Posts by StephaneLaliberte

I remember, identifying such hypocrisy when I was "in"; however, I didn’t understand at the time how serious it actually was. I’d go on believing that such small harms were offset by all the “good fruits” the watchtower was doing.

This flawed reasoning collapsed after I read Raymond Franz’s books. It helped me understand that, in order of priority, one should first live with these values and then preach to others about it. Hence, preaching, building and organizing congregations are not “good fruits” in and of themselves. The Pharisees were doing the same things and Jesus called them out as hypocrites.

The fruits are how the members of that religion live their day to day lives. How they display love, charity, etc.

That is when I realized that such hypocrisy was very, very serious. I could not pass this down to my kids and I left.

9

Narcissistic Elders/Pioneers

by StephaneLaliberte in

today, while listening to a book that covered narcissism, i was a bit surprised to find a connexion with those “seeking privileges” in the organization.

while not being paid, pioneers, ministerial servants and elders invest a great level of time and effort in upholding their responsibilities.

fear of being destroyed by god for not doing enough.

StephaneLaliberte

Millie210: Interesting that you mentioned that the JWS are also a pedophile heaven; it crossed my mind when I wrote the post.

Even if the initial intent of the "organization" is not to attract narcissists and pedophiles, it is nonetheless a by product of their teachings when combined with their organizational structure.

9

Narcissistic Elders/Pioneers

by StephaneLaliberte in

today, while listening to a book that covered narcissism, i was a bit surprised to find a connexion with those “seeking privileges” in the organization.

while not being paid, pioneers, ministerial servants and elders invest a great level of time and effort in upholding their responsibilities.

fear of being destroyed by god for not doing enough.

StephaneLaliberte

Today, while listening to a book that covered narcissism, I was a bit surprised to find a connexion with those “seeking privileges” in the organization.

While not being paid, pioneers, ministerial servants and elders invest a great level of time and effort in upholding their responsibilities. Why?

Fear of being destroyed by God for not doing enough

Some brothers or sisters have the energy to do more and so, will take on responsibilities. Not out of their own good will; rather; by fear of being punished by God should he find that they were not doing enough. Overtime, as people grow older and loose that “extra” energy, they will quickly release themselves of these responsibilities, no longer burdened by a guilty conscience.

A genuine altruistic disposition

These are people who know they can help their peers and do everything they can to help. They believe that their actions can bring benefit to the lives of others around them. They will give their best, often at their own expense and as long as they can, often demonstrating extraordinary resilience in their tasks. Altruism is a powerful motivation.

A strong desire to be recognized by others and have power over them.

These are people that are fueled by the attention they get; it becomes their source of energy. Hence, if demonstrating extraordinary resilience results in being recognized as perhaps assist in climbing the organization’s hierarchy, they will. While they might appear helpful to others, this is usually for selfish reasons.

Considering the amount of work and time required to fulfill their responsibilities, we should agree that this requires “extraordinary resilience”. For such a motivation to keep hold, there is only two reasons: Altruism or Narcissism. While selfless altruistic individuals can be found out there, they certainly are hard to find.

So, let’s run some numbers with a simple congregation. 80 publishers with 3 elders, 2 ministerial servants and 3 pioneers. Now, let’s take away the kids, the single parents, the sick/old/handicapped and those who are, for lack of better terms, “limited”. This brings the potential adults to 30.

This means that the JWs expect to find one extraordinarily altruistic for every 4 healthy adults. If such ratio is accurate, could we still call them “extraordinary”

Of course not. This is why you end up with so many Narcissistic people in charge. There is simply too many positions to fill against the pool of possible candidates.

16

I attended my JWs Grandfathers funeral

by joe134cd in

i attended my grandfathers jw funeral the other day.

firstly i am a rabid apostate, and certainly not wt greatest fan.

that been said however, i will certainly stick up for them when they do the right thing.

StephaneLaliberte

Is this change going on world wide or was this just a one off example.

It largely depends on the congregation. Most will follow the funeral guidline which invites the brothers to limit the personal experience and focus on the spiritual aspect of things. I'd say that in average, I have seen about 20% personal, 80% religious preaching.

There has also been two instances at which a member of the family steped up on the platform, without being invited, and started to talk about their father/mother. This shows that some family members were shocked by the lack of personal content and decided to take the matter in their own hands.

As for me, should I need to prepare my parents funeral, I will make sure to host a small catering event where friends and family will be invited to talk about them. I will not rely on the JW talk.

16

I attended my JWs Grandfathers funeral

by joe134cd in

i attended my grandfathers jw funeral the other day.

firstly i am a rabid apostate, and certainly not wt greatest fan.

that been said however, i will certainly stick up for them when they do the right thing.

StephaneLaliberte

joe134cd: I am glad you could attend such a funeral. While this is certainly not the experience shared by the majority, I can only rejoice for you and your family in that everything went well and that you could find comfort.

It doesn't happen often, but when JWs do things right, we can certainly appreciate the moment without going out of our ways to find what was or could have been wrong.

While this was certainly a sad event, it is now, odly a good memory during which things went well. We can all rejoice in that.

19

latest WT, advice for Bible Studies

by neat blue dog in

our goal is to help our bible student to grow spiritually.. .

as his love for jehovah grows, however, he will likely begin to think about how he can help others, including those who are already part of the congregation.

(matt.

StephaneLaliberte

Quite frankly, I don't have any issues with the watchtower asking for monney. How else is an organization supposed to survive without an income stream?

The problem is not about asking for monney, its about HOW THEY SPEND the monney.

They are far from being transparent financially
child abuse pay offs and fines,
they don't support aging bethelites properly
create large bethels that are not really needed
sell kindgom halls for profit
don't participate enough in charity
spend large sums of monney on propagenda
etc.

13

Ever Wondered What People Think of Not-at-home Letters and Obit Letters?

by blondie in

jw
friends

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/thefreethinker/2019/10/op-ed-intruders/.

here are some excerpts of a man who was called on by 2 young female jws, received a not-at-home letter as well, and what he thought about them.

i encourage you to read the whole thing, it is worth the laugh.. "it wasn’t pompeo knocking but he would have beamed approval on the two young women on the doorstep.

StephaneLaliberte

I frankly never really cared about the content of the letters I was sending, all that mattered was the time I was reporting for it and I felt it was much better then door to door ministry. Nothing was easier to "start your time" then writting up a small letter.

Then came the computers. Dispite my best effort, my conscience didn't justify spending soo much time on letters. Some would write custom messages and others would write them by hand saying it felt more personal, but I never bought into this. So, I stopped sending letters then.

12

Jw`s know where you live , You now need to know where they live .

by smiddy3 in

jw
friends

they come uninvited to your door step and try to discuss bible/wt doctrines with you, and many times or on occasion you do so.. you may even exchange first names with each other , and that is fine if you are happy with that but do you know where they live ?.

but they have an advantage over you .they know your name and where you live .!.

you may know there first name but you don`t know where they live .that is the advantage they have over you.. does it really matter ?

StephaneLaliberte

someone once asked me for my home address. I think it happened only once. My answer:

Well, if you engage in door to door ministry, you will eventually find it in the same way I just found yours.

Not a word for word account; that happened like 25 years ago. I don't remember the rest of the conversation, but I remember the answer I gave cause I bragged about it for years.