression, and repression among his potential followers.
According to the bible (forget about the JW teaching if possible because it is logically totally messed up) it's not the book which aware you it's the spirit (the holly one ... ... so it's not what is written which count it's is essence about "WHY" and the why is more explicite in the NT) if you stay focus on the bible about the spiritual side you have to read the bible with a new eye - and you'll see that it is related to lots of things from other sources ...
i dare to say science and religion are two different animals.
they may try to explain similar things but in different ways.
i don't believe man will ever live without either religion or science nor would i want us too.
Hi MQuitox : I'm following this guy since a long time and yes he does more looks like this kind of philosopher ...
James Thomas :
I never saw you as a fool James Thomas ... Never (because there is no contradication possible in what you are saying) !!!
nothing to prove just to be aware of what we can check in reality and feel spiritually.
i dare to say science and religion are two different animals.
they may try to explain similar things but in different ways.
i don't believe man will ever live without either religion or science nor would i want us too.
James Thomas:
For a long time I was wondering why you were talking the way you do, it is such an open way to express the matter that I've always fell the need to be more explicite, since I realised that somehow it was the only way to express it as openely as it can be without getting people confused (even by spiritual words and entrepretation from trauma about religious peremptory beliefs).
This kind of way to speak is very spiritual indeed but is more approchable by some asian and native american cultures. but we are getting there.
i don't know how many have taken the myers briggs personality test?
my wife told me i was a esfj, whatever that means!.
do you think people not getting along, poster's differences, or war, or values, etc.
Cut and past from this thread : http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/128448/2274269/post.ashx#2274269
I couldn't get the page of this URL www.keirsey.com (???)
so I went to this one : http://similarminds.com/jung.htmlJung Test Results
Extroverted (E) 51.43% Introverted (I) 48.57%
Intuitive (N) 63.33% Sensing (S) 36.67%
Thinking (T) 68.97% Feeling (F) 31.03%
Perceiving (P) 57.58% Judging (J) 42.42%Your type is: ENTP
ENTP - "Inventor". Enthusiastic interest in everything and always sensitive to possibilities. Non-conformist and innovative. 3.2% of the total population.
The first time I thougt about doing that test if was because of post of LT on JWD ... but on an other "site" than the one proposed here to get the test done ... I wanted to know if I would have the same results and it is the same.
Well I guess I'm ok with the results - most of the good sides but also most of the bad once too (you can't get have everything anyway !!!)
several weeks ago the issue of god's 'perfect nature' came up on a thread.
the concept of "perfection" is a persistent in vitually all faith traditions and theological constructs.. jws in particular, have an obsession with the concept of perfection and use it regularly in their propaganda: "live forever in a perfect paradise earth"; "live forever in perfect health"; "humans and animals will live together in perfect harmony", etc etc...... the point was raised about the possibility or impossibility of god being perfect.
if we begin with the basic judaeo-christian tenet that god created the universe from nothingness, then he is the designer and creator of every single entity, sentient or non-sentient, and object within reality.
It's not God which is perfect (essence of everything) regarding the bible it is its Christ means it's maturity, so perfection is the higher state.
The higher spiritual state is to allow every spirit (in the whole essence) to grew up as a whole (as it have to be connected spiritually to be totally satisfied)
The bible actuallly talks about evolution of the spirit in human kind state (not far from boudhism view)
For instance : There was a time which you couldn't have tell a man that his wife was equal to him (by force they wouldn't even allow their wife and daughters to hear about that news) So the job is to take things from where it can be taken - and evoluate with the time ...
round two with me and my parents went terrble last night.
my mother was sobbing and my dad had the biggext look of dissapointment on his face.
i couldn't think straight.
(((TBL))) I feel for you !!!
I couldn't think straight. I failed and lost miserably, I felt the lowest ive ever felt in my short life
What is really low is "hypocrisy" ... you can step back if you need to for anythingcould help to get to the point you need in the time it will be possible for you ...
(your Parents are scared - and because of that you may be scared or your Parents reactions - which could lead to some very unconfortable situation at your age) STEP BACK IF NEEDED ... (it's not a question of honnor since it's a question of TIME and relevance on how to get out of this with minimum damages both sides).
