Posts by RAF

16

Subliminal imagery in the WT publications

by icyestrm in

i noticed some websites that showed subliminal imagery in the wt publications.

some common ones are occult symbols, skulls, goat heads, etc...

how many of you guys came across it?

RAF

Justhuman : There are obvious ones, and no one can doubt about them. It is not just an imagination.
Whatever people think that it is few folks joking around in the WTBS designer dept or really intentional from the GB ... There are obvious ones, and no one can doubt about them

That's also what got my sister really questionning about the WTBS material ...

10

the 'no idols' rule would work very well if the witnesses had followed it themselves...the watchtower symbol (the tower one ya know...) was made into an idol itself, seperate from god and everything else, infact in our congregation at saddleworth for sometime we had a gold one above the platform.. .

RAF

greendawn : More significantly it was the FDS that became the idol of the JWs and a very useless one at that. just to emphasis twice (ditto sspo's comment)

53

Who "Inspires" you on JWD?

by JH in

jw
friends

is anybody here your hero, or a great inspiration to you?.

RAF

that we can't be really fair lets say really objective ... weither we know or not those people for real (ourselves included).
And by that I meant : we can only be inspired by what move us (personnaly) means what's important to us ...

53

Who "Inspires" you on JWD?

by JH in

jw
friends

is anybody here your hero, or a great inspiration to you?.

RAF

Touched ... inspired ... surprised ... and well it even happened that I've been disgusted (rarely) ... but all together I like the free ride that everybody can have here to some extand ... and get touched, inspired, surprised or disgusted ... This virtual word is still real and that's why we can learn from it (from the good and the bad) ... Also I still wonder why some people feel the need to downsizing anyone and can't really take it to be ... There is a time for everything for each of us
This topic is about give us a name ... most of you have been cautious in not giving any ... and I'll follow this line now because I guess that somehow we know, that we can't be really fair lets say really objective ... weither we know or not those people for real (ourselves included).

40

My Story "this is long, I'm sorry"

by ex-nj-jw in

i'm not sure i ever really posted my story.

i think i've given bit's and pieces on others threads but not the whole thing on my own thread.

the issue that another member is having with childcare and yet another poster asking me why i'm still here after being out for 24 years has prompted me to type this up.. so here goes:.

RAF

well ... thanks for sharing (((ex-nj-jw)))
best wishes for the futur !!!

297

5000 PAGES OF DOCUMENTS OF JW PEDOPHILE CASES AVAILABLE! B ANDERSON BOOK

by Seeker4 in

barbara anderson has just released a new book on cd that contains some 5000 pages of public court records from the nine lawsuits involving 16 victims that the wts settled secretly in may of this year, plus documents from two other cases the society settled in 2000 and 2006.. .

its called secrets of pedophilia in an american religion: jehovahs witnesses in crisis.. .

the book, and more info from barbara about it, is available here:.

RAF

Cool - the good part of it is that it's about official stuff
Have you ever tried to tell a die hard JW to care about kids sexual abuse in JWland? ... It' all lies to them and of course the GB have nothing to do with it - so if you come out only with newspaper stuff (OY not true of course) ... Now that we'll make a change

32

I'm in love and ... scared !!!

by RAF in

sorry need to share and to talk about it and maybe in giving me your opinion, talking about your experience, i'll find other ways to deal with it.. .

i just turned 40 (does this have something to do with it) never been scared about the matter ... but now i wonder what kind of love i've really experienced before (any kind of appeals like complicity for instance, the need to share something in particular with someone, the need to give someone some love?

) i dunno for real .... i'm trying to get this out of my head but i can't, i can't, i can't - i'm trying to get interested in other guys but it's just not the same ... and i even wonder how i came to the conclusion that i do love him !!!.

RAF

LCL: Why did you feel that way? Do you remember your reasons? Are they still valid reasons or do they no longer apply?
I've always had a need to stay away most of the time from people (even those I love) they are taking too much of my energy or I give them too much of my energy.
The fact that people think that I'm strong actually doesn't help me at all ... and that's even have been true regarding my mother ... when she left us (because she was in love, she only took my little sister with her which was 8 at that time) after a year of missing (being away) one of my sister who was 2 years older than me (15 then) asked her to take her with her, my mother said ok, it's my sister which changed her mind to stay with my other sister who was (16) ... a bit later I've asked my mother the same thing she said NO so I've asked her why was it ok for E and not for me, she just answered : Because you are stronger (WTF - I was 13) that's the very moment I've decide to have a kid because without something I could hold one with this life (in loving and being loved) I would just have killed myself.
The only compliment I ever had from my father was this (and I still wonder how he would know about that since I don't know him for real) he said : The one I will never need to care about is Corinne, because she's stronger (WTF)
Where do those poeple who are supposed to know me get this impression about?
I mean I'm talking about my mother and my father here ... They didn't gave me the choice : what was my solution really ? It was be stronger or kill yourself.
I'm loosing my balance when I'm stuck with people, I feel the need to really pay attention to them and I'm not really able to (full time, always or often) - I can only give the best of myself (actually what they are expecting since they can't understand that I can be weak) when I'm ready to(available psychologically), when I feel quiet.
I even get this kind of answers from my bosses (3 times in my life, by 3 different people) knowing that they were unfair with me to protect, themself or somebody else (love affaire / political matter / wickness) without any valid argument since I didn't want them to get away with it and got into verbal fights what I had to hear AGAIN (after trying lots of stupid excuses) was : ok you are right but Corinne you are Stronger (WTF), I still even wonder how they dared telling me that ... and what's even worst is that they also dared (all of them) to tell me that they like me very much but that's the way it is ... deal with it - to resume (I mean it's like saying I'm an a$$hole with you, but you can take it so ... why should I care - That's how they like me ...)
How can I get from 3 differents people, 3 different situations and reasons the same reaction. It's confusing ... it's like I'm doomed to be the one people i'm involved with (weither automatically in my job for instance or affectivly in real life) don't have to care about, just because they think I'm stronger.
Almost 2 weeks ago I got into a fight with my sister but at the end same answer : can't you just take it, you are stronger (WTF). And those are only a few easy to understand examples : What is this "you are stronger" excuse all about? ... isn't that a way to not take responsability in whatever they have to or whatever they do to me? Since that's what I said to my sister she said, "we can't see when you are sensitive" you should show it? HOW? IN FAKING anything special, What exactly? Can't they just take care?
Still I can understand, I can forgive but I can't take it anymore ... (I never took it in fact always finally reacted). Sometimes in a very cold way ... but they really got me to become either cold blooded or in flam ... I'm tired to take over ... I could, I did ... but I'm tired.
And now this feeling (and you have to realiased that I've started crying while I'm writting this) the feeling that HE can feel how sensitive I am for real ... I don't want to lose it ... And I'm also scared that it could only be an illusion. Again I don't know him for real it's just a strong feeling.
So it's like I want to keep it like a dream ... something untouchable ... I don't even need more ... (it's like it happened - and I can keep this feeling and remind it to me whenever I want to just in thinking about him, nothing have make it durty yet). I'm really not ready to stand to be disspointed about that. And that's putting too much weight on him, actually his shoulder (this is not what I want).
What I really want and need is not a man in my life, but this feeling (got it and want to keep it as is) wanting to give or get more would get me very dependant and I'm not sure it would be good either for me or for him.

LCL : You wanted to remain single. Why? Did you think it would give you a better quality of life? If so, has that proven to be false? Or do you think your life as a whole would improve if you persued this relationship?
I don't even really think about those details this way, I don't want to calculate wathever on the matter ... my life since the bigining is about get ready to be hurt and it always happen when I let myself go for real when I think "ho things looks cool" ... and BOOM !
LCL Do you feel dependant now? Regarding to the feeling (yes), regarding to the man (not yet - and that's the scary part)

LCL : Why did you not want to feel dependant? Do those reasons no longer apply?
They still apply as long as I won't be able to put all my pieces together, I'm not ready to deal with dependancy. (and somehow that's dependancy on myself but I can deal with it since I'm the only one I can rely on by now).
LCL : Seriously think about it. It's all about your quality of life. If this man will lower your quality of life, then stop now.
Seriously I don't know anyway, I'm more into quality of feeling (I or he can die tomorrow) it'll never be about quality of life to me.
LCL : If you can't stop now, why not? Do you think you are drawn to this man for biological reasons, psychological reasons, rational reasons, or spiritual reasons?
I don't know ... again it's all about the feeling itself.
Thank you Lore !
Outnfree
Actually all what you've said talks to me and I agree with all of it ... the way I see it today is : don't rush, don't expect anything more ... That's why I feel confortable with the idea that he can stay a friend more than he can become my man. Still I'm not closed to this idea (since I can dream about it), I'm just not ready (for a healthy relationship and not taking this into consideration wouldn't really help him or me).
Mes très sincères amitiés !!! (Ta fille est superbe !!! et elle me dit que vous vous ressemblez) au plaisir de te recevoir.
Sparky
You know what? I'm not even against the idea of being owned (really - because it doesn't really mean anything - since I can escape anyway) it's more about wanting to take care to not f*ck up something very, very, very, precious to me (and here for instance the feeling itself means more than any kind of relationship with him) so he can stay a friend, I just know that when he will have a wife (I might lose any occasion to get the feeling in live - but at least it will stay a good feeling to remind me about).
And that's the thing, I'm free, I want him to stay free (to give or not - I just need to feel it's true and unselfish when he gives).
Thank you Sparky !!!
I know I migh sound all weird ... I never fell normal anyway don't even think I should be (what is normality in fact?)

31

I need help, friendly suggestions, or a shoulder to cry on...

by FreedomFrog in

jw
friends

ok, here's the situation.. i have no friends that live close to me and i'm up to my eyeballs in bills.

i have applied to a few jobs that could potentially help me turn things around.

the things is, because i don't have parents/friends or any other people in my life.... 1. how do i get a babysitter when i have to go on the interviews?.

RAF

(((FF))) hope you'll find what you need QUICK
best wishes !!!

49

With a heavy heart I regret to inform you that..

by Wordly Andre in

jw
friends

i regret to inform, all of you that i will no longer be a member of this board, ive thought about it a long time and to hard decision that after many hours of praying i will be returning to the society.

i know its the only way i can confront the problem that i am currently faced with, i am sure all of you at one time thought about it too, i am however weak, i know that going back will only delay matters and keep this horrible secret of mine, but its the only way i know how i can deal with it.

thank you for all your support and for me to fully get back to jehovahs organization i can not be a member of this board thank you worldly andre

RAF

happy birthday you joker !

32

I'm in love and ... scared !!!

by RAF in

sorry need to share and to talk about it and maybe in giving me your opinion, talking about your experience, i'll find other ways to deal with it.. .

i just turned 40 (does this have something to do with it) never been scared about the matter ... but now i wonder what kind of love i've really experienced before (any kind of appeals like complicity for instance, the need to share something in particular with someone, the need to give someone some love?

) i dunno for real .... i'm trying to get this out of my head but i can't, i can't, i can't - i'm trying to get interested in other guys but it's just not the same ... and i even wonder how i came to the conclusion that i do love him !!!.

RAF

FlipThis : you should be
I am ... And when I read Hopelesslystained sounds like it is a part of it all.
Hopelesslystained
Nice story ... Thanks I feel really understood here about a part of the reason I'm scared about.
The thing is that I'm a DIE HARD SINGLE ... since the biginning ... feeling dependant doesn't float my boat at all, at all, at all ... (and more over in the love matter)
What is scary is : What could be my expections from my huge personnal feelings (which are maybe not really shared to the same level) has TyroneVL said most of the time there is one who loves more than the other one ... I'm already able to love full size when I don't feel that way ... What will it be if I do feel that way !!! (scary scary scary) because now I even felt like to go further with bigger involvements ...
I mean, usualy I'm abble to control my feelings. It wouldn't take more than a week to really get rid of any bad feeling or any need from the other one. And just need to get a clear view of it all to tell myself FORGET ABOUT IT ... it was as simple as that - the way to not suffer have just be to SHUT IT DOWN once and for all.
On Tyrones Hit music session topic GWQ brought up a song which really was talking to me about my fears ... NE ME QUITTE PAS (don't leave me) ... I DON'T WANT TO BE IN THIS POSITION, I JUST DON'T ... I'd rather let go RIGHT NOW - forget about it (looks like I'm a real coward - but I guess I know better about my extreme sensitivity - since this feeling is too big I feel like I'm NOT READY AT ALL).
to recall what it brought up that's what I've wrote on this thread :
----
The worst part of this song is the fact that he is begging her to stay to the point to say (in french version) let me become the shaddow of your shaddow, the shadow of your hand, the shaddow of your dog (pet) that's toooooo deep !!!
I guess this song and my father have something to do whith the reason why, my way is : you want to go away ... Ok ... as well as I wouldn't want anyone going this far about their need to stay close to the one they love and certainly not me.
That's also probably Why I'm scared today. (dependance)
---
I saw to many people sink into something I would rather never get into ... I can love very hight already without being that much in love (to compare about the feeling I have for this guy without even being involved with him).
And about my own experience Anthony's father was my best friend till I was 3 month pregnant - and he just became my worst ennemy from then (scary, scary, scary) I still have no idea why exactly ... I had to move or he would have killed me. And he is not the only one ... in the name of love (UGH !!!) I forgave but I need to not forget (people change and sometimes you just don't know why)
So I'm already scared about how far they can go with me (and fine any reason to be mean in using love as an excuse or neglecting me in using the excuse that I look strong ) ... and now I'm also scared about how far I can love.
Mum : Whatever it is, you've got it bad!
For now, accept your feelings. If you are considering anything long-term, get to know this person better. Love is a good start, but without mutual respect and shared values, love cannot flourish.
Yep ... but right now ... About my life and my feelings I'm used to live day by day ... tomorrow is another day (so me even thinking about getting married and worst having kid ... Well that's not me YET ... and that was scary to just think that I would get into it for him) ... I'M NOT READY ... just the way I'm thinking about it is pathetic, I don't think it would do me any good (or any good to him)to get into more involved relationship with the state of mind that I have today ...(it's fucked up) ...
I'll take my time and if I can't get read of this fear, rationalised it (there will be no way to help this relationship to go further - that's what my guts is telling me right now). I just hope that at least I'll be able to keep the friendly relationship ... and that's all what I really need by now and this just pop out of my head : maybe he doesn't want more than that ... and maybe he feels the same ... and maybe that's why I feel incounsciously understood by him ... and this would explain why in knowing that we like each other we don't talk about it.
I don't know ... I'm lost ... And as long as I wond be able to figure out where I am on this map ... I'll stay where I stand.