Posts by eyeslice

4

Religion can wait

by JH in

jw
friends

do you think that joining a religion should come after you had an education, and found a decent job?

how many young witnesses were told not to go to college, and were forced to accept cheap jobs?

do you believe that schooling, marriage, and a job should all come before joining a religion?edited by - jh on 10 january 2003 17:10:7.

eyeslice

My two older kids were not encouraged by myself to go into full time education.

However, my views have changed since then. I was at a parents evening for my youngst last night. He is doing very well so I had a chat with him before he went to sleep last night. I told him I thought he was lucky enough to have the ability to be able to chose anything he what he wants to do (teacher, doctor, biologist, etc) rather than have a situation where he has to ask what is there I can do?

My biggest regret is not going to med school myself (not enough time in the system to finish the training yet I am here with grown up kids myself). I am not going to let my kids make the same mistake.

Eyeslice

8

How to Know God - Stage 1

by eyeslice in

i wouldn't say that i was the greatest fan of deepak chopra though i have read a couple of his books.

i am never very comfortable with people who base most of their ideas on anecdotes and quaint stories, but nevertheless some of his ideas are, shall we say, interesting.

in his book, how to know god, he expounds his view that there are 7 levels at which people can come to know god, even though he unable to say who or what this god is.

eyeslice

SwordOfJah
Don't get me wrong, I personally am not saying that God is like that.

The purpose of this thread is to explore how people view God. There is no doubt however that the Israelites saw God as a somewhat vengeful person. They only just got out of Egypt and God sent plagues upon them. Later 23,000 are said to have pershished. No doubt times were hard back then, and this colored their view of God - he needed to be strong and vengeful to protect them.
Eyeslice

8

How to Know God - Stage 1

by eyeslice in

i wouldn't say that i was the greatest fan of deepak chopra though i have read a couple of his books.

i am never very comfortable with people who base most of their ideas on anecdotes and quaint stories, but nevertheless some of his ideas are, shall we say, interesting.

in his book, how to know god, he expounds his view that there are 7 levels at which people can come to know god, even though he unable to say who or what this god is.

eyeslice

Acsot
Doubt if any of his family are JWs. He was born and trained as a medical doctor in India before moving to the USA.
The other book I have of his is Ageless Body, Timeless Mind - a good read for those of us who are getting a bit long in the tooth. Promotes the idea that ageing is what you make of it positive or negative.
Eyeslice

28

JW's -- Is Jesus your Mediator?

by UnDisfellowshipped in

the watchtower society teaches that jesus christ is the mediator only for the "anointed" jw's and that the "anointed" jw's are the "mediators" for all of the "other sheep".. the bible says jesus is the one mediator for all men:.

1st timothy 2:5: for there is one god, and one mediator between god and men, the man christ jesus

eyeslice

This issue is one of many of the JW doctrines that are flawed. There is no room for theological debate in a religion that is totally controlled by the center.

The sad thing is the average JW is blissfully unaware, or simply not concerned, of such doctrinal anomalies.

Eyeslice

8

How to Know God - Stage 1

by eyeslice in

i wouldn't say that i was the greatest fan of deepak chopra though i have read a couple of his books.

i am never very comfortable with people who base most of their ideas on anecdotes and quaint stories, but nevertheless some of his ideas are, shall we say, interesting.

in his book, how to know god, he expounds his view that there are 7 levels at which people can come to know god, even though he unable to say who or what this god is.

eyeslice

I wouldn't say that I was the greatest fan of Deepak Chopra though I have read a couple of his books. I am never very comfortable with people who base most of their ideas on anecdotes and quaint stories, but nevertheless some of his ideas are, shall we say, interesting.

In his book, How to Know God, he expounds his view that there are 7 levels at which people can come to know God, even though he unable to say who or what this God is.

It is interesting though from a JW / x-JW point of view to consider the levels we or others may have reached.

My own view is that the average JW is stuck at level 1 or 2. See what you think. I will post a series of posts that deal with each level - your feedback will be quite interesting.

STAGE ONE: GOD THE PROTECTOR - (Fight-or-Flight Response) If we list his attributes, which many would trace back to the Old Testament, the God of stage one is:

Vengeful
Capricious
Quick to anger
Jealous
Judgmental meting out reward and punishment
Unfathomable
Sometimes merciful

This description doesnt only fit Jehovah, who was also loving and benevolent. Among the Indian gods and on Mount Olympus one encounter the same willful, dangerous behavior. For God is very dangerous in stage one; he uses nature to punish even his most favored children through storms, floods, earthquakes, and disease. The test of faithful is to see the good side of such a deity, and overwhelmingly faithful have. Primitive man experienced untold threats from the environment; survival was in question every day. Yet we know that threats were not destined to prevail. Overarching was a divine presence that protected human beings, and despite his frightening temper, God the protector was as necessary to life as a father is inside a family.

Note: the comments about Jehovah are Chopra's not mine.

My comments on stage 1 are that this is how the average JW views God. The world is wicked and hard to survive in, so God will end it all. The world is the enemy and therefore must be hated and there is little room for the idea that God may be full of love and mercy. Above all God is to be feared rather loved.

29

Why did I fall away from the truth???

by JNS2 in

jw
friends

no, i don't think it is the "truth" any more, but for 22 years i did.

that is what makes this so very difficult to come to grips with, admitting that i wasted all that time as a mindless drone.

(borg) anyway, i've been trying to analyze why i have fallen away.

eyeslice

Strange thing is that elders often are the worst offenders when it comes to personal study, field service, etc.

I have read both the new books from last summer but I would bet that none of the elders in our congregation have. None of them would be able to tell you what the major changes are between the old Worship book and the new. A pity really, as the biggest change is the omission of the chapter on blood.

Eyeslice

6

Charity and the WTBTS?

by eyeslice in

jw
friends

the society appears to sit on assets worth millions but does anyone know if they ever give money away in the form of unconditional charity from their own coffers?.

i know for instance that the south african branch has sent relief aid to other parts of africa and the german branch has sent aid to eastern europe but can anyone say exactly where the money came from?

was it raised by special appeals to the congregations, thus not having coming directly from their own precious central funds?.

eyeslice

The Society appears to sit on assets worth millions but does anyone know if they ever give money away in the form of unconditional charity from their own coffers?

I know for instance that the South African branch has sent relief aid to other parts of Africa and the German Branch has sent aid to Eastern Europe but can anyone say exactly where the money came from? Was it raised by special appeals to the congregations, thus not having coming directly from their own precious central funds?

To my knowledge the Society has never gives a dollar in aid to UNICEF, any medical aid, food aid or education projects. If they had, we would surely have heard about it as they are not slow in blowing their own trumpet.

Eyeslice

15

My JW Wife Is Going To See Harry Potter Tonight!

by SpannerintheWorks in

i thought jws were discouraged from subjects such as witchcraft, wizardry, magic etc.

i've not asked yet, but i wonder why she feels it's all right to go and see a "demon" picture!

and her dad (elder) has read all the hp books!

eyeslice

What I find interesting is that there are those, including elders, who refuse to go and see Harry Potter on the grounds it is about sorcery but then go and see Lord of the Rings. They don't seem to make the connection that they are about the same thing!

53

Staying Awake Or Keeping In A Frenzy?

by AlanF in

we ex-jws know very well how much the watchtower society put us under pressure to believe that "armageddon is just around the corner".

they've been doing it in one form or another ever since charles taze russell began publishing his nonsense.

in 1877 he advocated that true christians should believe that christ would "take them home" in 1878. when that didn't happen he moved the event up to 1881. after that he focused on 1914.. the society is still doing pretty much the same thing, building up expectations and then revising them, decade after decade.

eyeslice

Excellent thread Alan, with many excellent replies.

I think Blondie has summed up quite correctly the situation in most congregations today.

Just to add another point, there is ever greater reluctance to "prove" many of the doctrinal claims made.

At one time, both in the literature and at meetings, there was an attempt to explain "the deeper things of the truth". But now everything has been dumbed down. Take the new Worship book for instance, its chapter on the Last Days is very vague.

Also, the talk on Sunday was about being a Survivor of the Last Days. The speaker simply dismissed any proof of 1914 as being the date Christs Kingdom was established by stating there was not time in this particular talk to go into how 1914 was arrived at.

Eyeslice

16

Money and happiness?

by eyeslice in

jw
friends

everyone in the truth, knows it is the "love of money", not money itself that is wrong.

i am well aware that money in itself does not bring happiness.. what i detect though amongst the witnesses is almost an antipathy to money and wealth.

one sister i was speaking to the other day complained about all the spending that goes on at xmas.

eyeslice

Everyone in the truth, knows it is the "love of money", not money itself that is wrong. I am well aware that money in itself does not bring happiness.

What I detect though amongst the Witnesses is almost an antipathy to money and wealth. One sister I was speaking to the other day complained about all the spending that goes on at Xmas. I tried to explain to her that unless people bought goods, the economy collapses and people get thrown out of work and a viscous cycle of economic down turn starts. She incidentally is on benefit, and is therefore dependent on the government and the economic prosperity that it needs to generate.

Also, as witnesses, we subjected to the "Happy though hungry" philosophy, where brothers and sisters who are poor are held up as an example to the more materialistic amongst us. I have seen at first hand the poverty of under-developed countries and can assure anyone that being on the streets without money, medical aid or education is no recipe for happiness.

I have always felt this is a hard dilemma for all religious people. Personally, wealth is not motivator in my life but without going as far as selling all my belongings and giving to the poor, I not sure where we can draw the line.

Eyeslice